by Sushi for The Saker Blog
Introduction
On April 14 the Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov revealed an OPCW laboratory had detected the presence of the Chemical Warfare Agent (CWA) named BZ in samples collected by the OPCW technical team in Salisbury England during the period March 21 to 23.
Those with an interest in the Skripal affair are attempting to re-frame the issues and determine: 1) the nature of BZ; 3) the credibility of the BZ finding; 3) the implications of this finding with respect to the curious incident of the Skripals.
The BZ revelation is of less importance than another factor in this case. This other factor gives strong evidence of the Skripal assault being a staged event.
Before we address that point, it is important to ensure an agreed understanding of the facts. This article attempts a factual presentation of the issues so the reader may better appreciate the most critical. The presentation is intended to permit critique by readers. Such feedback is a fundamental aspect of the scientific method. You make a public claim and your peers then offer their critique. The result permits all participants to benefit from: 1) A set of agreed facts; 2) Identification of facts in dispute which require further investigation.
The article commences with a review of naming conventions. This is followed by a basic description of how a nerve agent works, a listing of case theories, and a presentation of critical evidence.
Naming Convention
What can be said at all can be said clearly and what we cannot talk about we must pass over in silence. Everything in our world has a name. Because it has a name we can speak of it with some assurance. If the name is foreign to us, or the name is applied incorrectly, we create great difficulties for ourselves. If the name has no valid external referent we quickly become confused.
The chemical warfare agent BUZZ is a case in point. In the US military it was first known as EA2277 then as agent TK before being assigned the NATO code BZ. The USSR called the same compound Substance 78 while the Iraqi military called it Agent 15. The best identifier is the chemical formula C21H23NO3, or the name 1-azabicyclo[2.2.2]octan-3-yl hydroxy(diphenyl)acetate.
Novichok, or Novichkov, is even more difficult to identify.
Novichok is like a unicorn ghost. Everyone knows what a unicorn ghost is but no one has any actual experience of one beyond viewing a picture in a book. Novichok frightens people. With its Slavic connotations it may be used to falsely attribute a place of origin, be employed as the basis of a deception program, or even form a plot element in a television show.
Only three people are known to have first-hand knowledge of novichok: Vil Mirzayanov, Vladimir Uglev and Leonard Rink. All three were engaged in Soviet CWA research undertaken under the codename FOLIANT. According to Uglev this research developed four next generation nerve agents: A-1972, B-1976, C-1976, and D-1980.
Mirzayanov published a book on these agents but used a different naming convention which is found in Table 2 of Part II. Mirzayanov asserted that one aspect of FOLIANT was a subsidiary research program named NOVICHOK. This sought to create binary versions of the CWA developed under FOLIANT. Uglev claims this attempt was unsuccessful (but see this Washington Post story). Uglev also asserts Mirzayanov was not a member of the actual research team but was part of an external counter-intelligence group which monitored the research. Uglev asserts Mirzayanov gives a lot of chemical formulas but “If you take a formula from that [Mirzayanov’s] book you could conduct screening for several years.” Asked about Mirzayanov’s claims, Gen. Stanislav Petrov, commander of Russia’s radiation, chemical and biological defense troops, said, “These ghosts, we don’t even want to chase them.”
In 2016 Iranian researchers synthesized CWA similar to those first synthesized in the FOLIANT program. These CWA give evidence of being unstable compounds. The chemical structure of the molecule is prone to fragmentation. This is a key point. It implies that these chemicals will decompose relatively quickly and will not long remain in the environment in their pure form.
The Iranian materials were all O-alkyl N-[bis(dimethylamino)methylidene]-P-methylphosphonamidate compounds (i.e. molecules with the typical nerve agent phosphorus group coupled to N,N,N’N’-tetramethylguanidine). This is a technical description of the molecules in the CWA the UK government alleges to have been used to poison the Skripals on a park bench in Salisbury. Foreign Secretary Boris Johnson identified this Skripal poison as A-234 in a March 12 meeting with the Russian Ambassador to Great Britain and Northern Ireland.
The Iranian synthesis sought to duplicate the original Soviet research so as to obtain characteristic spectra to be incorporated into the OPCW database of CWA. Because of the fugitive nature of these molecules, and the lack of authoritative descriptions of the Soviet FOLIANT CWA, it is not possible to assert that these Iranian compounds are identical to those developed by the FOLIANT program. Uglev has refused to divulge his knowledge of the formulae.
All of this is to say that there are a large number of ghost unicorns at play in these events. These ghost unicorns work to the advantage of any party with an interest in creating a deception program as it allows them to define reality in a way that suits their political agenda while at the same time making it extremely difficult to refute any allegations made.
CWA Mode of Action
This is a vastly oversimplified presentation of how your eyes are able to follow this line of text.
The human body depends on a complex system of bio-chemical signalling. Muscular motor neuron signalling depends on the neurotransmitter Acetylcholine (ACh). The diagram below is an image of a synapse which forms the connection between a neuron (a signalling pathway) and the muscle which controls eye movement. The ACh jumps the gap and provides a chemical signal to the muscle which then contracts, causing your eye to traverse within its socket.
A second chemical, the enzyme acetylcholinesterase (ACHE), then breaks down the ACh and interrupts the signalling. Proper bodily function depends on a continuous supply of the ACHE enzyme. Certain CWA act to interfere with the actions of these chemicals. Organophosphate toxins (such as VX and a variety of pesticides and herbicides) inhibit the production of ACHE and result in an excess of ACh. The result is that the motor neurons are constantly triggered and there is no opportunity for muscles to relax. Since breathing depends on repeated muscle contractions (exhalation via contraction of the diaphragm) and the subsequent muscle relaxation (inhalation via relaxation of the diaphragm) the ultimate consequence is death by asphyxiation.
If the synapses are constantly triggered, the ACh receptors can “age” such that when the CWA is finally excreted from the body the synapse will no longer function as it did in its prior healthy state. This is the basis for the assertion that the FOLIANT CWA have no available antidote and no possible means of recovery. Once poisoned, the receptors are permanently damaged and you never regain a healthy state. The victim remains in a coma and requires constant life support.
The CWA BZ operates in a very different manner. Rather than suppress ACHE, BZ works by outcompeting ACh when targeting the same receptors thus causing the synapses to constantly fire in a random fashion. You stay alive but you temporarily lose control of your body. Affected individuals are prone to self-injury and paranoia and mania are common effects.
BZ proved unattractive to the US military. Field application resulted in a visible white cloud and improvised masks made from layers of cloth held over the nose and mouth could defeat it. To cover a six square mile target required the application of 100,000 pounds of BZ at a production cost in 2018 dollars of $163 per pound. This does not include the cost of the number of aircraft sorties required to apply the agent, or the cost of storing the agent, or the transport costs of moving it to the place of use.
BZ acts in a way similar to Atropine which is common field antidote for organophosphate poisoning. It is therefore possible that the trace evidence of BZ may be due to its use as a medical therapy in treating the Skripals. Such use is conjecture but it does provide a valid reason for its presence in the bio-physical samples. Since BZ is a persistent chemical, its presence in environmental samples from the scene of the attack would suggest it played some role in the attack.
Theories of the Crime
The following section seeks to identify the various theories surrounding the attack on the Skripals. The reader is invited to review the listing and enter any missing elements in the comments. Any additional elements will then be incorporated into a revised presentation.
Thesis 1 – No Poisoning
The Skripals are acting in collusion with elements of HMG to create a staged incident that may be used to provoke Russia, or to incite the population of the UK against Russia.
Factors in Support of this Thesis
1.1 Simultaneity of effects onset
1.2 Controlled, or doctored, communications
1.3 Denial of Consular access
1.4 Denial of press access
1.5 Consultant letter to the Times (asserts no evidence of poisoning)
1.6 Financial incentive in paid relocation to US and lifetime pension
1.7 Few other affected individuals
1.8 Lack of decontamination concern
1.9 Legal irregularities (the Court not informed of relatives in Russia, habeas corpus)
1.10 Destruction of evidence
1.11 Repeated mendacity on the part of HMG government
1.12 Other unique factor not listed
Counterfactuals
101 presence of chemical warfare toxins
102 statements from 8 independent witnesses
103 Other factor not listed
Thesis 2 – Accidental Saxitoxin Poisoning
The Skripals eat a meal of seafood and are incapacitated by saxitoxin poisioning.
