by an anonymous resident of Hong Kong
Dear children of Hong Kong:
Most if not all of you are very concerned about the puzzling scenes and conflicting interpretations/comments (some with fake photos) flying around, each perhaps serving some untold purposes. Concerned but not necessarily adequately informed (not as those who have followed the socio-political development in Hong Kong as a cool pursuit of truth rather than passion – to look for sometimes unpalatable truth rather than what you might prefer to believe, and have done so for a considerable length of time), this must have been a difficult time– though to some, they may actually have a privately congratulatory feeling of “being part of history or history making” as they do what they usually cannot on the streets.
It is difficult because you’ve seen friends estranged because of difference of belief. But it could also be excited (as revolution– what some cold minded scholar had labeled the “opium of intellectuals”)– is said to be going. However, deep down you may feel unsure and worry about something may happen to destroy Hong Kong. This is particularly hard for those who are deeply entrenched in their beliefs (because you cannot turn back now), but somehow not really sure if what you have long upheld is true — particularly as things don’t turn out as simple, easy, clear-cut and tangible as originally thought (or led to believe by the so-called “leaders” of civil disobedience).
Here I am not trying to explain the historical metamorphosis of events (for the past 17 to 30 years actually, and accumulated feelings on both sides—actually there is at least one third party few young people would think of—foreign governments). I am only offering a summary analysis plus some recommendations for you to consider.
First, the real bone of contention: “Lack of Mutual Trust”.
The central argument now is all about whether anyone can stand for election to become CE of HK—what pan democrats called “true universal suffrage”. Beijing obviously is worried about this and insists that : First, it must be nominated by the “Nomination Committee” (as spelled out in the Basic Law accepted by both Britain and China); second, only a candidate who claims allegiance to Hong Kong (jargon: “love” Hong Kong), and by extension, allegiance to China of which Hong Kong is a part.
Pan Democrats alleged that this is not true universal suffrage as there is some conditions for who can run. This view is accepted by most youths and some of their parents and teachers (who, because of the British ban of contemporary Chinese history in curriculum during their own school days, are largely uninformed about the development of the country save for its negative – though quite true—aspects). This camp then alleged that the Central Government does not trust Hong Kong people and therefore they are angry. They want CY Leung to step down as they alleged that he had not helped Beijing understand the “true” views of most Hong Kong people.
Let us first remember: trust must come from both sides to be mutual. Pan democrats, on one hand, has never said they trust Beijing. Now, let’s see whether the things they’d done since (actually before) the hand-over till now have laid a solid or even shaky but workable foundation of trust for Beijing? Hell, no! Look at some of the following:
Ever since 1997, from insulting the flag, to challenging the authority of the nation’s congress over the local court, to physically thrusting at then Vice Premier Li (now premier) when he was invited to deliver a lecture on China’s economy at Hong Kong University… and endless blockading and thrusting by force at the Liaison Office of the Central Government at Hong Kong, as well as the fanning up of anti-Mainlanders activities in recent years—apparently all aimed at alienating Hong Kong from Mainland which was united only after 150 years.
Some of them have openly (on TV etc) asserted that they aim at changing China (so much for the principle of “River and Well water stay away from each other 河水不犯井水);
Endless filibuster acts in the Legislative Council (Legco) to block almost all important actions of the government with the purpose of discrediting it — so as to uphold the myth that only elected government can rule. What about the 150 years rule by governors directly sent from London? No argument about democracy but the message is fabricated and therefore not true.
Now, more in focus is the question for candidacy for the CE post. Before judging the validity of the pan democrats’ claim or understanding Beijing’s worries, let us be reminded of the following facts:
The Britain cunningly devised (and Beijing perhaps unknowingly accepted then) a system in which any foreigner who have resided in HK consecutively and legally for 7 years can become “Permanent Residents”. Note: purposefully blurring the distinction between a citizen and just a person allowed to reside and work (who are not considered citizens in any country), the so-called “permanent residents” in Hong Kong can vote and enjoy all privileges of citizens here without any obligation or commitment! Actually, they enjoy more privilege than the “real” Hong Kong people because: a. They need not forsake their original nationality or allegiance/loyalty to it; b. They can vote in both their own country and here; c. if Hong Kong collapses (and causes harm to China), they either could not care less or even secretly congratulate themselves if their countries are at odds with China – and many of their original countries are. A “genuine” citizen’s vote carries only the same weight as these “permanent residents” in Hong Kong who have no commitment to this place!
The Basic Law specifies that only people of Chinese origin or Chinese born in Hong Kong can assume leading positions in the government. Can the highest government post of Chief Executive be an exemption?
The pan democrats has a verifiable record of trying to push for permanent residency status for foreigners. E.g., the South Asians (members of the British Commonwealth) and even Filipino domestic helpers. No offense to Filipinos but — need I remind you of the two nation’s hot argument on south sea isles? They are by definition a foreign interest.
Lai Chi Ying, owner of the notorious (chased out of Taiwan as he tried to meddle in the island’s politics) Apple Daily News, was found to have given HKD 40,000,000 to anti government politicians last year (actually, a lot more money in previous years), including Anson Chan who wanted to be CE and the retired archbishop of Hong Kong (who criticized anything related to Mainland China). The case is now under investigation of the ICAC (Independent Commission Against Corruption). Can Beijing trust these people?
Can Hillary Clinton refuse to pledge loyalty to America if she runs for president? Can anyone in any country do that if he/she runs for a chief public office in their own land? Then how can Beijing accept this to happen in Hong Kong — where it is no secret that Britain and the US want to have influence, in fact, control?
What would happen if we really have a CE who does not put the interest of Hong Kong (and China) above those of other nations?
Beijing, through the local government, ask Hong Kong to “accept for now 袋住先” the rather stringent requirement (most important, that the nominee must be supported by half or more of the Nominating Committee) the People’s Congress (the highest legislative body in China) has announced – hinting that the conditions could be relaxed later. This is a promise it can hardly go back. But this not accepted by those going to the streets.
Regarding voting right — what universal suffrage usually means—there is no argument. Beijing already committed itself to that EVERY eligible voter in Hong Kong (including foreigners who may be against China) can have a vote for the CE —if the present package is accepted by the Legco. This is a required step since the British days. If Legco does not accept it, there will be NO universal suffrage and the old system (through which the previous 3 CEs were elected) would remain.
Next I would like to Beijing’s suspicion and whether it has grounds for it.
Beijing alleged all along that opposition movements (plenty since and before 1997) have been instigated, supported, designed by foreign powers (particularly the US) who provide technical expertise not only on electioneering (seen in previous elections where Democrats often won, though not any more) but also street fight techniques.
Selina Yip Lau (previous Secretary for Security of Hong Kong, now elected Legco member after studying at Stanford) has just published her findings on techniques including the “firechat” software used in Taiwan students’ previous occupation of its legislative college (which does not need the internet to function, is an excellent field communication and command software which works both on the internet and mobile phones). She pointed out that the “amateur” students were able to break through police blockade in a mere 5 minutes, and their stationing of defense and guard posts cannot be done by non military people. See Yahoo.com.hk or Yahoo it. (Not sure if not blocked in Google)
America’s blockade of China is known by anyone in the study of Geopolitics (not available to HK university students yet). Also, separation of any part of China has always been part of American strategy vs a rising China. Hong Kong has always been a key financial, political, and social-cultural hub for China sitting at the mouth of the Pearl River where it meets the South China Sea.
Beijing is aware of the series of “color revolutions” ranging from the Arab Spring to Yugoslavia, Thailand and Ukraine etc. In both Thailand and Ukraine, the democratically elected presidents were thrown out of office by street protest. All these countries touched upon by America are now in miserable conditions. Will Hong Kong be next?
Whether or not we think Beijing’s suspicion has grounds, when it suspects, it naturally takes a more defensive, conservative attitude towards the election of Hong Kong’s CE.
Conclusion drawn from the above discussion:
Unrestricted universal suffrage including the free choice of candidates is attainable only if a genuine mutual trust between Beijing and all people in Hong Kong is built up. Now what will democrats do to help build this? At any rate, given the loophole in our election system, there is no way a candidate should run without professing allegiance for Hong Kong, and by extension, China.