Factors in Support of this Thesis
2.1 Simultaneity of effects onset
2.2 Consumption of mussels at Zizzi
2.3 Consultant letter to the Times (asserts no evidence of CWA poisoning)
2.4 No member of the public observed an attack
2.5 Pets die of starvation
2.6 Other unique factor not listed
Counterfactuals
101 Alleged presence of CWA at residence, Zizzi and Bishop’s Mill Pub
201 DS Bailey alleged to have been affected
202 Other factor not listed
Thesis 3 – CWA Poisoning (Novichok A-234)
Skripals are assaulted between departure from Zizzi and discovery on park bench
Factors in Support of this Thesis
3.1 statements of 8 independent witnesses
3.2 DS Bailey alleged to have been affected
3.3 Other factor not listed
Counterfactuals
301 Simultaneity of onset
302 Presence of pure A-234 (see next section on critical factors)
303 Effect discrepancy – lethal toxin but no fatality
304 Lack of decontamination concern
305 No other affected individuals
306 HMG false and misleading statements
307 Doorknob not credible mode of application
306 Starvation of pets
307 No evidence of CWA to explain delayed onset of effects
308 Speed of HMG response – Johnson implicating Russia on March 6
309 No graveyard attack – perfect secluded location
310 No CCTV images, no perp description
311 8 witnesses yet none saw the attack
312 Efforts to incriminate Russia despite lack of evidence
313 Destruction of evidence
314 Immediate response of DS Bailey
315 Improbable GCHQ Mount Troodos intercept
316 No plausible mode of application
317 Evident political agenda
318 HMG rejection of rational approach, accusations of disloyalty
319 Continual mendacity of the type developed at Eton
320 Other factor not listed
Critical Factor
If A-234 was used in the attack, and is the agent found applied to the doorknob, then HMG must explain how such a highly fugacious chemical remained on the doorknob despite an extended period of exposure to the elements.
If the A-234 was found on the interior doorknob, then HMG must explain how it is that three household pets survived a highly toxic atmosphere and died of starvation and thirst rather than being poisoned by the toxic fumes of A-234.
The reason given for the death by starvation was that investigators were unable to enter the house due to the presence of a toxic atmosphere. Given the appreciable difference in body mass between an adult human being and a Guinea pig, the two pets should both have died from exposure to a toxic atmosphere not from starvation.
The house is a crime scene and the attack on the Skripals is a criminal offense. Cremating the pets frustrates the intent and purpose of the police investigation and constitutes an obstruction of justice.
Given the high volatility of A-234 no residual trace evidence of this substance should have been present at the time the OPCW technical team collected its environmental samples. The toxicity of this CWA, coupled with its volatile and fugacious nature, was the primary reason for its use as a warfare agent as it left no observable trace and frustrated all methods of detection.
The fact that the public version of the OPCW makes reference to the “high purity” of the sample and “the almost complete absence of impurities,” strongly suggests that this substance was a recently placed laboratory grade material and that it was deposited in select locations after the March 4 attack and immediately before the arrival of the OPCW technical team.
The fact the OPCW saw fit to make repeated mention of the “high purity” and “almost complete absence of impurities,” supports this thesis.
That “the Swiss specialists discovered strong concentration of traces of the nerve agent of A-234 type in its initial states,” is also supportive of this thesis. [emphasis added in bold to the original]
–– ∞ ––
Prior articles in this series:
https://10.16.86.131/a-curious-incident/
https://10.16.86.131/a-curious-incident-part-ii/
https://10.16.86.131/a-curious-incident-part-iii/
https://10.16.86.131/a-curious-incident-part-iv/
https://10.16.86.131/a-curious-incident-part-v/
https://10.16.86.131/a-curious-incident-part-vi/
https://10.16.86.131/a-curious-incident-part-vii/
https://10.16.86.131/a-curious-incident-part-viii/
https://10.16.86.131/a-curious-incident-part-ix/
–– ∞ ––
Many persons commenting on the Saker blog, and in information sources other than the MSM, have made statement similar to the following:
While scanning for news that morning I noticed that all of the MSM had basically the same text to describe the event, but in a few cases different headlines, mainly dependent on which side of the Pond they came from. I skipped them, they seemed too coordinated.
This lack of critical coverage on the part of the MSM reduces your ability to come to your own conclusions with respect to the truth. This is a critical issue both with respect to an understanding of this Curious Incident, and to the proper functioning of any democratic polity.
The Saker does not tell me what to write. But he is generous enough, and sufficiently concerned over the current state of geo-strategic chess, that he makes these, and other articles, freely available to a global audience. I see he is presently making an appeal for donations to help defray the cost of hosting the site. I am paid nothing, but I do have an IT background and IT is not inexpensive. I ask that if you find this series informative that you support the site.
The Saker has not asked me to make this request.
In memory of David Christopher Kelly, CMG (14 May 1944 – 17 July 2003)
Of note BZ was notoriously tested on US soldiers:
“Clinical studies with EA-2277 (the code number for BZ) were initiated at Edgewood Arsenal in 1959 and continued until 1975. During this period an estimated twenty-eight hundred soldiers were exposed to the superhallucinogen. A number of military personnel have since come forward claiming that they were never the same after their encounter with BZ. ”
http://www.levity.com/aciddreams/samples/bz.html
That Swiss lab really threw a wrench into the works with that BZ finding, didn’t it.
There is now a 4th theory with the find of BZ.
The skripals we’re contaminated with BZ by the uk, us or israeli security services. A novichok related substance was then later sprinkled around and used to spike samples.
A BZ thesis needs to be added.
Or use of BZ is an aspect of Thesis #1??
The Skripals are made an offer of relocation and financial security if they “play along” with a covert plan. They agree, Yulia flies out from Moscow to participate, they have a nice meal, sit on a bench and inhale a “safe” intoxicant (at least that is what they are told). Either they inhale too much or they get it just right and they are carted off as overdose victims.
Once in hospital the intelligence services take over, the consultant reports no CWA poisoning as the event remains an overdose of recreational drugs, the “victims” recover after 4 days, Yulia checks her social media account and later phones home using a phone borrowed from, or supplied by, a sympathetic nurse or physician upset over the obvious deception.
The initial blood samples are tampered with en route to DSTL Porton Down which detects A-234 but HMG oversteps its remit in making attribution to RF. Which attribution was not a problem until the agreement to involve the OPCW at which point DSTL had to rollback its prior statement lest it look very foolish. This also caused HMG to need to create a “plausible” method of toxic agent application which was solved with the doorknob except they forgot about the Guinea pigs and had to quickly cremate them. HMG concocted a nonsense story about an RAF Fl Lt who reviewed 200,000 encrypted digital communications and plucked out one referring to a package delivery which was a clear communication by a GRU agent to his drycleaner’s shirt delivery but concealed an attempt to murder the Skripals.
In the next episode of the television serial Storm over the Palace of Westminister we see how things turn out.
Did I miss anything?
I think it unlikely the skripals were willing volunteers, unless severely mislead about the possible permanent effects of BZ poisoning.
After waking, they could have been debriefed on how the evil Russians tried to kill them. On of the lingering effects of BZ is it makes the victim more susceptible to suggestion.
Also, they could not have gotten doused on the bench, but between 30 minutes and 8 hours prior, as this is the time it takes BZ to take effect.
We don’t actually have any evidence that the Skirpals were actually poisoned by anything.
All we have in almost all parts of this are claims from the UK government.
And it appears highly likely that the UK government is simply lying, quite possibly about everything related to this incident.
14.04.2018
Embassy Press Officer comments on the findings of the Swiss experts regarding the Salisbury incident
https://www.rusemb.org.uk/fnapr/6486
“Q. Is there any new information regarding the findings of experts from Switzerland in connection with the Salisbury poisoning?
A. According to information from the Swiss Federal Institute for NBC-protection in Spiez, its experts received samples collected in Salisbury by the OPCW specialists and finished testing them on 27 March.
The experts of the Institute discovered traces of toxic chemical called “BZ” and its precursors. It is a Schedule 2 substance under the Chemical Weapons Convention.
“BZ” is a chemical agent, which is used to temporary incapacitate people. The desired psychotoxic effect is reached in 30-60 minutes after application of the agent and lasts up to four days. According to the information the Russian Federation possesses, this agent was used in the armed forces of the USA, United Kingdom and several others NATO member states. No stocks of such substance ever existed either in the Soviet Union or in the Russian Federation.
In addition, the Swiss specialists discovered strong concentration of traces of the nerve agent of A-234 type in its initial states as well as its decomposition products.
In view of the experts, such concentration of the A-234 agent would result in inevitable fatal outcome of its administration. Moreover, considering its high volatility, the detection of this substance in its initial state (pure form and high concentration) is extremely suspicious as the samples have been taken several weeks since the poisoning.
It looks highly likely that the “BZ” nerve agent was used in Salisbury. The fact that Yulia Skripal and Detective Sergeant Nick Bailey have already been discharged from hospital, and Sergei Skripal is on his way to recovery, only supports such conclusion.
All this information was not mentioned in the final OPCW report at all.
Considering the above, we have numerous serious questions to all interested parties, including the OPCW.”
That statement on the part of RF embassy is good to see as it confirms my own supposition as recorded in Part X.
It is always nice to go out on a limb and then discover the rest of the world supports the finding rather than sawing off the limb :-)
Hi Sushi,
I feel I must say your posts are very informative. Great work.
Do you not marvel how nature (in this case humans) have evolved in such a miraculous way – as per diagram above.
Regards
Nice to be appreciated. Thanks
But I believe the big take-away from this event is the fact that the state is no longer held in check by the MSM. This means that the ordinary citizen is paying for an entity which is actively acting to subvert the interests of the citizenry. This is very dangerous.
These articles each get about 10,000 page views. This is a drop in the bucket in comparison to the total voting population of the UK, or France, or FRG or US or CA. If you believe this information is valuable then you should share it. You do not have to agree with all that I have written. It is quite possible I have made errors, drawn incorrect conclusions from the evidence etc, etc.
The key issue is that the MSM is not engaged in a review of an incident which, on any degree of review fails on the merits and is quickly exposed as false, deceptive and grounds for vilification of another state which I believe to be innocent of the allegations made against it. If I could find evidence of RF involvement I would gladly write that. But I cannot locate any such evidence.
This event is likely to be used to further justify illegal use of force in Syria. If the public comes to the belief that “Bad Vlad” is pulling all the strings then they will accept the march toward global war.
The problem is that the person really pulling all the strings is located at Number 10. If bad things happen they have a taxpayer financed bunker to retreat to. The ordinary citizen is not even assured of a working NHS.
So if you find this series of value then address it with your family and other contacts.
Cheers!
It appears to me that addressing this information to family and friends is a good way to get ostracized. I decided to post some items debunking the CW canard against Syria and Russia on my personal facebook page, and while some see what’s going on, the vast majority not only do not, but vehemently deny it. I am just a conspiracy nut.
I see very little hope for US society when both a liberal democrat and a conservative republican adopt the attitude of dismissal and disparagement. “You are way beyond bringing back from your crazy conspiracy theories”.
I also posted a Youtube video which documents the well known collaboration of the Senior Bush, grandfather of Dubya and father to George ‘Poppy’ Bush on Facebook and it got taken down for violating Facebook’s community standards.
Which puts Zuckerberg, of Jewish heritage, in a position of suppressing the well documented role of Nazi and US elite collaboration. I sent them an article from the Guardian, no less, that basically stated the content of the video. It will be interesting to see if a mainstream newspaper is also seen as violating community standards.
The conclusion being that even if you put the truth right in front of people, it will be voided rather than their objectively appraising it. This probably applies to at least 80% of the population, which makes a prognosis quite bleak.
If BZ was detected and assuming it is not a false positive then surely BZ figured in the event, and less likely Skripal(s) complicit in hoax or at least deceived as to the script?
That is to say such an obscure chemical agent, if found on all three victims. i.e.blood test, would indicate this was likely used as a knockout agent?
That the event was staged at least post-poisoning (if the saxitoxin mussels scenario is allowed) seems very clear from lab evidence so far -the ultra- pure undegraded ‘Novichok’ nerve agent was applied for OPCW to find weeks later.
The only other bizarre possibility is that in addition to the staged event, Skripal senior was dabbling with nerve agent smuggling or Porton Down/MI6 visitors had minute trace amounts of either Novichok or BZ on their clothing and contributed to cross-contaminaton.
Hi Sushi,
BZ acts in a way similar to Atropine which is common field antidote for organophosphate poisoning. It is therefore possible that the trace evidence of BZ may be due to its use as a medical therapy in treating the Skripals.
I’m curious as to why you’ve not considered BZ as the agent used in the Skripal saga but instead consider that its presence in the samples analysed by the Swiss can be due to its use in the treatment of the victims.
BZ may well have been the weapon. I say this because (1) the clinical picture of incapacitation and apparent complete recovery fits BZ rather than A234/novichok, and (2) like you say, atropine is a common field antidote for organophosphate poisoning. I doubt Salisbury District Hospital even stocks or uses BZ for organophosphate poisoning rather than atropine for the simple reason that unlike atropine, BZ needs very careful handling, something that makes it difficult to use in an emergency room setting.
The use of a *different* agent is very significant in the Skripal case because that will destroy the British argument that an attack with a military grade nerve agent namely A234/Novichok took place. And that is why Sergei Lavrov mentioned BZ in his comments.
Like vot tak says, the Swiss have thrown a spanner in the works…
basil
There are a lot of spanners in the works.
There seem to be a variety of possibilities
1) An attack with BZ to incapacitate followed by adulterated blood samples to implicate Soviets
2) An attack with A-234 with BZ used as a later medical therapy ( a poster on the Moon of Alabama blog states this is unlikely as any such use would result in the loss of a medical license) . This conforms most closely with the alleged scenario.
3) An attack cocktail of A-234 and BZ. Enough BZ to incapacitate and sufficient A-234 to create evidence of use but not enough to be fatal.
4) Some other sequence or some kind of operational error.
“1) An attack with BZ to incapacitate followed by adulterated blood samples to implicate Soviets “
to implicate Russia
“implicate Soviets”
Freudian slip? :-D
“It is therefore possible that the trace evidence of BZ may be due to its use as a medical therapy in treating the Skripals. Such use is conjecture but it does provide a valid reason for its presence in the bio-physical samples.”
Any evidence of this sort of usage of BZ. If so, how about a link or links to sources.
Sushi,
With respect, I’m not sure you responded as well as you might to SEA’s question. Why suppose BZ was used as a medical intervention rather than being an attack (or simulated attack) vector?
But if it was used in a real or staged attack, what I gather from your presentation is that a full recovery within days is not something that could be assumed. Some have never recovered entirely, or so they report (dosage, frequency, exact formulations unknown).
Paul
Basically I am surprised at the BZ finding and attempting to integrate that information with what is known about the case.
BZ incapacitation appears to fit with what is known of DS Bailey. He recovered after 4 days which is the expected recovery period following use of BZ. His press release included the observation that the event had a surreal quality which also fits with a BZ after-effect.
In thinking about what SEA said I was trying to think of a possible valid medical reason for the introduction and use of BZ as other than a mode of attack.
Of course it is important to establish the facts in a crime, especially the fact that the poison sample submitted by Her Majesty’s Government has turned out to be not a Russian Novichok but a UK/US BZ (British Zyklon?). However, not should not lose sight of the Special Relationship which has propelled Her Majesty’s Govt into 3 Resource Wars in 15 years: Cui Bono?
1. Saddam abandoned the US dollar as international currency, and his country’s bank was not owned by Rothschild. Hanged, his country devastated and now has a Rothschild bank.
2. Ghaddafi abandoned the US dollar as international currency and his country’s bank was not owned by Rothschild. Bayoneted, his country devastated and now has a Rothschild bank.
3. Assad abandoned the US dollar as international currency, his country’s bank is still not owned by Rothschild and — what is more — Syria will not accept Genetically Modified Organisms. His country has been relentlessly devastated for 7 years but Assad himself has neither been hanged nor bayoneted. (Shame! cry the Anglo-Zio-Capitalists).
“I care not who governs your country as long as I control your currency”. — Meyer Rothschild, British Financier.
Agreed.
At the present time Russia and China are moving toward the creation of a fiscal regime based on the Yuan. They have already commenced pricing energy in Yuan. Given that China is now the worlds major importer of energy the countries of the middle east will have an interest in repricing in Yuan. Such action will have significant negative impact on the dollar.
Such action also creates the basis for military conflict as the US seeks to retain its position as global hegemon with all the benefits that accrue from its issue of the global reserve currency.
Thank you.
A question if I may…is it clear that rhe hospital made the diagnosis-relevancy of the doctors letter to the Times- or it was Porton Down that told their diagnosis to the hospital….and if so ..how did the hospitall know what treatment to do unless their was advice from PD. Details of the treatment would be interesting…whether general medication to cover many types of poisening such as domestic or food poisening or drug then progressing to particular treatment..the synchronicity of PD being so close to the “event” enabling some sample collection in an effort to preserve its “purity”..staff from either place on hand to go between the two premises if that happened..cf with somewhat tardy civilian response re protection of public and police…later the army…..still leaves questions?
We are still forced to speculate about whether Skripals were ever the people on the bench, whether they were ever exposed, whether they survived the initial incident and whether they are now alive. If any of these issues have been misrepresented, then our interpretation of these lab reports may be significantly misdirected.
Thank you Sushi. I have the impression that you are the very first one to confront the big risk of misreading inside that important information. More than 48 hours and still no one knowing chemestry to really explain what the the stakes are. That deep work of making complicated stuff available to dummies like me is also, beside being investigative, what big journalism is supposed to be. Thanks to your help I have a better understanding of what SEA is telling us right now. He’s making a very good point in my view.
Julia Skripal was not jet investigated. (Dutch for Yulia)
A number of questions need to be asked.
1. Was she a secret agent ? What was her training if any?
2. Was she assisting her dad in his work as agent , and if yes was it willingly ?
3. Why was she included in the assault ?
To target Sergei the better place would have been the cemetery on his regular routine
4. Why didn’t they target them on a previous visit?
At this stage looking at thesis 1.
5. The link with the mysterious boyfriend and the probable relocation to the USA may present a motive for her
6. If so why did they allow the pets to starve?
a) Neglect or they are are accustomed to it in order to relocate?
7. How do they manipulate her cousin Victoria?
Maybe this could be used in chapter 11 and I believe you will add more questions to the investigation.
Thanks for this very good work . We need many works like this to fight with MSM.
https://sputniknews.com/analysis/201804161063597524-uk-novichok-associate-russia-weapons/
Interview with inspector overseeing destruction Russian chemicals
Excellent!
The no-poisoning scenario is by far the simplest, when we remember that the Skripals defected to Britain. They are Russian by birth but their current loyalty is to the British spy agencies. The whole thing is simply a staged play.