Personally, I would like to see that the voting system be more open – if Beijing can become less worried and more confident. First, I would like to see the number on the committee to expand by two or even three folds; Second, I would like to see a wider representation of various “sectors” by the committee; Third, I hope to see a less stringent requirement for any candidate to acquire before he/she can actually stand for election — less stringent than the current specified 50% of the Committee. But I will insist that anyone who wishes to be leader of a part of China must pledge allegiance to both Hong Kong and the country — and I reserve the right of the people to replace any government for valid reasons.
For that to happen, the pan democrats must reconsider their strategy: Instead of deliberately putting down both the local and Central Government (often very unfairly) to argue (actually establish the myth) that only a democratically government can govern Hong Kong, they should think about how to build up mutual trust. With that, I will not object if any one of them runs and become our next CE. I just do not see how one without the trust of the central government can help Hong Kong.
Now, a few comments about the current situation for the Children of Hong Kong:
It is a tragedy to alienate your friends , particularly long time associates, just because of difference of opinions in this single matter. You should share what you know, and respect his or her choice even if they do not agree. Though this in some way may affect your evaluation of his/her abilities. We need to stand together now, not fight because things are actually much more complicated than what an average person can comprehend;
Both sides (HK govt & Demonstrators) have learned quickly from the early clashes. The government withdrew the riot control units and is adopting a very soft-handed way of dealing with the demonstrators, using TV explanations as well as pleas to the so-called “leaders” of the Occupy Central movement to deliver their previous claims or promise: that the movement will be non-violent, demonstrators will not resist arrest and that if matters get out of and, they will dissolve the crowd. (Truth is: control of the crowd is no longer in the hands of these scholars living the ivory tower—but in the hands of the radical, young students. The “old folks” are making hardline announcements just to “stay with” the crowd, pretending that they are still leading the movement. Actually, the real leaders are the young student leaders trained and supported by a foreign power)
Demonstrators try to show their civil side now (after the initial violent thrashing at police lines which brought tear gas and criticism from some HK people). They now allow passage of some ambulance and fire service vehicles. Actually, most who participated believed in what Tai (the law teacher of HKU) claimed : to perform a civil, i.e., non violent, disobedience. But mass movements are often dominated by passion, particularly among the young. It remains to be seen how long and how dominating civil acts of students could continue as probably some who had seen the unexpected, ugly and violent scenes may have already left;
The Government is obviously playing a “Wait and Wear” game — waiting to see if a critical mass of the demonstrators can see that they are going nowhere or get fed up with stepped up violence the foreign trained student leaders are advocating, and to see if their TV persuasion, explanation and pleas work; wearing means let the sun, rain and mere physical fatigue to wear out the energy and determination of those on the streets;
The radical student leaders’demands are impossible and unreasonable — may be after all, they do not really want a peaceful solution of the matter. They demand Leung to meet them at a time they specify, with preconditions Leung is powerless to implement etc., and to step down as the “deadline” they set is now over. Leung cannot possible accept terms he as a local official cannot take up to override those of the Central Government. Stepping down in this time of chaos would lead to what? Beijing will not bend — as usual it does not, particularly if it suspects foreign governments are behind. Also, bending means not only a loss of face (or legitimacy), authority towards other local governments (most anti-corruption work is directed at local officials). Also, submission could mean endless more demands. Finally, Beijing suspects this is a crucial step of HK going “independent” – as many in the legal profession and foreigners try to interpret “high degree of autonomy” to mean. If it bends, there will be a widespread riots inside China protesting this and the nation will lose face.
Whether they (or the brains behind them) may change their mind remains to be seen. If peacefully solved, however, this group will continue to aggressively cause problems because that would keep them in the lime light. Without that, their value (to themselves as well as their patrons) will be finished.
Friday October 3 will be an important time: People will return to work after two days of public holidays. What would the street “heroes”do? The Government had just explained detailed with a map on the TV how their present “occupied areas” affect traffic. You can assume that they are persuading demonstrators to occupy elsewhere so as to cause less inconvenience to the public. However, it MAY be hinting to them how they can cause even more severe traffic. Somehow I feel that government seems to want it to continue for some time — no proof, just a gut feeling.
Since the movement, the Hang Seng Index lost several hundred points, meaning 50 billion HKD is already lost. The Mainland has canceled many tours to HK — the National Day “Golden Week” for tourism is lost, affecting approximately 250,000 people working in tourism and related business. Short term impact: there may be a temporary fall on property prices, particularly the high ended units. As China now eases its property purchase policies, why not buy big, comfortable houses up north with better air and less pollution – including noise (political) pollution?
Worst Case Scenario: History shows that many, in fact, most mass movement with clear-cut, noble goals were often hijacked by opportunists who seek their own goals. While the “Old” leaders such as Tai (HKU) has already lost real leadership of the movement, it remains to be seen if the 17-year old Wong Chi-feng can control the whole scene. “Spontaneous” outburst of occupation actions in various areas may reflect that actually, no single group is actually controlling the “wild cat” type movement. If that happens, be prepared for a long term disturbance. Then the Central Government will need to consider whether to use force and risk being criticized as in 1989 Tiananmen Square incident; or allow HK to “sink” as Thailand or Ukraine. It may also consider “clipping the wings” of the local economy. If the Mainland government is persuaded to adopt a policy providing less favoritism or privilege to HK (which it has been doing all these years), our young people may need to spend more time making a living than roaming the streets telling their Central Government as well as the older people who have built up HK in their younger years what to do. Children of Hong Kong, what choices are you leaving for Beijing?
No attributed source? Nothing at all about the person who wrote this? It’s all very suggestive but there is so much garbled writing that I can’t really follow the argument, sorry.
First – then fact that you choose to comment as Anonymous – only to complain about the anonymity of any attributable source to what is a most thoughtful & well argued analysis makes you appear ridiculous. (I have chosen ‘Anonymous’ myself here to emphasise the their absurdity of your remark)
Second – if you are unable to apprehend a variety of reasons why the author has chosen to remain anonymous then it begs there question as to whether you are simply intellectually challenged, a troll – or both
Yeah, well I am guessing you are a troll. The only thing I would add to Saker ‘ s message to the children of Hong Kong is that they should carefully examine the so-called democracies of the west they are trying to emulate. They should look carefully at the agenda and actions of their military – security complex, who is really running things and how similar protests are handled here. We see these western countries promoting, encouraging and applauding civil unrest for the sake of “democracy” in countries they want to take down but how do they handle these things in their own countries? With unapologetic state force- that’s how!
I don’t appreciate you insulting Saker like this. Without him I could not make sense of what is going on in the world and would be much worse off for it. Bless you Saker for all you do.
~Susan
Thanks for including this matter on your blog Saker and yes I and many others see this as just another front of Americas war on the Eurasian powers.
Everything we have seen in HK is straight out the colour revolution play book. I know you are a religious man Saker, but here I must point out the role of US/South Korean and Taiwanese based churches in instigating this unrest.
These are not of course established churches like the Orthodox or CoE etc, but cultish evangelical movements, like the Moonies, with strong links to US intelligence and other establishment backers. These churches have since the 97 decolonisation, been very active in schools and education and it is no coincidence that many on the streets protesting are of the first generations to be educated through these church funded establishments.
Fortunately the vast majority of Hong Kongers have no truck with this movement and are deeply suspicious of those guiding it out of sight.
The danger of course is the protesters and their western media cheer leaders being able to sell the message that the HK Gov has lost its legitimacy and that legitimacy belongs to them.
Fortunately, the protests do seem to be running out of steam and actively alienating ordinary citizens that may have been initially sympathetic.
Even the US dont have a free choice to be elected for President so how can they talk about providing it for other countries? Yea even a born again Nigerian can become president but only if vetted by the 1%. Everyone else no matter how rich develop problems. The US and UK seems to have a 2 party system where each party is the same as the other party. Its the same as Assad standing for elections and who infact gets higher approval ratings than the 2 party systems.
Who is who in “The Hong Kong Revolution”:
http://miguel-esposiblelapaz.blogspot.com.es/2014/10/hong-kong-otra-revolucion-de-color.html
http://landdestroyer.blogspot.com.es/2014/10/entire-occupy-central-protest-scripted.html
Excellent article with clearly written facts of the matter.
China (apart from Russia, India, Brazil) will have to face so many obstacles from AngloZionist camp on multiple fronts like trade & economy, territorial integrity, internal disturbances, energy etc. The AZ camp will anyway find lot of disgruntled population in all these countries to do their biding.
Chinese government will try to accommodate the ‘democratic demands’ – after all, when a white English ruled HK until few years back, he/she is ‘incarnate’ of ‘democracy god’, so no question of democratic choice; but now yellow Chinese are ruling, so that question will arise anyway !
When do the HK young children plan to install the ‘statue of liberty’ at their land ? Till then, everything will appear as ‘heroic’, thereafter, the AZ evil designs will be smashed anyway !
Anonymous Indian
http://landdestroyer.blogspot.com.es/2014/09/us-openly-approves-hong-kong-chaos-it.html
http://landdestroyer.blogspot.com.es/2014/09/hong-kongs-occupy-central-is-us-backed.html
http://landdestroyer.blogspot.com.es/2014/10/us-now-admits-it-is-funding-occupy.html
http://landdestroyer.blogspot.com.es/2014/10/terrorism-and-turmoil-us-containment-of.html
http://landdestroyer.blogspot.com.es/2014/10/hong-kong-strikes-back-west-attempts-to.html
Dear Students,
So you want universal suffrage and the right to pick your own candidates. How wonderful! Go to America and see how real democracy works. Well, unless you are black and get put into jail for smoking a joint, and lose the right to vote.
Or maybe you could pay 10,000 bucks to meet your representative to present a need for a big tax break. Or pay 100,000 plus and maybe you can meet the President.
You should study up on Citizens United, which sold USA democracy, or what was left of it, to Corporate America. There was not even a vote. The Supreme Court, all of whom are unelected by the people foisted that on the citizenry.
And as for picking your own candidates…..
When was the last time we supposed voters had a chance to pick a real candidate? Maybe back in 1972 when George McGovern ran, but the Democratic Party leadership, having been initially defeated by the grassroots, stabbed the Democratic Party grassroots candidate, McGovern in the back.
Before that, in 1944, Henry Wallace got stabbed in the back by the party leadership, Harry Truman (his name itself an oxymoron) a two bit hack got nominated in his place, and FDR’s health went down hill real real fast….arsenic in regular small doses is a great cure for Presidents who don’t want cold wars and support decolonization. Truman did as he was told and used nuclear weapons on civilians, to bully the Russians (bully the Russians?…sound familiar?)
Bobby Kennedy? He would have won the Presidency in 1968, and ended the Vietnam War. And investigated his brother’s assassination, but he was Shot.
Paul Wellstone. The Senator opposed the Iraq war and Dick Cheney–his plane crashed one week before his election. Murdered.
JFK, shot.
And that isn’t even counting Operation Gladio in Europe where elections were manipulated by staging attacks to be blamed on Social Democrats.
And don’t even get started on Scotland. No exit polls. But whole neighborhoods that favored candidates who supported independence mysteriously vote No.
Hey students, go to America and start an Occupy Movement, but be sure to wear a helmet and gas mask when you peacefully demonstrate for Change. Be sure to sign up for Obamacare first though, so that when your head gets bashed in, the hospitals will not be able to let you bleed to death.
When I talk with Chinese they so often say, Ah, you are Americans you get to choose your president.
From 1968-2004, I never once voted for a president that I really wanted. The people vetted to be voted on in the USA are just as controlled as the process in China, or for that matter, the process in Iran, or for that matter any of the other socalled Western Democracies. By 2004, I realized, THERE IS no one to vote for. The elections are a sham.Democracy?…..good luck.
These kids need to wake up.
Who knows what the NED is putting in their cookies.
The grievances are basically the same everywhere. Too much concentration of wealth, and big disparities in incomes between Capital and Labor. On balance, the Asian countries seem to be doing better than the West, probably because they are not wasting so much money on killing people far from their own borders.
So my advice to Chinese students: Don’t look to the Western models as a solution. And DEFINITELY DO NOT associate with their agents in your country. They are not your friends.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=acLW1vFO-2Q
Thank you for this article!
1) it appears authentic.
2) it is not making any excuses for the government is not hung up on the legalities.
3) it is describing a pattern seen elsewhere.
I never knew about the HK 7 years residence the UK pulled a real swifty with that one.
China is far from perfect, but China must remain intact for the immediate future; that is until we get a true multi-polar world.
Anglo imperialism is directly threatening China by this action. This seems to me to be a reasonable conclusion bearing in mind I know little about the HK events.
If this is correct China needs to pull the plug on the USD NOW! Not wait and so not to suffer other attacks and lose its position in Asia and in the world at this time.
China owes itself and the world the chance to develop and to stabilise, for this will allow other countries to also develop and stabilise — there is no hope for this under the senile petro-dollar.
So thanks for this article, for this reader, it has consolidated an impression into an opinion and the basis for future analysis. They will not prevail.
Brilliant argument with the historical facts as basis for reason.
Thank you Saker for this erudite piece.
As someone who studies China and Hong Kong as avocation, I concur with the article. It is nuanced and accurate.
At its core, the Umbrella Revolution is a de-stabilization program which sews seeds of chaos and ruin. Only a Hegemon would use such a technique because there is no true wish for Liberty and Progress in anything a Hegemon promotes. Its power and influence is enhanced when social collapse and poverty, dissension and despair sweep through a society.
No one in the Hegemonic offices of the West care about China, Hong Kong or any Asian nations. Their sole goal and all their efforts are to stop the rise of Asia and limit China and Chinese influence.
Dressing their cudgels as umbrellas and their cannon fodder as students is clever. But this article clearly exposes the war the West is waging in the streets of Hong Kong.
It is their wet dream since 1949 to pull down the New China dream of the Chinese people.
Beijing will win this.
The losers are holding the umbrellas and fire chatting like dumb cluck chickens about to be plucked of their feathers and lose their heads on the Hegemon’s chopping block. Not quite sacrificial lambs. Just mislead idealists who are uneducated to the truth.
This article is abundant in those factual truths.
The West is trying to balkanize Africa, S/Central America, Russia. So, likely doing the same to China. I give the Chinese credit for being better informed than we westerners. They know all about democracy-for-the-one-percent-worthless-ballots-for-the-rest.
OleImmigrant says….
Saker, let me be the first poster on this thread.
Thank you for your blog site and your untiring effort in promoting ‘other voices’ on a forum that is both informative and effective. I learned an awful lot about Russia, its former federal states, and European history in general.
Regarding the HK situation, it is actually not spontaneous. Even the youngest participant in the protest rank has been briefed and prepared for it for months. But the brainwashing of these dupes, that results in today’s confrontation, has gone on for decades. So, its not like pointing out the whereof and whence in an essay or two is going to change any minds.
I dare say 99% of HK’s citizen have no concept of democracy. They have no idea what Legco does how they do them. They thought the US president is elected by one-man-one-vote in a process that composes of a ballot box/booth alone. They have no idea that, in places such as the US or UK, the voting public has no choice besides the ones printed on the ballot; that the candidates are carefully screened and vetted for years to be ensured of their loyalty and naivette; that anyone not toeing the AZ line stands no chance of getting anywhere, much as they thought China would only put up puppets for electioneering purposes. They don’t realize that human everywhere are still basically the same.
The brainwashing started in elementary schools, on through high school and college. Anson Chan, shortly after the turnover of HK to Chinese sovereignty , abolished the teaching of Chinese History from school curriculum.
But the real heavy duty brainwashing has been in churches, insidiously. I am not saying Christian religion is inherently subversive against China. But there are plenty of bad apples in every barrel. Christianity is no exception. Some of these brainwashing cadres may not even be religious themselves. How else do you explain the fact that they turn blind eyes of slaughters and destruction in other people’s homeland, in the name of serving the ‘Lord’? Anyway, the operations in churches, schools, and social setting over extended periods result in a minority in HK today who despises everything Chinese.
The parables to this in the West (I can only vow for the US, as I haven’t spent time in Europe)are the acid hatred against Christians by a minority of Muslims. I believe that’s the concern and policy guidelines towards the spread of Islam here.
Anyway, the ones protesting in HK Central number only a few tens of thousands. There are three million students and well over a million Christians in HK. So I am confident in saying that what one sees on west MSM, TV, newspaper, etc. is truly a fractional minority of the overall HK population. This too shall pass!
“Fort Apache” NEW interesting Edition about MERCOSUR:
On the need to partner to make common front against imperialism and financial oligarchies:
http://hispantv.com/detail/2014/10/04/291413/fort-apache-mercosur-hacia-integracion-latinoamericana
This is just another USSA sponsored color revolution, targeting China for being too independent.