One tiny correction, which doesn’t affect your logic at all: The diaphragm contracts when inhaling and relaxes to exhale.
I knew I was doing it backwards.
Thanks for the confirmation “-)
How is it that in all of these alleged chemical attack incidents, there are people, cops etc standing around the alleged contaminated zone unaffected,mixing with personnel dressed in full CBRND suits without chemical decontamination kits on their waste that would be equipped with Attropine Injectors. This goes against CBRND theory – practice. A breach of CBRND defence protocol and goes against what i.e. Military personnel trained in CBRND defence are taught when carrying out practical training drills – exercises. Or we see alleged victims of sarin being treated by unprotected, unaffected rescuers inside the alleged contamination areas suffering from zero symptoms. Every alleged victim I have seen in all of the available media footage of i.e. The alleged Toxic Chemical or gas attacks victims, do not present with the classic symptoms a victim would suffer from having been exposed to such toxins. We know that exposure to sarin, a pin drop of sarin on the skin is deadly and will shut down the central nervous system pretty much within seconds resulting in vicious kerking, foaming at the mouth, urination and defaction, along with other immediate symptoms and cardiac arrest. The Sarin and or other chemicals will pretty much bind to everything it touches i.e. Clothing etc and will continue to contaminate anyone that comes into contact with it. None of the rescuers or the victims seem to go through a proper decontamination process and with the Skripal case, everyone around the site on and post alleged attack should have been marshalled through a decontamination station, where everything they were wearing, stripped from their bodies piece by piece until they are completely naked and fully decontaminated at each point with a part water and bleach solution. These decontamination stations have a number of showers that one has to go through, with the last shower one is naked dried off and then have a complete medical check at i.e. A Triage Tent to ensure they have been fully decontaminated and free from potential toxin or chemical exposure. We haven’t seen this CBRND defence protocol in any of the media, or i.e. Any legit decontamination process in safe areas near any of these alleged attack sites. So many things wrong with this i.e. The media footage of the incidents suggests no chemical or biological weapons or agents used.
Another possible thesis being that they poisoned themselves with a weak solution i.e. not enough to kill to gain what not sure..new identities..rather extreme but who knows
Bearing in mind that Mr. Skripal is a convicted traitor, we can presume that there are no depths to which he will not go. The starting point should be that not a word he says can be believed.
USSR took much better care of Kim Philby and Guy Burgess……..just what is wrong with Maybotia that she cannot look after people……..only Pablo Miller seems to be healthy
OPCW-accredited Swiss lab can ‘neither confirm nor deny’ BZ toxin was used in Skripal poisoning
https://www.rt.com/news/424278-opcw-spiez-lab-%D1%81omment/
“We cannot have any statement on that,” Andreas Bucher, Spiez Laboratory’s strategy and communications head, told TASS on Monday.
“We are contractually bound to the OPCW for confidentiality. So, the only institution that could confirm what Mr. Lavrov was saying is the OPCW. We cannot confirm or deny anything,” he added.
The Swiss state research center is controlled by the country’s Federal Office for Civil Protection and, ultimately, by the defense minister.
“OPCW does not disclose the identity of designated labs that contribute to OPCW activities. These labs are also bound by secrecy agreements. These arrangements exist to ensure the integrity of the analysis and results provided by the designated labs,” the statement added.
The OPCW office left unanswered other RT questions, including whether the probe carried out by the Spiez laboratory discovered any presence of the Novichok nerve agent or BZ in the sample provided to the lab by the OPCW.
“In this connection, we are asking the OPCW a question: Why was the information that would reflect conclusions of the experts from the laboratory in the city of Spiez omitted in the final report?”
The UK refused to answer a number of questions asked by Moscow about the Salisbury case, Lavrov noted, adding that Moscow, unlike its Western counterparts, would never keep vital information secret.
“Our colleagues are telling us they have some secret data, but say they cannot share it,” the minister said. “As you understand, we also have an opportunity to receive confidential information. And since this information concerns literally life-and-death issues, we will not keep this information secret,” he added.”
Putting aside verbal gymnastics they basically said it all. They would denied they found BZ if that was the case. What Lavrov said is true.
Yes, the most scary of all. If Lavrov info about Swiss report is 100% sure and yet so easily deniable, that’s the core of it : that Russia is nowhere close to “inforce the law” inside an institution they are a powerful part of. Excluded from the true content of it like a miserable contractant without the means to understand the small fonts parts in the paper before signing. So what’s the point of having brought in countries, like Syria for example? Maybe being so legalist and diplomatic is not that good.
Thesis One would seem to require lying by the OPCW, breaking the Hippocratic Oath by UK doctors, spiking of samples for analysis at least two time points and fiddling of ACE inhibitor data.
The thesis currently to be knocked down, if possible, should be:
1) Use of BZ to incapacitate Skripals for a few days, allied to Russophobic false flag nonsense about Novichoks.
A curious photo:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DawZiMxX0AILrbf.jpg
Ex-Spy Sergei Skripal Recovering, Not in Critical Condition – Hospital
https://sputniknews.com/europe/201804161063621516-sergei-skripal-recovering-salisbury-hospital/
As they the two diabolical hoax chem events are most definitely connected we can expect more soon as the vassals are keeping up the inflammatory negative propaganda barrage:
Proof of this is in the wording of this title:
Syria air strikes: Russia denies tampering with suspected chemical attack site
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-43783427
Therefore, it is of the utmost importance to reveal the truth in the Skripal case as soon as possible and before it becomes another in the long history of the ‘Kremlin did it’ vitriol.
One other conjecture to add to the list is that some rogue individual connected to either intelligence communities was able to obtain some near variant of the Novichok family, used BZ as the knockout, but that CIA/MI6 were able to intervene with the Novichok antidote from Porton Down as the Skripals were still considered some kind of asset. The rogue individual may have suffered from Skripal senior’s previous treachery or current chem warfare dealing. Far fetched, yes, but so is everything so far.
Here is the NIOSH report on QNB incapacitating agent, otherwise known as BZ:
https://www.cdc.gov/niosh/ershdb/EmergencyResponseCard_29750015.html
Symptoms of mild to moderate intoxication include elevated body temperature, dry mouth, dry skin, …flushing (redness) of skin, dilated pupils,…hallucinations, etc. Yet witness Jamie Paige described the Skripals as “foaming at the mouth”: http://www.bbc.com/news/av/uk-43296238/russian-spy-incident-what-we-know He also said that Serge vomited. Neither of these symptoms are listed for BZ. On the other hand, these are what we might expect from a real nerve agent. Over at South Front, we can even find videos of terrorist linked groups practicing simulated nerve gas poisoning using shaving cream applied to the mouths of children pretending to be victims. Was Paige a planted witness used to connect the Skripal poisoning to the Douma event? If so, what does this tell us about the first “witnesses” to this event, and others in the vicinity?
Sushi, thank you very much for what you do! Your articles on the Skripal topic are truly amazing.
BZ exposure is the best explanation for the presence of nerve agent markers in the blood, and the non-fatal symptoms exhibited by the Skripals and the police man.
BZ is a nerve agent with an usually high ratio of lethal dose to symptomatic dose (~400:1). That means the key symptoms of nerve agent poisoning can be induced by exposure to low levels of agent way below the levels needed to kill someone. That would protect the attacker as well as not immediately killing the victims.
There was no audited chain of custody for the first samples so traces on Novichok could have been introduced between the taking of the samples (presumably by a phlebotomist at the hospital) and its arrival at Porton Down.
The only publicly announced CCTV footage (from a private camera) showed the Skripals en route from Zizzis to the park bench where they were found. The footage also showed a blonde haired women leaving the shop(?) hosting the private CCTV camera some minutes after the Skripals and following the same route. There are claims that she appeared to be carrying a face mask. She was listed as a person of interest by the local police, but there was no followup once the presence of nerve agent was made public.
This was all before Bailey came down with symptoms. This poisoning was presumably an unexpected complicating event for those running the false flag. From local media sources, it appears that he drove himself to Salisbury hospital early Monday morning (5 March probably before 10:00 am some 18 hours after the attack). The hospital entrance and his car were subsequently sealed off and decontaminated. It would be interesting to know the temporal relationship between his arrival and the knowledge that a nerve agent was used.
The false flaggers were then presented with a problem of explaining Bailey’s delayed symptoms. The explanation would have to exclude the possibility of him being poisoned at the same time as the Skripals to avoid anyone regarding him as an eyewitness. An unidentified police officer turned up at the Skripal’s house (mentioned in local media) around 5pm on Sunday shortly after the attack. The seems to have provided the false flaggers with a plausible (to them) source of poisoning, namely the door handle.
How did Bailey actually become contaminated? He was described as an early emergency services responder (local media). If he was first on the scene, one plausible explanation is that he was exposed to low amounts of BZ aerosal as one of the Skripals vomitted in his presence. We know from the nature of BZ that even low levels are capable of inducing symptoms, probably slowly progressive at those exposure levels. Local media photos of the hazmat crews show them putting a pile of sawdust/fine sand onto the ground adjacent to the bench, then scooping it up and putting it into an impermeable container which was then sealed for disposal. This supports the vomitting hypothesis, which was also observed by later passers by.