I think the Chinese government should ‘out’ all of the USSA sponsored NGO’s, arrest the leaders, and then force them to register as foreign entities.
Moreover, China should study how the USSA suppresses internal dissent, such as the co-option of the Occupy movement, and apply the same techniques.
Finally, China, Russia and the rest of the BRICS must finally break away from the USSA dollar since this is the only way to peacefully destroy this most evil empire. If it were not for the USSA, the world would be far more peaceful.
Saker,
good article: I think China choice will be to start firing people who do not come to work, move capital to another city or move in labor forces that are loyal to the Gov. The bottle line is that those young people need to be teach respect and discipline, which seen to have been erased under the US-British illusion. If they are more British than Chinese, they should move to UK, most of them have already double citizenships.
People who take foreign money to participate in color revolutions should be subject to capital punishment.
George Soros admits to funding the Ukraine crisis
June 2, 2014
tweet
George Soros told CNN’s Fareed Zakaria over the weekend he is responsible for establishing a foundation in Ukraine that ultimately contributed to the overthrow of the country’s elected leader and the installation of a junta handpicked by the State Department.
“First on Ukraine, one of the things that many people recognized about you was that you during the revolutions of 1989 funded a lot of dissident activities, civil society groups in eastern Europe and Poland, the Czech Republic. Are you doing similar things in Ukraine?” Zakaria asked Soros.
“Well, I set up a foundation in Ukraine before Ukraine became independent of Russia. And the foundation has been functioning ever since and played an important part in events now,” Soros responded.
It is well-known, although forbidden for the establishment media to mention, that Soros worked closely with USAID, the National Endowment for Democracy (now doing work formerly assigned to the CIA), the International Republican Institute, the National Democratic Institute for International Affairs, the Freedom House, and the Albert Einstein Institute to initiate a series of color revolutions in Eastern Europe and Central Asia following the engineered collapse of the Soviet Union.
“Many of the participants in Kiev’s ‘EuroMaidan’ demonstrations were members of Soros-funded NGOs and/or were trained by the same NGOs in the many workshops and conferences sponsored by Soros’ International Renaissance Foundation (IRF), and his various Open Society institutes and foundations. The IRF, founded and funded by Soros, boasts that it has given ‘more than any other donor organization’ to ‘democratic transformation’ of Ukraine,” writes William F. Jasper.
We, the mainland Chinese, are all whole heartily supporting your movement. Keep going, march forward.
Every one is happy to see you go to hell as it now.
I’m hoping for a lively discussion about Hong Kong, it’s history as part of the British franchise, and China’s past (as the sick man of Asia). There’s much to be learned about how cultures are manipulated and destroyed.
Children ? are those really children? if so, who are their parents? what parents
would let their children be used in as betting chips? should things turn sour, they
would be target practice for rubber bullets, water canons, tear gas, and even real bullets.
For the “top” few student leaders that you can count on one hand, they would then reap the benefit
of full scholarship to top US Ivy League schools like Harvard and Yale, so-so grades not withstanding.
But for the rest of the student followers, good luck and thank you for your support! A statement in
your essay that says “I participated in the pro-Democracy rally in HK” simply does not make you stand out!
Dear The Saker,
I see another poster has put the link to the land destroyer blogspot on the entire occupy central protest is scripted by USG & Co article.
It is a shame all these students are so ill educated and unpatriotic.
The Chinese Govt. needs to abolish this 7 year resident mess for a start and using the law – go after and expose the betrayers who have been working so closely with the NED and other NGO’s in HK…..they also need to start educating their kids on the truth and their Chinese history. In addition teach them about the sham of so called US democracy.
Rgds,
Veritas
Most Cantonese people are too cautious, cynical, and pragmatic to participate in this colour revolution.
Dear HKG kids,
Is THIS the demicracy yoz are aiming for?
.
,”We Call It Democracy, But It’s Not”
.
Read it at http://www.zerohedge.com what P.C. Roberts, a former hand of the US Treasury has to say.
And in case you still do not know who the ,invisible hand’ behind your ,protest’ is, go to http://www.tomatobubble.com and click on ,frequent updates’ to get a clue.
The BRICs including China are under attack for the sake ofnthe Petrodollar and many HKG kids are probably unintended helpers also called ,useful idiots’
by many others.
China will never embrace religion especially Christianity. Even if they think the US is so successful because of it. 100 or 200 years might be a long time for Americans, but it is not for civilizations thats lasted for many thousands of years and went through it all before. People might not know WHY they feel something, because it is inherent in their survival instinct.
China’s leadership has a deep-seated fear of uprisings. Though largely unknown to westerners, China endured a cataclysmic revolt from 1850 to the late 1860’s, the Taiping Rebellion. A nobody named Hong proclaimed himself the younger brother of Jesus Christ and launched a peasant rebellion against the doddering Manchu Qing dynasty that eventually cost over 20 million lives. Western forces led by Gen. Charles Gordon – henceforth known as “Chinese” Gordon – finally crushed the Taiping Heavenly Army.
As a result, China’s security police are cracking down ever harder. Beijing also knows that among the so-called “terrorist camps” in Afghanistan when the US invaded in 2001 were CIA-run bases training Uighurs to fight in western China. The US public was never told about these camps. Most of the other supposed “terrorist camps” in Afghanistan were actually being used by Pakistani intelligence to train guerilla fighters for use in Indian-ruled Kashmir.
http://ericmargolis.com/2014/10/hong-kong-boiling-but-gently-so-far/
Post hoc ergo propter hoc
Because it follows, therefore it is caused by
Successive US administrations have consistently meddled in the extreme in the internal politics of key nations since WWII. Japan, Korea, Italy, Ukraine, etc. etc. The fact that they’re always trying does not mean they always succeed. Colour revolutions are conspicuous, Georgia, Ukraine, Arab Spring.
But, Hong Kong is different. Are NED and its US funded cousins right there trying to stir up trouble. No doubt. Nevertheless, there are legitimate demands of the Chinese people that need to be recognized. It’s part of the remarkable societal changes in China that should impress the world.
Hong Kong was left in limbo. You can’t tell a people that things are getting better when you take away fundamental rights.
The people of southeastern Ukraine did a remarkable thing when they voted for independence. The leaders who put on the referendum were even more remarkable in holding that vote. The leaders and people assumed that the process of choice was their right. This is the inspiration and model not a locked down “democracy” where the central government picks the candidates for elections. That’s the ultimate form of election fraud.
The people of Hong Kong are not bots controlled by foreign elements. They’re intelligent, concerned citizens exercising their right of assembly and petitioning the government.
Riddle me this:
Starting at year 1953, What are the Top 3 exports of the AZs?
A:
1. regime change
2. NGOs – a cover for a shrink wrapped 3 letter agency- it’s for the children
3. NSAID – a cover for the other shrink wrapped 3 letter agency – it’s also for the children
Too bad AZs are not smart. The one country you do not want to be Ffing is China.
~ ~ ~ ~ ~
Consider The Dragon’s Hoard
~ ~ ~ ~ ~
AM
Even the Tibet Network tibetnetwork.org now participates in this idiocy http://tibetnetwork.org/we-stand-with-you/ . And the Dalai Lama has spoken against Putin. They have never meddled in politics so far: have they all lost their senses? This will damage the Tibetans and the Tibet support groups in all countries.
Chinese Spring.
Well, this protest will come to nothing and push China to act with heightened clarity, all the worst for the high bourgeoise. Plus their insidious ways will become clearer to more people globally.
Now the struggle is indeed for the space in which multipolarity and real social justice can form, it’s unnecessary to compare Chinese or Russian society to NW European or Canadian.
In neither HK nor Ukraine a military solution by Beijing/Moscow will be necessary nor productive. Moscow must minimize the conflict and maintain the balance in which it is indispensable power broker. The point now is to defend/maintain the Russo-Soviet-Eurasian civilization. We still may not lose anything (except war dead and infastructure). I get impatient waiting for the great Ukrainian economic crash, but after Donbas and milit-tech for Russia, what industry does it have left? You get the culture you can afford, and already Ukraine can only afford a social compact worse than that of a pack of mangy feral dogs. I just met a guy in Yerevan from Dniepropetrovsk who was deeply orthodox, escaping draft(thou shall not kill), and naturally referred to Ukraine as Russia.
Russia and China’s greatest asset is their grip on reality. Wait for the unhinged ukies/hongers egged on by a plastic blow-up country to fail, people like this Kostya I met will go home and set things right.
@14:03 hits the nail on the head: “These kids need to wake up.”
El Murid, Strelkov’s public voice, has published today an analysis of these western orchestrated revolutions. He argues that in Russia, similar putschs have been carried out without the first manifest stage of popular manifestations, of which appears to be the case of Hong kong, that is obvious that has been prepared outfront. It can be read in his site or in niqnaq site.
Undoubtedly, the Brazilian popular uprising of 2013 was similarly orchestrated, but the obvious usage of lumpen elements, produced that the scared middle classes avoided taking part in themanifestations, so that they quickly subsided.
I still believe that tiananmin was a color revolution, I just wonder how the Chinese government will deal with the current situation. It really is a pity their intelligence community allows this sort of thing to happen. I have read some reports alluding to the hk government using triads to disperse crowds. It would be more logical that thugs were hired by local businesses losing money. Perhaps I am wrong but don’t the triads have links to mi6? This could have been a way for the west to stop negotiations.
Organising revolutions is business for some people, ofcourse financed by the US. Watch this mindblowing docu: The revolution Business: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sq4GtZEDZYg
Ingrid (Netherlands)
China is a young dog with the living memory of revolution against the Hong Kong comprador’s of the Anglo-Zionist Empire and should easily rid itself of the fleas infesting Hong Kong.
Henry C K Liu wrote The Historical Significance of Mao Zedong for the First Annual Conference on Mao Zedong in 2013. Henry C K Liu website has an archive of his work as an independent analyst for private investment. His analysis focuses on finance, history, and culture in China and in China’s relationship with the Anglo-Zionist Empire.
The archive is on the left of Mr. Liu’s website. I particularly found his series on modernity worth the effort. He work is not for the twitter gang of minds. Be prepared for in depth analysis of the topics. The archive has more than a decade of his work on Hong Kong, China and the West. I love the internet age when I can access great minds with a click of the mouse…..
Excellent commentary. At ‘Land Destroyer’ Cartalucci has an excellent commentary outlining how the USA, no doubt in cahoots with the rest of the Western ‘Full Spectrum Dominance’ gang, has fomented, financed, organised and trained these compradore traitors, with the view, as Huntsman the previous US Ambassador to China openly proclaimed, of ‘using our friends there’ ‘to bring China down’.Where did Cartalucci find this information, that the sewer of the Western MSM and its presstitute inmates could, or would, not? Why on the US State Department’s own web-site where it is impudently displayed. Need one recall that such foreign interference in domestic politics is completely banned in the USA, that ‘Stinking Sewer on the Hill’.
Greetings Saker, I have a question to ask you regarding some information. (I hope) It’s not so important for you to make a analysis, that’s it’s my imagination. A reply is enought. Well, can you give me information about what is happening in Bosnia right now? I’ve heard that a colored revolution is on the brink, right after the elections on 12th October, like on 5th October 2000 in Belgrade. On the news I’m hearing intense accustions between politicians in power, and those which, for the first time, are for ‘change’, also there new about ‘…more than 100 Russian special forces, disguised as Cossacks, entered Republic of Srpska…’ a few day ago (also, a few weeks ago, some British units also entered Bosnia, but that is ‘not well known’), then there’s the mass protest in february this year(which intensity and destruction I can’t recall ever before) etc. Can you please give me some info, what sides are pariculary involved? Will there be a revolution? If so, how much will it escalate? Information in general about what the hell is happening in here???????
Best regards, A
re: Ukraine
Interesting article about Kolomoisky and his dealings, by a former rabbi:
http://www.realjewnews.com/?p=970
Here is the shape of things to come. When John Kerry said the internet made it much more difficult to “govern” what he meant was through available information on the internet people are now a lot more clued up as to what sort of monsters we have abrogated power to and it isn’t as easy to fool us anymore.
Apparently having a healthy suspicion of the activities of such organisations as the CIA and the NSA is now classed as “extremism” by the British prime minister and lumped together with terrorism, I kid you not :
“Cameron made a clear distinction between Islam as a benign religion and radical Islamism which he described as medieval ideology that must be defeated in all of its forms. He added that an analysis of those who had been convicted of terrorism, in many cases, had been influenced by preachers who claimed not to encourage violence but whose world view could be used as justification for terrorism.
The scope of Cameron’s tendency to limit the freedom of speech and free intellectual and academic inquiry, however, became obvious when Cameron directly compared this ”dangerous world view” with those who raise justified questions about the involvement of deep state elements or rogue networks in false flag terrorism. Indeed, Cameron’s conclusion is setting the stage for a rapid decline into totalitarianism where raising justified questions about state crimes equals terrorism. Cameron said:
”We know this world view; The peddling of lies that 9/11 as somehow a Jewish plot, or that the 7/7 attacks in London were staged. … We must be clear, to defeat the ideology of extremism, not just violent extremism”.
Cameron followed-up on this statement by calling for stricter action against terrorists on-line material, and included universities as possible targets for this crack-down. He noted that some would argue that this is not compatible with free speech and free intellectual inquiry, adding:
”But I would ask you, would we allow right-wing extremism or the Ku Klux Clan to recruit on our campuses? No! So why shouldn’t we stand by and allow any form of non-violent extremism.”
Cameron’s address to the 69th Session of the UN general Assembly must ring alarm bells among theologians such as Dr. David Ray Griffin who questions the official narrative about 9/11 and 19 Arabs with box cutters. It must ring alarm bells among physicists like Dr. Steven Jones and Dr. Niels Harrit who documented the presence of nano termite in the dust of the World Trade Center after their were demolished on September 11, 2001 and thousands of other scholars worldwide who raise questions and document deep state terrorism against citizens of their own nations. The step from an address as that delivered by Cameron to arrests of dissidents in the early morning hours by terrorist regimes is, indeed, a dangerously small one.
The complete article can be read at the URL below :
http://journal-neo.org/2014/10/03/cameron-declares-war-on-uk-citizens/
So now if you actually believe as I, together with millions of other people worldwide do, that 9/11 was an inside job that makes you a terrorist in camerons eyes.
We are seeing the writing on the wall.
The attempt to overthrow the Chinese Government in 1989 was the prototype ‘Colour Revolution’. The guru of this subversive technique, Gene Sharp was even in Beijing co-ordinating efforts just prior to the non-existent ‘massacre’. It was known almost immediately from eye-witness reports from Western journalists and diplomats present all night that no massacre whatsoever occurred in the Square itself. Later, while the ‘Square massacre’ story still circulates amongst the die-hards and the dead-heads, the propaganda campaign switched to ‘killings’ in the neighbourhood.
That was certainly true and hundreds died, but the violence was not one-sided. Police and troops were attacked by armed elements, including triad thugs from Hong Kong and Taiwan, and, remember, most ‘Colour Revolutions’ like those in Serbia, Georgia and Kiev, that succeed contain a final violent armed push to power, after the idiot youth, mobilised by ‘Otpor’ or some other group (now operating as a franchisee of subversion as ‘CANVAS’)have paved the way. And even if they fail in their aim of installing pro-US stooges, they subvert a country, spread hatred and division in the target countries, and are used by Western MSM liars and hypocrites to blacken the target state’s reputation amongst the dullard Western masses.
The attempt to overthrow the Chinese Government in 1989 was the prototype ‘Colour Revolution’. The guru of this subversive technique, Gene Sharp was even in Beijing co-ordinating efforts just prior to the non-existent ‘massacre’. It was known almost immediately from eye-witness reports from Western journalists and diplomats present all night that no massacre whatsoever occurred in the Square itself. Later, while the ‘Square massacre’ story still circulates amongst the die-hards and the dead-heads, the propaganda campaign switched to ‘killings’ in the neighbourhood.
That was certainly true and hundreds died, but the violence was not one-sided. Police and troops were attacked by armed elements, including triad thugs from Hong Kong and Taiwan, and, remember, most ‘Colour Revolutions’ like those in Serbia, Georgia and Kiev, that succeed contain a final violent armed push to power, after the idiot youth, mobilised by ‘Otpor’ or some other group (now operating as a franchisee of subversion as ‘CANVAS’)have paved the way. And even if they fail in their aim of installing pro-US stooges, they subvert a country, spread hatred and division in the target countries, and are used by Western MSM liars and hypocrites to blacken the target state’s reputation amongst the dullard Western masses.