My hypothesis for events: The Skripals were exposed to an aerosol spray of low dose BZ sprayed into their faces by an unknown person (possibly the blonde woman) whilst sitting at the bench. Bailey was unintentionally contaminated by a similar lower level aerosol of BZ as he attended the vomitting Skripal. The desired story of pure Novichok poisoning could not be explained unless Bailey received a higher dose at a later time from a source that the Skripals were plausibly in contact with – hence the door handle hypothesis. The door handle hypothesis would also allow the false flaggers to direct attention away from the possiblity that the Skripals were attacked at the bench. The trail of the attacker (clearly part of the false flag team) could then be closed off and covered up.
Bolton threatened to kill children of OPCW director:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=0AKL8VTrO4g&t=7s
I do not believe the Skripals acted in collusion. Why are they prohibited to appear publicly, to have any contact with friends? If they have to hide something somebody has to make sure, they dissapear. A new identity does not make sure, they will not communicate in future, but a new identity could help to cover their fate, unfortunately.
So it seems those wicked wicked Russians are playing fast and loose with novichoks
It now behooves the UK govt to release all the details and medical records of the Skripals and the improbably named Nick Bailey.
Public interest and safety trumps patient confidentiality .In fact their names need not be mentioned. But every govt in the world now needs all the available information to protect their citizens from rampant novichok attacks
Medical researchers have never before had the opportunity to study the data of an actual novichok poisoning.
The British govt, being such an upholder of all that is decent and noble in the world should now release every single detail of symptoms, blood tests, treatment , the daily recorded vital signs etc
You would think?
Im thinking now of the millions of air passengers around the world each day who have to remove their shoes to pass airport security. This measure was introduced a few years ago because of a single, thankfully unsuccessful incident, and none can envisage it ever going away.
Yet this alleged assassination attempt in Salisbury has had zero impact on security in any area. It simply doesn’t make sense.
Thanks for the link christo.
Some relevant info:
[quote]
QNB : Incapacitating Agent; Common Names: Agent Buzz, BZ, 3-Quinuclidinyl benzilate
APPEARANCE: White crystalline solid.
DESCRIPTION: QNB is an incapacitating agent and has been considered historically for use as a chemical warfare agent. A very potent drug, QNB causes confusion and hallucinations; it also affects circulation, digestion, salivation, sweating, and vision. Impairments caused by QNB are generally temporary and unlikely to be fatal; however, they can be severe if exposure is large enough.
METHODS OF DISSEMINATION:
Indoor Air: QNB can be released into indoor air as a fine powder or liquid spray (aerosol).
Water: QNB can be used to contaminate water.
Food: QNB can be used to contaminate food.
Outdoor Air: QNB can be released into outdoor air as a fine powder or liquid spray (aerosol).
Agricultural: If QNB is released into the air as a fine powder or liquid spray (aerosol), it has the potential to contaminate agricultural products.
TIME COURSE: Signs and symptoms of QNB toxicity are delayed but long lasting, regardless of route of exposure. The size of the dose and route of exposure to QNB determine time to onset, time to peak effect, time to recovery, and potency of toxic effect. Signs and symptoms generally begin between 30 minutes and 4 hours post-exposure. However, toxicity following skin exposure may be delayed in onset as long as 20 to 36 hours. Peak effect is 4 to 8 hours for most routes of exposure. Full recovery is expected after 3 to 4 days.”
INDIVIDUAL DECONTAMINATION: The following methods can be used to decontaminate an individual:
… Begin washing PPE of the first responder using soap and water solution and a soft brush. …
[unquote]
QNB aka BZ is looking more and more like the culprit to me.
(1) BZ/QNB gives the victim a dry mouth. ‘foaming at the mouth’ could be due to the Skripals’ regurgitating some of the food they had at Ziizzis and not excessive salivation.
(2) Delayed onset up to 20-36 hrs could explain Detective Bailey’s, well, delayed onset of symptoms.
(3) Advice given to the public regarding personal decontamination is the same as for BZ/QNB.
This is all speculation of course. It’s unlikely we’ll ever get to the truth what with incomplete and fractured information and the intense infowar going on. So I’ll just console myself with an observation made by the greatest detective who never lived (ahead of Poirot and Fandorin, IMHO), Sherlock Holmes: “How often have I said to you that when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth?” (italics in the original).
basil
Basil
The time element fits. The Skripals departed Zizzi sometime between 1414 and 1430. According to the time budget presented in Part IV it only takes 1.5 minutes to walk from the Zizzi front door to the bench location,
Another reader suggested they may have window shopped and I at first discounted this as the route through the arcade passed by an art gallery, a public library, a high end restaurant, a cafe, a hearing aid store and a 24h fitness centre.
But then I discovered the Salisbury has a network of charming pedestrian market “passageways” (too big for cars) and given that Yulia was visiting I can envisage a post meal stroll though this network of streets which puts them in the vicinity of the park bench at 1600 which is the time of the first witness sighting.
This would suggest the possibility of something being added to the meal or to the drinks.
The use of BZ also explains the other part of the puzzle which is the bored and disinterested decontamination teams and the use of inappropriate of incomplete decontamination protocol. My sense is the teams do not look like they are addressing the dangers posed by one of the more lethal toxins known to man. The do look as if they have been told to put on a public show and they are going through the motions.
The”foaming at the mouth” syndrome is obviously very important to the planners of this false flag. Watch this video from south front (second one down). It was necessary to make sure we heard about the Skripals foaming mouths in order to connect it to the shaving creamed kids. Dry mouth syndrome from BZ poisoning doesn’t sound compatible with foaming. https://southfront.org/how-msm-and-pro-militant-media-activists-lie-you-about-war-in-syria/
A truly curious incident. I’d go by the common sense rule that says:
No evidence = no case.
So far, all we are given is stories. We might just as well be watching a movie and arguing about it.
All the so-called evidence is dished out by the incident controllers who are beyond verification.
The method is like that of an interrogator feeding unverifiable stories to a person being kept in the dark to bait him into revealing real information.
The BZ report may be an action coordinated with the UK to send detractors on a ‘wild goose chase’.
The labs involved are not Russia-friendly, and likely less than Russia-neutral.
The only real-life element is the phone call. It could have been pulled off using duress, or voice-modification software. (It was kept very short, as if long-distance charges mattered.)
The case is like a religion. The believers profess a ‘high probability’ faith. The non-believers are given nothing, and are ignored as too profane to challenge the sacred.
I posted a comment in a Cafe about Yulia asking for help on her new twitter account (if it really is her making twits) with all twits translated in to English. She thinks they are making a vegetable out of her with pills. She is pleading for help.
/moveable-feast-cafe-2018-04-16/#comment-513042
Below is a copy/paste of a comment. I will leave it to a moderator to decide if it is redundant to repeat a comment here and delete that part.
Yulia on her new twitter account, if it really is hers and not someone joking or pretending, sent 15 twits yesterday saying that they are making a vegetable out of her with pills and asking for help.
I don’t know what to think.
First 5 twits are from 12th and 13th April. They have pictures of medical staff with twits “Thanks to these people!”, “My guardian angel.”.
In the next twit she says “# Zakharova is lying. This was my statement. Yes, I was helped by British representatives.“
Then she says ”Thanks to everyone who worries about me!”
Her last twit says “We are very quiet and not public people. What happened with my father was a shock to me and all of us.”
[with my father?, not what happened with us? Translation is with Google. Yandex translates the phrase ‘to my father’: “We are very quiet and not public people. What happened to my father was a shock to me and all of us.” ]
Then nothing for three days.
Yesterday afternoon and evening London time on April 16th she sent a series of 15 twits with a completely different tone desperately asking for help. All twits in her account except the very last one from yesterday are in Russian.
All caps are in original. Translated with Google.
“ME MAKE THE VEGETABLES IN THE GREAT BRITAIN !!!! HELP!!!! ”
“I’m in despair. I do not believe doctors. I think they want to make me a vegetable. “
“I wrote to everyone, no one can hear me! I have no way to get it! I’m going crazy!!! “
“It seemed to me that they saved me, but now I do not believe them! They make me a vegetable !!! “These blue pills destroy me !!! Force to drink !!! “
“They are kicking me !!! “ [Yandex: “They bring them to me!!!”]
“HELP ME!!! HELP ME HELP ME HELP ME HELP ME HELP “
“Cry !!! “ [Yandex says it could also be “Vika!!!” short for Victoria?]
“I lost my password from Vkontakte !!! “
“I’m like in a bunker !!! They stuff me with medicines !!! “
“They want me to lose my memory !!! Help me!!! “
“I’m as drunk after their pills !!! I do not believe them !!! “
“FOR WHAT?!?!?! “
“I KILL TABLETS !!!! I’m like a drunk !!!! HELP ME!!! “ [Yandex: “KILL ME PILLS!!!! I LIKE DRUNK!!!! SAVE ME!!!”]
“I’am being made a vegetable in Britain!!!! Help!!! #Skripal “ [This one is in English.]
https://twitter.com/skripalyulia
I thought she should have used a more contemporaneous picture of hers (if this is a true account), but then when signing up for Twitter the one used is from Google account, so possible she didn’t,
Weird.