Gene Sharp, the father of colour revolutions was in Beijing in 1989 during the student movement and was expelled
NotSoFast, the so-called Dalai has been a CIA ‘asset’ since the 1950s, so his anti-Putin shite is no surprise. Whether he needs his leash pulled from time to time, or just knows what the Boss requires instinctively, is the only question worth asking.
SAKER, ALL – The Kiev fascist junta is apparently copying the Argentine corporatist/fascist junta of the 1980s ‘disappearing’ those suspected of pro-Novorossiya sympathies in Mariupol — including a couple with children who have since been taken to safety in Crimea:
http://www.twitlonger.com/show/n_1scgamg
h/t @MarcelSardo’s Twitter feed
Saker, your poster’s article and
your bloggers are keenly aware.
I immediately recognised this HK job as an Evil Empire stunt from mass media behaviour which I recognised as a carbon copy of media behaviour covering the 1989 Sixth of June Affair, the 六四事件, the TianAn Men Massacre that never happened.
Daily, for two full weeks before the government cleared the Square, TV news hosted panel discussion palaver about the “Democracy Wall” goings on. But as I wondered at the time, nothing was going on. So what was going on? I also recognised immediately that “students” do not mutilate and murder unarmed PLA soldiers or torch Shanghai trains. After a government big wig called Zhao Ziyang turned up to encourage the protesters and immediately disappeared, I understood that a globalist coup attempt had failed—and the Massacre by “geriatric genocides” was invented by an absolutely furious Evil Empire.
Some one, please convince that mirage queen Elizabeth NoName that China cannot possibly be balkanised no matter what terrorism her proxies’ proxies inflict.
I fully support Russia in its efforts to confront the AZ empire, but I am very sceptical about China.
The reason is Tibet.
It is intolerable to watch the terror imposed by the Chinese CP on spiritually most advanced society in the world.
Tibet is a sacred place. Period. And it must be free.
I am speaking this from a Chinese friendly country, where Americans even bombed the Chinese embassy in 1999.
Regards from Serbia,
The Wend.
I’m not sure/convinced that there was no massacre of protestors at Tiananmen Square.
@China endured a cataclysmic revolt from 1850 to the late 1860’s, the Taiping Rebellion.
This is a very important remark. In actual fact it was the Taiping Rebellion which “opened China”. An aspect usually overlooked is that of the Baptist missionarism in China. The future leader of the rebellion, Hong Xiuquan fell under the influence of the American Baptist missionary Issachar Jacox Roberts and very likely under the influence of opium had visions of Jesus who commanded him to “slay the demons”.
It was only after the huge commotion provoked by the war with its unprecedented lost in human lives and destruction that the Empire could be “tackled” by the Western Powers.
The same Western Powers understand that the only way to subdue China is to provoke the same sort of havoc. But it is sure that China has learned the lessons of the past (which they study in detail with the aim to not allow them to happen again) and it will deny this approach.
BTW, Sun Yat-sen also was baptized in Hong Kong by an American missionary of the Congregational Church of the United States.
So was Chiang Kai-shek. He married Soong May-ling, the younger sister of Soong Ching-ling, the wife of Sun Yat-sen. They were both daughters of Charlie Soong, Methodist missionary and American agent.
The Wend, Tibet when liberated by China was a brutal, primitive, theocracy, ruled over by a parasitic elite of priests. Illiteracy was rampant, life expectancy miserable, infant mortality huge, women mere chattels and many Tibetans lived as serfs. The Chinese ended all that, although, at times, particularly during the Cultural Revolution, they committed atrocities against the priest-hood and destroyed precious cultural treasures, as in the rest of China. But that era is over, and Tibetans enjoy privileges not shared by the Han, like exemption from the one-child policy. Unfortunately the West, led by the USA, has sought to subvert China via Tibet for 60 years, training terrorists in Colorado during the 1950s, then fomenting the ‘revolt’ by bandits in 1959, whereupon their ‘asset’ the Dalai, fled to India.
And equally unfortunately, well-meaning Westerners have been falsely brainwashed as to the reality in Tibet, by the usual concerted, 100% biased, Western MSM propaganda and hate campaign. One can easily assess the real ‘spiritual’ standing of the Dalai and his US-educated functionaries from the despicable campaign of self-immolations they launched inside China, using mostly young, impressionable and mentally feeble dupes to make propaganda against China, a tragedy that the Dalai could have ended with a single edict, but he didn’t, did he?
Knowthetruth, Cameron is, in my opinion, vermin (my apologies to rats and cockroaches). He is an hereditary parasite and a nascent fascist, as they all are. The true mark of the creature, I believe, was his use of his disabled son as an electoral tool. Cameron dragged the poor little blighter out to show how he ‘understood’ the plight of the disabled and their carers from personal experience (itself bullshit as he undoubtedly had nannies and nurses to do the hard work of caring for the child, who has since died). Then, when elected on a tsunami of lies, like his pledge to run ‘the Greenest ever Government in the UK, amongst the first targets of vicious spending cuts were the disabled. I pray, often, for there really to exist a ‘just and wrathful God’, for creatures like Cameron.
China is probably the least controlled by the Jewish nazi mafia of the capitalist shithole, Like what, I mean what does one call these fascist subhuman scum things running this shite?
Incidentally, the jew-nazis at google censored this post.
вот так
The protestors in Hong Kong, organised and no doubt financed by the West, comprise what are known as ‘compradores’. Anti-Chinese Chinese, Chinese who identify with the West, not their own culture, or ‘Westernised Oriental Gentlemen’ as their Western Masters used to sneeringly refer to them.
In Hong Kong they enjoyed 150 years of groveling to their English masters, who weeded out the non-compliant, the non-obsequious, the non-subservient. The working population was kept suppressed, without any ‘democracy’, that sham Potemkin village so useful for elites to camouflage their rule, whatsoever. Hong Kong prospered, mostly as an entrepot to China after 1949, as the Chinese Government set to repairing the damage of 200 years of Western interference, invasion, colonialism and civil wars fomented by the West.
At times of hardship like the Great Famine of the early ’60s or the Cultural Revolution, some fled to Hong Kong. These, and those reactionaries who fled the Communist victory in 1949, included many anti-Communist die-hards and triad elements after their extirpation on the mainland by the likes of Chen Yi.
This is the witches’ brew from which the current sludge of extreme compradores emerged. Scum (apologies to algae) like Liu Xiaobo, the China hater who declared that China needed 300 years of colonialism by the West before it could call itself ‘civilized’, and was rewarded like a good dog for his loyalty by being given the Nobel Peace Prize (the actual, I would say, declaration of war by the Western elite, on China).
These students represent the most reactionary compradores. Their demands, in true ‘Colour Revolution’ style are totalist and non-negotiable. Any concessions will just produce new demands, worked out in advance by seasoned traitors and their Western handlers, all aiming for nothing less than ‘regime change’ to a compradore regime, or, failing that, hopefully a ‘massacre’ real or invented, to blacken China’s reputation, as in 1989. If I was the Chinese I would round up the big traitors, lock ’em up, and offer them free passage to their real homelands, the paradises of the crumbling West.
The Dalai Lama was a cheerleader for the invasion of Iraq, among other things. And yes, on the CIA’s payroll forever.
WizOz & MulgaBill, wonderful contributions. I’d forgotten all that stuff.
Presently I am highly impressed by Webster Tarpley’s suspicion that globalist British intelligence weighed in, in the 1840’s, to the Taiping Rebellion to make sure the Qing, which collapsed 1911, could not recover. He extrapolates from clearly evidenced examples of the Brits creating religious divides as a weapon against targeted regimes—the Mormons in the 1830-40’s against the Union, the Baha’ī, 1860’s, against Persia, not to mention Anglicanism against England’s ancient, formative religion.
Sounds like more Jew “color revolution” bs to me.
Like Tienanmen(?) sq.
I used to know several Isreali Jews involved in setting up that shit – a China without Israeli Jews can only be a good thing (like every where else).
вот так
I am a foreigner living in China for the past 1.5 years. Those kids do not represent the mainstream people of HK who only ask for the right to live their lives in peace and work hard for their families. These real people are not interested in furthering the global domination aims of US of A, unlike those kids.