I don’t know who created this Twitter account but the response to one of the initial tweets from another user giving Kazakhstan as their location might be a clue. Regardless, posting a nessage of gratitude with a photo of a Paediatric SRN from New South Wales, Australia is hardly military grade grade trolling.
Can you provide a link? Reverse image search doesn’t show anything for the photos of medical staff.
the tag on her id
so, it’s basically some fake crap
Thank you. So it is a fake account. Logo in the upper left corner of the nurse’s ID with the red flower and NSW initials is the same as a logo of New South Wales Government. ID says she is a paediatric nurse. A picture of a pony on ID implies the same.
https://www.nsw.gov.au/
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DalTKTMW4AAPzXj.jpg
Correction, ID says she is a registered nurse. A picture of a pony on her ID implies she is a paediatric nurse.
“UK’s Department for the Environment that the nerve agent that was used to poison ex-Russian spy Sergei Skripal and his daughter Yulia was delivered “in a liquid form,” following the news of the beginning of clean-up at the site of the alleged attack.
“Clean-up work is beginning in Salisbury after the appalling nerve agent attack, to bring a small number of potentially contaminated sites back into safe use for the people of the city and its visitors,” the statement of the UK Department for Environment, Food & Rural Affairs, Ministry of Defence, Defence Science and Technology Laboratory, Public Health England, Department of Health and Social Care, and Home Office read.
READ MORE: US, Allies Stage Skripal Case, Syrian Chemical Attack, Russia Sanctions — Moscow
The department said that a total of nine sites, three of which are in the city center, have been identified as requiring “some level of specialist cleaning.”
“Today (Tuesday 17 April) a small cordoned area of London Road cemetery was the first area to be reopened to the public after extensive investigations and testing established that it was not contaminated,” the statement added.”
9 yes 9 sites claimed were contaminated?????
How much “stuff” was being very riskily to the perpetrator put ….kinda everywhere…how can that be a targeted attack …..a few drops of something just to their home…much safer and a clearer message…if put on one spot…how the heck was there enough to spread to 9 sites without killing them instantly or anyone else…and explaining the delayed action ??????
Let’s try to list 9 possible sites. I can think of 9 if we split the cemetary.
1. Skripal house
2. & 3. Cemetery – 2 separate sites, one grave (wife), one memorial stone (son)
4. Sainsbury’s car park
5. The Mill pub
6. Zizzi restaurant
7. Park bench
8. Ambulances and the hospital area where they are kept
9. The vehicle rescue yard and tow truck
According to the Soviet era researchers the FOLIANT and NOVICHOK programs sought to develop a next-generation nerve agent that was not easily detectable by all known means.
One method of achieving that objective was the creation of a toxic yet highly unstable compound that would quickly deteriorate on exposure to the environment.
This implies that if Soviet era formulations were in fact used in Salisbury there should be little to none toxic residue to either be detected or cleaned up.
My understanding of BZ is that it is relatively persisent in the environment. Standard VX is persistent for a 2 to 3 day period but may be identified in soil samples past that date. An OP like Soman is known to penetrate paint so trace evidence may be obtained from wall paint chips well after the date of toxin application.
Ciitizens were known to be strolling past the site of the alleged attack within minutes of the Skripals were incapacitated yet no sign of being affected. If VX or similar agent was used this is highly unlikely. The same is true for the decontamination personnel who appeared very casual in there approach to a highly lethal toxin.
One gets the sense that the UK government case is falling apart and they are determined to reinforce it by means of “decontamination theatre.” or “See we were right this was really dangerous stuff. Look at all the time and effort being spent in cleaning it up. And no, we will not tell you what it is.”
can I ask for a bit of clarification.
1. UK originally said it was “novichok”
2. then said “A234”.
3. But novichok and A-234 are NOT synonyms.
4. A-234 is a known agent and non-binary.
5. novichok is still just a theoretical agent and BINARY.
6. the Iranian synthesis was of A-234-type non-binary agent
7. No one has ever synthesised a binary agent to date – that we know of.
Are these seven points correct?
Yes, except for point 7.
Binary CWA have been created. One of those is a binary version of VX created by the US.
A binary version of VX was used in the assassination of the brother-in-law of the Korean head of state.
The information on Soviet CWA programs is conflicting. Uglev claims no binary OP based weapons developed under the FOLIANT program. Myranazov claims binary OP based were developed with the first of those being being Novichok-5 which may or may not be an anlog of A-234.
My sense is that Uglev is more credible than Myranazov.
Thank you Sushi.
BZ vs. A-234: How Russia Exposed the Lie of UK Gov’t, Ripped British Version Up
https://sputniknews.com/europe/201804161063618876-uk-russia-bz/
“Sputnik contributor Irina Alksnis underscores in her op-ed that while many were confused by the fact that the British authorities openly lied while informing the public about the Skripal case, the OPCW’s maneuvers appears to be more inexplicable.
“The world has inherited from the Cold War era a system of international organizations which by their nature were designed to maintain balance and stability,” the journalist noted. “They were based on the principles of independence and objectivity, since it was the only way the two sides that didn’t trust each other could rely of their judgments and decisions.”
Although this system has existed nearly 30 years since the collapse of the USSR and the end of the Cold War, it appears that it is collapsing before the public’s very eyes, Alksnis remarked, citing the International Olympic Committee (IOC) decision to suspend Russian athletes acquitted by the Court of Arbitration for Sport (CAS) from the 2018 Winter Games.
Similarly, the United Nations’ “inability” to condemn sheer aggression on the part of the US-led coalition that attacked Syria on April 13 over an alleged use of chemical weapons in Douma, Eastern Ghouta, raises questions. Earlier, US Secretary of Defense Jim Mattis admitted that the US had no solid evidence that the supposed chemical attack was carried out by the Syrian Arab Army (SAA).
“Perhaps, the most ironic thing is that all these ‘suicidal’ steps made by the most respected and influential international organizations for the sake of the global hegemon [the US] come at a moment when the hegemon’s dominance is falling apart at the seams before the eyes of the whole world,” the journalist pointed out.
Speaking to Sputnik, Leonid Rink, one of the A234 creators, explained the main flaw in the OPCW report: “OPCW data saying that a toxic chemical of high purity was used proves that it was not Novichok…. Novichok is a complex nerve-paralyzing substance consisting of a mixture of many different components and additives that decompose in different ways. If a pure substance was found, it could not be Novichok,” the specialist said.”
‘Highly Likely’ There Was No Chem Attack in Salisbury – Ex-UN Commission Member
https://sputniknews.com/analysis/201804171063648815-skripal-chemical-attack-denial/
Russian Embassy Suspects Salisbury ‘Disinfection’ Meant for Evidence Destruction
https://sputniknews.com/europe/201804171063663957-salisbury-decontamination-russia-evidence-destruction/
UK Envoy Reportedly Says OPCW Labs Found No BZ Substance in Salisbury Samples
https://sputniknews.com/world/201804181063676656-opcw-laboratories-salisbury-bz-substance/
BZ Toxin Samples Has Nothing to Do With Salisbury Samples – OPCW Head
London is ready to give answers to all questions posed by Russia on the Skripal case, the UK’s Permanent Representative at the Organization for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons Peter Wilson stated.
“The precursor of BZ that is referred to in the public statements, commonly known as 3Q, was contained in the control sample prepared by the OPCW Lab in accordance with the existing quality control procedures. Otherwise it has nothing to do with the samples collected by the OPCW Team in Salisbury. This chemical was reported back to the OPCW by the two designated labs and the findings are duly reflected in the report,” head of the Organization for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons (OPCW) Ahmet Uzumcu said.
The OPCW research results have confirmed British experts’ analysis, the UK’s Permanent Representative at the Organization for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons Peter Wilson stated, speaking at the OPCW Executive Council Meeting.
“On April 13, the Russian Federation handed over to the UK a list with questions under Article 9 of the Convention on the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons. We will respond as soon as possible (this will happen) within 10 days, as established by the Convention (on the prohibition of chemical weapons),” Wilson said.
According to the UK Ambassador to the OPCW, four OPCW-designated laboratories did not find the substance BZ in any of the samples collected in Salisbury. Still, London and the OPCW research haven’t determined the nerve agent country of origin and production location, the UK Envoy noted.
https://sputniknews.com/world/201804181063676656-opcw-laboratories-salisbury-bz-substance/
Russian Delegation to OPCW: Induced Coma Was Used to Manipulate Skripals’ Health
Russian representatives to the OPCW expressed their opinion that former Russian spy Sergei Skripal and his daughter Yulia were put into the state of induced coma in order to manipulate their health. They also believe it was used to prevent access of the Russian experts to both victims.
“British medical workers, as we believe, have put Sergei and Yulia Skripal into induced coma state deliberately, which gave them opportunity to collect biological material and manipulate the state of their health, even without consulting with them,” the statement by the Russian delegation to the OPCW said.
Details To Follow
https://sputniknews.com/europe/201804181063682501-skripals-induced-coma-opcw/
“London is ready to give answers to all questions posed by Russia on the Skripal case, the UK’s Permanent Representative at the Organization for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons Peter Wilson stated.