@The Wend,
I think you have a lot of misperceptions regarding Tibet, I suggest you look for yourself the following:
1. Tibetan practices poliandry (i.e. one wife multiple husbands, normally brothers)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polyandry_in_Tibet
2. Tibetan burial
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sky_burial
3 Tibetan Buddhism
http://www.michaelparenti.org/Tibet.html
@bob kay
Thanks for this link to Henry C K Liu. I’ve also gotten a lot out of his articles. Speaking of which, does anybody know what he’s up to these days? He used to write frequently for the Asia Times, but that seems to have dropped off. I hope he’s working on a book.
Taiping Revolt
Actually the Opium Wars were fought on the background of the Taiping Revolt.
Remember also the Dungan Revolt (the uprising by members of the Muslim Hui and other Muslim ethnic groups in China’s Shaanxi, Gansu and Ningxia Provinces, as well as Xinjiang, between 1862 and 1877) which continued the Taiping Rebellion, but had all the characteristics of a “Jihad” with all the attendant atrocities (Ma Hualong, the original leader of the revolt, was a sheikh of a Sufi order founded by a scholar who studied in Saudi Arabia and Yemen).
China’s greatest enemy is, I would say, not the USA or UK, but Israel. The situation where Israel, through the political, financial and MSM/entertainment/advertising control of Jewish interests, has come to control Western power structures utterly is unprecedented in history, as far as I know. The Elders of Israel, human paragons like Netan-yahoo, Ovadia Yosef, Bennett, Lieberman, Sheldon Adelson, Bernard-Henry Levy et al are living the embodiment of their religious dogma that they are the ‘Treasured Nation’ superior in essence to non-Jews, and Divinely ordained by their God to rule over humanity. As Ovadia Yosef observed to his congregation’s intense mirth, ‘..the goyim only exist to serve the people of Israel’. Not that any public figure in the West dared notice or, Heaven forfend, object.
The one fly in the ointment is China. In China Jews cannot pass themselves off as locals and there is no history of Chinese repression of Jewry to stoke shame and facilitate Jewish influence-mongering. No Sinozionist movement will grow to mimic the Christian Zionist Sabbat Goy Toys. The political system is remarkably stable and immune to foreign corrupting interests. So China’s rise to global economic hegemony, where the Jews and Israel will almost certainly be treated as just another country and people actually subject to International Law, not protected at all times by slaves who just happen to notionally control the global hegemons, represents an existential threat to all that the Jewish elites have worked assiduously to cultivate. Of course this situation will redound to ordinary Jews’ advantage in that the end of the era of Israeli contempt for International Law and the basic decencies of the world (which, of course, Israel is by no means the only traducer of-just the most arrogant)will, hopefully, reduce the risk that an explosion of resentment against Israeli crimes and aggression will lead to unfortunate consequences for everybody.
Thanks for the update info A Kulak
Also concerning Donetsk getting a hammering yesterday, including incendiary munitions.
Seems Ukraine is no longer flavour of the moth, also no news on mainstream media outlets – too much other terror and crisis?
Please will someone let me know which in their opinion is the best news outlet source for Ukraine? Thanks.
Michael Collins @ 05 October, 2014 19:01
[i]”there are legitimate demands of the Chinese people that need to be recognized. “[/i]
Agreed, the people of Hong Kong have legitimate grievances. However, these are largely local leftovers from the colonial era and have little to do with Beijing.
The most serious is a grotesque wealth gap, and the local govt has historically been unable/unwilling to act vigorously to fix it. Combine that with across-the-board, sky-high housing costs, and it’s not just the youth that are in need of redress. The vast majority of HK-ers are much poorer than the city they live in, and a big advance in social justice is in order. One hopes the HK elite got the wakeup call, but I fear that the demand for “universal suffrage” simply picks a quarrel with Beijing and may derail this real issue. If it does, the people of Hong Kong will not have advanced a single step and are quite likely to have stepped backwards.
[i]”You can’t tell a people that things are getting better when you take away fundamental rights.”[/i]
Um, what rights were taken away? In 2017, for the first time, all eligible HK-ers can vote on a Chief Executive from amongst a collection of vetted candidates. Under British rule, they had no such right. In fact they had almost no rights at all.
That the candidates will be vetted for loyalty (foreign agents need not apply) is, if anything, a wise restriction compared to the faux democracies prevalent in the West where the candidates are de facto vetted by lavishly funded special interests. One glance at what happened to Ron Paul should be enough to persuade the most myopic that even the appearance of democracy is unimportant to the Western PTB.
Mulga Mumblebrain & WizOz:
Thank You re Tienanmen and China’s travails in the last 150 yrs! Couldn’t have said it better myself (and wouldn’t try).
Erebus
@ Alan King:
Why you have a problem with polyandry and sky burial?: Tibet has a high mountain climate with permafrost, and burning wood takes decades to grow. Sky burial is a excellent way to do a funeral in such an environment, there is absolutely no disrespect. The eskimos did practice polyandry, could have something to do with similarities in climate. Not for me personally, but why be judgemental?
Every culture has some degenerate aspects, Tibetan buddhism is no exception. The same branch of buddhism is also found in Mongolia and Russia.
I would like to see some serious links to prove the dalai lama is a CIA traitor. Another explanation could be he has indeed sometimes cooperated with the CIA to further the interests of his people. He has cooperated with Mao in the past.
His visit of the AEI is remarkable though:
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/02/21/at-american-enterprise-institute-neocons-say-hello-dalai.html
I have always respected this man very much, so it is very hard to see him as a traitor without very solid proof.
Note to the Saker: Both writers & commentators need to learn the art of writing concisely and succinctly! Way too much meanderings that make articles and comments easy to skip.
What Anonymous at 05 October, 2014 14:03 said about Yankee Democracy is so true “Dear Students”!
The people of Hong Kong, speaking as someone who is Chinese and who has lived in HK for one year, are interested in only three things: making money, making even more money, and making a humongous amount of money!
@The Wend and others who have a Tibetean bone in their throat: Tibet as known in the West is a Hollywood fiction.
Why are the Jews so interested in promoting the Tibetan cause with feature movies and top A-list stars?
Do they do the same for the Palestinians or Armenians or Iraquis or Afghanis (besides that Tom Hanks shill film for the CIA)?!?
The real truths about Tibetean Buddhism and its history: http://www.michaelparenti.org/Tibet.html
Some recommended reading:
http://orientalreview.org/2014/10/03/the-umbrella-revolution-and-secessionist-political-contagion-in-china-i/
Please note that there’s a Part 2 that should not be missed.
Andrew Korybko puts Hong Kong’s Umbrella Revolution in geopolitical context.
Erebus
@ Mulga Mumblebrain (1/2)
“Tibet when liberated by China was a brutal, primitive, theocracy, ruled over by a parasitic elite of priests.”
This is exactly the Chinese propaganda. But is is always the victor who writes history as many of us know. And I would add that before you globally judge a culture it would be wise to get acquainted with their mindset. I mean by that that I had lots of (private) contacts with Chinese (my conclusion: an extremely different mindset from ours, absolutely no notion of respect for other cultures) and for 4-5 years enough contacts with Tibetan refugees (my conclusion: extremely honest characers, very likeable, too honest for their own good) to get an idea of their way of thinking, so that I know a lot of small things that do not agree with the above statement. Consider the following:
-Tibet before the Chinese invasion.
Before 1950 Tibet was a neutral and peaceful country that threatened nobody. It had its own language, its own writing and its own culture and Tibetans most certainly did not want to be invaded by China. Tibetans were human like everybody else and certainly had their internal differences (and most likely their abuses too), but their overall orientation was above all Buddhist, which is a religion that is tolerant (!!!) and strongly meditative. But if the Tibetan „serfs“ were so mistreated and unhappy with the monasteries, how do you explain that all over the years of Chinese colonization, large numbers of ordinary Tibetans carried amulets with pictures of their religious leaders (some carried the Dalai Lama, some carried the Karmapa) ? This practice was so widespread that the Chinese finally forbade it. Currently the Chinese also examine the cell phones of Tibetans to check wether they carry pictures of their leaders. And Tibet has a number of religious festivals where great numbers of Tibetans pray for the health and the return of the Dalai Lama. The colonizing Chinese do not like this either and these festivals also are now more and more forbidden. And what about the 100+ self-immolations by fire inTibet (and not only by monks)? Unhappy serfs?