“The precursor of BZ that is referred to in the public statements, commonly known as 3Q, was contained in the control sample prepared by the OPCW Lab in accordance with the existing quality control procedures. Otherwise it has nothing to do with the samples collected by the OPCW Team in Salisbury. This chemical was reported back to the OPCW by the two designated labs and the findings are duly reflected in the report,” head of the Organization for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons (OPCW) Ahmet Uzumcu said.”
I am getting confused in this language.
Hi JJ
A precursor chemical is a fancy way of saying the chemical was an ingedient used in the making of another compound. So the Swiss lab report was speaking of having found a chemical which is a component of BZ. This ingredient chemical is known at “3Q.”
The OPCW now seeks to excuse the Swiss finding by saying that prior to doing any tests the lab attempts to calibrate all of its instruments to a known chemical sample.
This calibration run was based on a test of the chemical 3Q whiich is itself a component part of the CWA BZ.
It is the fact of this calibration run that gave the appearance of BZ having been used in the assault against the Skripals. But this BZ finding should be discounted as it has nothing to do with the attack and was found or reported as it was part of the pre-test calibration sequence.
The calibration aspect has some validity. I do not know if 3Q would be used or if 3Q is in fact an ingredient to BZ. But performing an equipment validation test before the actual test is a normal proceedure.
What I think all this implies is that BZ was not used against the Skripals.
From my interpretation of the availble evidence I suspect this to be true. But if we dicount BZ we are back to the use of “pure” A-234 which is highly lethal and if used renders a victim unlikely to survive except in a coma in an artifical lung. So as another commenter (Paul??) said we really should harvest the genetic material of the Skripals as they have the abiility to recover from something expected to kill.
Of course there is a more conspiratorial interpretation which is that BZ was in fact used and the OPCW is now blowing smoke in the attempt to hide this fact.
Thanks for your trouble sushi for trying to get my head around it!
Hello again Sushi. First off, thanks for your work. It was rude of me not to thank you earlier and your replies are appreciated.
I believe BZ is the agent in the Skripal case, or rather, to put it in a better way, I believe A234 was not used. I’m not being obstinate; I have already given my reasons why and I think they are reasonable. So please don’t label me a conspiracy theorist ;D.
Here’s the relevant part of the latest DG’s statement on the OPCW site:
DG of OPCW: “The Organisation received the results of the sample analysis conducted by four
designated laboratories.
Marc-Michael Blum, Head of the OPCW Laboratory”…There was no other chemical that was identified by the Labs. The precursor of BZ that is referred to in the public statements, commonly known as 3Q, was contained in the control sample prepared by the OPCW Lab in accordance with the existing quality control
procedures. ”
“This chemical was reported back to the OPCW by the two designated labs and the
findings are duly reflected in the report.”
And at the end of it there’s a subtle message for member states to cough up money for a new lab ;)
I’m not running down the OPCW, but like Sergey Lavrov said, “we trust but we verify.” For a highly respected organisation, this is quite a sloppy summary by the OPCW, you will agree. The DG says 4 labs but head of the OPCW lab says 2. And, what in the world is 3Q?? Why can’t OPCW state the full chemical name in this public document and make it easier for the general public? After all, the OPCW DG is presumably talking to a roomful of chemists and I’m sure he can pronounce 3Q’s full name.
I’m not a chemist but I understand the need for labs to calibrate their fine and mighty expensive instruments with tests on control samples before working on the test sample/s. Is the use of 3Q, a precursor of an agent different from the one suspected, standard procedure in the in OPCW’s labs? Was it not possible to use a control substance that is similar to the substance suspected to be present in the test sample? I mean, why would I calibrate with milk, precursor of butter, when I suspect the substance is wasabi? I’d choose horse radish or something — if that’s possible, of course.
But maybe they have more experience with 3Q seeing that BZ was invented by a Swiss company. Or were they in fact lookingfor BZ? before the arm-twisiting. We’ve see this before. These guys in OPCW know the gross signs of BZ poisoning when they see it, I would expect. But I dunno.
Cheers. Looking forward to your next instalment.
basil
Sushi,
If, for sake of argument, we accept that BZ was not used then is it possible that US/Salisbury made ‘Novichok’ was used on the Skripals and an antidote absolutely immediately applied? That US patent applies to an antidote which implies two things, one, that however unlikely, the scenario just described could have occurred and, two, that in order to develop the antidote, Novichok had to have been created, likely in the UK Porton Down, USA or elsewhere such as Georgia or the Ukraine.
Perhaps some kind of additional knock out drug would be necessary? Would the Salisbury hospital’s doctor statement that no patients were suffering from nerve agent poisoning be still valid if the antidote was applied prior to hospital admission?
Britain admits OPCW did not confirm ‘essential evidence’ on origin of Skripal poison
https://www.rt.com/uk/424478-skripal-opcw-origin-poison/
Related:
Berezovsky acted with UK intel, paid with life when he decided to return home – Russian prosecutor
https://www.rt.com/uk/424450-berezovsky-uk-intelligence-death/
“Addressing lawmakers, Chaika claimed that Berezovsky was part of a conspiracy involving the British government to kill his confidante Aleksandr Litvinenko with radioactive polonium, which London used to accuse Russia of murder.
“The highest concentration of polonium was found in Berezovsky’s office, but Berezovsky could not get polonium on his own. Neither could he fabricate such a trace of evidence. He was acting under control of the British intelligence services, acted together with them,” the Russian official said.
“When he decided to return to Russia, they could not allow that a person with access to secrets about radioactive terrorism did it,” Chaika added.”
Russia Will not Recognize Skripal Probe Results Without Access to Case – Envoy
Details To Follow
https://sputniknews.com/world/201804181063687533-russia-opcw-envoy-results/
Chemical Agent in Skripal Case Produced in Western Labs, Expert Says
https://sputniknews.com/russia/201804191063702082-skripal-poison-western-produced/
“The head of Chemical and Biological Weapon Restrictive Conventions Analytical Research Center under the Ministry of Industry and Trade of the Russian Federation Viktor Kholstov said that the chemical agent in Skripal’s poisoning case has been produced in western laboratories.
“The issue of ‘Novichoks’ has gained widespread in a considerable number of western laboratories. It is fair to say that today there are at least 20 of such laboratories which undertake work related to ‘Novichoks’,” expert said. “It can be said with great certainty that the manufacture is somewhere at those laboratories,” he said in an intervew with the Russian Investigative Committee.”
Russia’s OPCW envoy exposes ‘eight UK lies’ in Skripal case
“We’ve tried to show that everything our British colleagues produce is a story woven with lies,” Russia’s permanent representative to the Organization for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons (OPCW) Aleksandr Shulgin told reporters on Wednesday, following the organization’s meeting on the Skripal case.
“And, unlike the British, who aren’t used to taking responsibility for their words and unfounded accusations, we showed specific facts why we believe our British partners, to put it mildly, are ‘deceiving’ everyone.” The official provided eight examples of UK-pushed misinformation, surrounding the March 4 events, when the former double agent Sergei Skripal and his daughter Yulia were poisoned in the town of Salisbury
#1. Russia refuses to answer UK ‘questions’
“In reality, they’ve asked us only two ‘questions’… And both were worded in such way that the existence of an undocumented arsenal of chemical weaponry at Russia’s disposal was presented as an established fact, beyond any doubt.”
It was effectively an ultimatum, pressing Moscow to either confess that it “attacked the UK with chemical weapons,” or to admit that it had “lost control over the chemical warfare arsenal.”
Moscow answered both of these ‘questions’ immediately, stating that it had nothing to do with the Salisbury incident. Apart from that, the official emphasized, it is an established fact that Russia destroyed all its chemical weaponry stockpile ahead of schedule last year.
#2. UK abides by Chemical Weapons Convention rulebook
The OPCW procedures clearly state that if one member state has issues with another, it should send an official request, and thus the other party would be obliged to respond within 10 days, Shulgin said. However, instead, the UK allegedly “instigated by their colleagues from across the pond,” disregarded the established mechanism and came up with a dubious “independent verification” scheme, which violates those very OPCW rules.
#3. Russia refuses to cooperate
While the UK and a number of its allies accuse Russia of “refusing to cooperate to establish the truth,” the situation is exactly the opposite, Shulgin insists. Moscow is interested in a thorough investigation of the incident – especially since the victims are Russian citizens. Moscow repeatedly insisted on a joint probe and urged London to release data on the Skripal case, but all efforts were in vain. Many requests went unanswered by the UK, while others received only a formal reply.
#4. Russia invents versions to distract attention
Despite numerous speculations and allegations by questionable sources, cited by the UK’s own domestic media, it was Moscow that was eventually accused of coming up with some “30 versions” of the Salisbury events, allegedly to “disrupt the investigation,” Shulgin said.
“In reality, the picture is different. In fact, it’s the British tabloids, the so-called independent media, which is multiplying those versions,” the official stated, recalling some of the narratives, most of which entirely contradict each other.
#5. Exterminating traitors is Russia’s official state policy
“They claim that the Russian leadership has, on multiple occasions, stated that extermination of traitors abroad is a state policy of Russia,” Shulgin said. “This is slander, of course. The British cannot produce a single example of such statements, since the Russian leadership has never said anything of the kind.”
#6. Experts pin the blame on Russia
The head of the OPCW mission has clearly said that it was impossible to determine in which country the toxic substance used in Salisbury had originated. Yet the OPCW findings were once again used by the UK officials to claim Moscow was “highly likely” responsible. “Look, the head said it was impossible and they, abandoning all common sense, said ‘They’ve confirmed our evaluations that it was Russia.’ How else can you evaluate this but as a lie?” Shulgin wondered.
#7. ‘Novichok’ is a Soviet invention, so it has to be Russia
The development of the so-called Novichok family of toxic agents more than 30 years ago in the Soviet Union was one of the main cornerstones in the UK narrative, pinning blame for the Skripal incident on Russia. Publicly available sources, however, indicate that “the West has been and still is conducting research and development into such substances,” Shulgin said, giving a fresh example of such activities.
“Not long ago, namely on 1 December 2015, the US Patent and Trademark Office filed a request to its Russian colleagues asking to check patentability … of a chemical weaponry-filled bullet, which could be equipped with Tabun, Sarin or the Novichok family of agents,” the official stated.
#8. Yulia Skripal avoids contact with relatives & refuses Russian consular support
While such a statement was indeed produced by the UK authorities “on behalf” of Yulia, Moscow believes it to be false. According to Shulgin, the situation with Yulia is starting to look like a Russian citizen is effectively being “held hostage” by the UK authorities.
https://www.rt.com/news/424537-russia-opcw-uk-skripal-lies/
Statement of A.Shulgin at the OPCW EC – P.R. OF RUSSIA TO THE OPCW
https://netherlands.mid.ru/en_GB/web/netherlands-en/-/statement-of-a-shulgin-at-the-opcw-ec
https://russia-insider.com/en/there-alternative-explanation-skripal-poisoning-and-it-makes-far-more-sense-official-story/ri23219
Hhmm…the possibility of “old novichok” because it degrades…being remnants of illegally obtained from scientist who kept some from the USSR lab……
THE HAGUE, April 18. /TASS/. Russia has submitted the proof that the Novichok agent was produced and patented in the United States as a chemical weapon in 2015, Russia’s Permanent Representative at the Organization for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons (OPCW) Alexander Shulgin said on Wednesday.
The Russian envoy made this statement during his speech at an emergency session of the OPCW Executive Council on the Salisbury incident.
“On December 1, 2015, the United States Patent and Trademark Office turned to the Russian agency in charge of patents with a request to check the patentability of the invention made by US researcher T. Rubin,” the envoy said, demonstrating the document.
READ ALSO
Lavrov: Impartial study finds NATO chemical weapons traces in toxin used on Skripals
“This document confirms that nerve agents like Novichok were not only produced but were even patented as a chemical weapon in the United States. And this is not an old story, this happened just several years ago: the patent is dated December 1, 2015,” the envoy said.
“This document talks about the invention of a special bullet, the distinctive feature of which is that it has a separate cavity for equipping it with different kinds of toxic agents. When using the mentioned invention, the lethal effect is achieved due to the effect of this toxic agent on the human body. In other words, this ammunition falls under the jurisdiction of the CWC,” he went on to say.
“The principle of operation of the bullet consists in equipping it with binary components which interact with each other upon impact. And this is what we read on the page 11 of this official American document, “At least one of the active substances may be selected from nerve agents including… tabun (GA), sarin (GB), soman (GD), cyclosarin (GF), and VG, …VM, VR, VX, and [attention!] Novichok agents,” Shulgin cited the US document.
“Moreover, searching by the key word “Novichok” on the digital source google.patents.com you can find over 140 patents issued by the United States, related to the use and protection from exposure to the “Novichok” toxic agent,” he stressed.
Shulgin once again emphasized that the Novichok-type nerve agents had never been produced in the Soviet Union and Russia.
More:
http://tass.com/politics/1000583
Nerve agent used against Skripals is ‘out in the wild,’ ex-MI5 officer tells RT (VIDEO)
The UK government’s square accusations against Russia of it being responsible for the attack on the Skripals has been plunged into further doubt as Annie Machon, an ex-MI5 officer, told RT that the nerve agent’s formula was published in a book by a Russian defector to the US in 2008.
“It could’ve been developed… by up to 20 different laboratories in many different countries around the planet, so of course Britain should not have immediately jumped to the assumption that, because it was developed under the Soviet Union, it must therefore be used by Russia now,” she said.
It comes as the Britain’s representative to the Organization for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons (OPCW), Peter Wilson, admitted that the international watchdog could not confirm “essential evidence” on the agent regarding its origin.
Russia hit back by saying it had replied to all of London’s questions concerning the Skripal case, and that it had also provided proof that the type of agent used against the former Russian double agent and his daughter in Salisbury on March 4 had been produced and patented in the US as a chemical weapon back in 2015.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TJh0yfhfpFc
“They’ve sort of backed themselves into a corner now. I can’t see how they can rescind what they have already said,” Machon told RT. “[The UK] cannot afford diplomatically to row back from this position, particularly at a very vulnerable diplomatic time for Britain, with Brexit looming, so I’m not quite sure what they can do apart from keep scapegoating Russia.”
https://www.rt.com/uk/424570-nerve-agent-salisbury-skripals/
Moscow Recommends That London Not Rush to Destroy Evidence in Skripal Case
The UK government said last week that the clean-up work had begun in Salisbury, which was the site of the suspected nerve agent attack against former Russian spy Sergei Skripal and his daughter Yulia.
“We are expecting to receive comprehensive answers to our questions [from London and OPCW]. The Russian side is still ready for constructive engagement with Britain to clarify this very complicated matter,” Russian Foreign Ministry Spokeswoman Maria Zakharova said. “We are ready to cooperate in any international legal formats, we urge London not to hurry up with the destruction of evidence.”
https://sputniknews.com/europe/201804191063716670-moscow-skripal-evidence-case/
Containers with chlorine from Germany, smoke bombs from UK’s Salisbury found in E. Ghouta – Moscow
Containers with chlorine from Germany and smoke grenades produced in Salisbury, UK were found in the liberated territories of Syria’s Eastern Ghouta, Russian Foreign Ministry spokesperson Maria Zakharova has stated.
“In the liberated areas of Eastern Ghouta, Syrian government troops have found containers with chlorine – the most horrible kind of chemical weapons – from Germany, and also smoke grenades produced – please pay attention [to this] – in the city of Salisbury, the UK,” Zakharova told a news conference in Moscow on Thursday.
The findings undermine “the faith in humaneness” of some states’ leadership, who “give such orders and make such decisions,” Zakharova added.
Prior to the alleged chemical incident in Douma, which was used by the US, the UK and France as a pretext for striking Syria last Saturday, Russia had repeatedly warned about possible provocations by the militants, according to the spokesperson. Moscow had also sent data to the Organization for Prohibition of Chemical Weapons (OPCW) on chemical-weapons production facilities in the liberated areas of Eastern Ghouta.
More to Follow
[Maria Zakharova press conference]
https://www.rt.com/news/424581-chlorine-germany-bombs-uk-syria/
On the BBC World Service this morning (April 19, 2018 at 09:06 local time), they interviewed Vladimir Ugliev (sp?), a “retired Russian scientist” who claimed that he had worked in the development of the Novichoks. Download the file here. The interview begins about 30:45
He made a number of interesting claims.
1) The material he developed has an extremely long life span, so the material he developed in the late 80s is still potent.
2) When developing the “novichok”, he spilled it on his hand, and was able to counteract it by plunging his hand into hydrochloric acid, then rinsing it in hydrogen peroxide.
Is he a bullsh*tter, or a plant whom the BBC wasn’t able to see through? Pretty sloppy lab he worked in there, if he was able to spill it on his hand. I always plunge my hand into hydrochloric acid to clean off the toxic nerve agents.
I wonder what dilution of hydrochloric acid…I used 1:10 to etch zinc sheet once…started off very slowly then went off like a volcano really steaming away as it got hotter by the reaction to such a surface area which was about 12 x 18 inches..you are “ok “with nitric acid up to 1:6 for a few seconds on skin but will badly sting in any cuts but does take a few minutes to wash that off….sodium carbonate will neutralise acids…
I did not watch the interview, but the acid story seems a bit strange. Maybe he only spilled a little bit of a diluted compound on his hand, because otherwise he would have been dead.
According to the OPCW website https://www.opcw.org/about-chemical-weapons/types-of-chemical-agent/nerve-agents/ some nerve agents with similar structure are more stable at low pH, so an acid does not look like the first choice for decontamination.
Also, who would have a vat of acid in the lab to plunge his hand into? Maybe the stuff is very sensitive to acids and this was a precaution, who knows?
Mixing hydrochloric acid with hydrogen peroxide will form an extremely potent oxidizer that is used to etch metals, it would probably destroy any chemical agent.
Fun fact: rain water is slightly acidic, because it absorbs NOx and SOx from the air. I wonder if rain would be a good material to decontaminate novichok?