@ Mulga Mumblebrain (2/2)
– How honest are the Chinese declarations about the „happy family of minorities“ ?
A first basic fact is that the minorities make up 8% of the population while their territories make up more than 50% of the PRC. This means an extremely brutal colonization. And my personal longtime experience with a number of Chinese confirm their basic mindset of „we are superior“ and „winner takes all“.
Another significant fact is that the Chinese Constitution guarantees religious freedom and the use of their own languages to the minorities. This is the theory. Reality however is different: in Tibet over 90% of the monasteries have been destroyed, and the remaining ones house more police than monks. Religious festivals are being forbidden everywhere. On the language front, Tibetan as a language has been completely forbidden in all schools. And Tibetans who try to protect their language by supporting private schhols are persecuted, put into prison, tortured (systematically) and leave prison either dead or as lifelong wrecks. Constitution anyone? (hmm… btw what about the US constitution? Another similarity?)
Two interesting details about the Olympic games (2008):
I remember that the ceremonies included a dance of the minorities. But an observant reporter noticed that the clothes actually were from the minorities – but that the children performing the dance were all Han – respect for the minorities indeed. (I couldn’t find the ref. of this, sorry).
The final ceremony shown on the German ZDF program included a „translation“ of the Chinese national anthem. Some of the displayed lines were: „Let us fight for freedom, peace in the world and democracy“. You could try Wikipedia for the real translation but I found it so obfuscated as to be incomprehensible. I urge all those who are interested in an understandable translation to look it up at http://www.jamyangnorbu.com/blog/2008/09/25/toasting-the-olympics-with-toxic-milk/ and to read the associated comment.
My conclusions:
The Chinese propaganda about their minorities is just lies – just like the AZ propaganda. The love of Tibetans for their tradition and their religious leaders is also a fact. These facts can be verified by all the Tibet-support groups in the world (and I’ve personally never met a government shill in these organisations). And for those who think that the numerous pro-Tibet groups in all countries are either made up of fools or of knaves I have just one reply: don’t just repeat China’s propaganda but prove your point. And not to forget: what do you know about the Chinese national character ? And what do you know about the Tibetan national character? In other words who would you feel comfortable trusting?
Russia and china deserve all these destabilisations because they stupidly allow the evil american and british anbassadors to come in to their countries despite knwing their ill intentions.
Besideswhatchina stupid was thinking allowing parasiteenglish tosell yuuaan in london rather than in some european nations ?
A lot of rambling….
American NGOs involvement is clear. I think it will backfire, just like the M.E. is backfiring, they’ve lost Ukraine, Argentinian President giving the U.S. the middle finger about their vulture debt.
Now we hear Joe Biden accusing Turkey/Saudi Arabia/Qatar having created ISIS while the CIA was training them in Jordan in 2012. So the US neocons have entirely lost the control of their own script and they are running around like headless chickens looking to blame others for their own arrogance and hubris. Could not have happened to a nicer lot.
Russia and china deserve all these destabilisations because they stupidly allow the evil american and british anbassadors to come in to their countries despite knwing their ill intentions.
Besideswhatchina stupid was thinking allowing parasiteenglish tosell yuuaan in london rather than in some european nations ?
Shame on you who spread the communist propaganda about Tibet!
Since 2009. over 150 Tibetans died by self-immolation in protest of Chinese occupation !!!
Why would they do that if Chinese system is so good, hey ???
What is happening in Tibet is precisely the communist terror by Chinese government inflicted on the spiritually most advanced society in the world. Tibetans, who have produced possibly the most important spiritual book in the history of the world (The Tibetan Book of the Dead)are brutally terrorized by inferior materialistic communist-marxist Chinese occupators.
This has nothing to do with the Jewish control of Western civilization!
I would not go further. All of you who think that China is free from Zionist control, I can say that you are living in an illusion. Even Bakunin, who was an anarchist, described Karl Marx as an absolute Zionist and Rothschild-friend and communism was from the beginning intended to bring the Jewish control of the countries unfortunate enough to be governed by the communists. In Chinese cities they still have pictures of Karl Marx in public places! Would you prefer Marl Marx or Buddha ?
Free Tibet!
Regards from Serbia,
The Wend.
In Tibet in 1600 there was an internal spat, a civil war, and both sides appealed to the Emperor.
The Dalai? The Lama? the latest reincarnation of what?? Proof that reincarnation does not exist is that no one ever demands or supplies evidence for it.
Buddhism? The ideal achievement of the schmuks of the enlightened Gautama is escape from the cycle of rebirth that does not exist, escape into the state of perfect non-existence.
Don’t look now but the conscious state of perfect non-existence is Christianity’s essential definition of damnation, total rejection of him who ratifies his rejection of God who created and sustains all existence.
Nirvana describes hell exactly!
@Rootman & @Notsofast,
Do you really expect CIA operations and activities to be easily available?
Anyway, it’s clear you did not bother to check on the link provided by @AlanKing:
http://www.michaelparenti.org/Tibet.html
But here’s a couple of snippets:
1. on CIA involvment:
The issue was joined in 1956-57, when armed Tibetan bands ambushed convoys of the Chinese Peoples Liberation Army. The uprising received extensive assistance from the U.S. Central Intelligence Agency (CIA), including military training, support camps in Nepal, and numerous airlifts.27 Meanwhile in the United States, the American Society for a Free Asia, a CIA-financed front, energetically publicized the cause of Tibetan resistance, with the Dalai Lama’s eldest brother, Thubtan Norbu, playing an active role in that organization. The Dalai Lama’s second-eldest brother, Gyalo Thondup, established an intelligence operation with the CIA as early as 1951. He later upgraded it into a CIA-trained guerrilla unit whose recruits parachuted back into Tibet.28
Many Tibetan commandos and agents whom the CIA dropped into the country were chiefs of aristocratic clans or the sons of chiefs. Ninety percent of them were never heard from again, according to a report from the CIA itself, meaning they were most likely captured and killed.29 “Many lamas and lay members of the elite and much of the Tibetan army joined the uprising, but in the main the populace did not, assuring its failure,” writes Hugh Deane.30 In their book on Tibet, Ginsburg and Mathos reach a similar conclusion: “As far as can be ascertained, the great bulk of the common people of Lhasa and of the adjoining countryside failed to join in the fighting against the Chinese both when it first began and as it progressed.”31 Eventually the resistance crumbled.
2. On Tibetan women’s “rights”:
Not all Tibetan exiles are enamoured of the old Shangri-La theocracy. Kim Lewis, who studied healing methods with a Buddhist monk in Berkeley, California, had occasion to talk at length with more than a dozen Tibetan women who lived in the monk’s building. When she asked how they felt about returning to their homeland, the sentiment was unanimously negative. At first, Lewis assumed that their reluctance had to do with the Chinese occupation, but they quickly informed her otherwise. They said they were extremely grateful “not to have to marry 4 or 5 men, be pregnant almost all the time,” or deal with sexually transmitted diseases contacted from a straying husband. The younger women “were delighted to be getting an education, wanted absolutely nothing to do with any religion, and wondered why Americans were so naïve [about Tibet].”63
The women interviewed by Lewis recounted stories of their grandmothers’ ordeals with monks who used them as “wisdom consorts.” By sleeping with the monks, the grandmothers were told, they gained “the means to enlightenment” — after all, the Buddha himself had to be with a woman to reach enlightenment.
The women also mentioned the “rampant” sex that the supposedly spiritual and abstemious monks practiced with each other in the Gelugpa sect. The women who were mothers spoke bitterly about the monastery’s confiscation of their young boys in Tibet. They claimed that when a boy cried for his mother, he would be told “Why do you cry for her, she gave you up–she’s just a woman.”
Mulga Mumblebrain said :
“I pray, often, for there really to exist a ‘just and wrathful God’, for creatures like Cameron”.
A big Amen to that.
Mulga Mumblebrain I greatly appreciate most of what you write. You’re wrong about Tibet and China. As others have pointed out, you have it exactly backwards – which is the signature characteristic of propaganda that we can all recognize.
I’ve been Buddhist for about a decade, and my teachers have been Tibetans and their western students. I have many peers who’ve been to Tibet. My entire practice culture is replete with proofs and testimonies about the genocidal and unholy actions of the occupying Chinese.
As to the Dalai Lama and the CIA – he can only be as truthful as the truth he’s told, just like all of us. Someone would have to demonstrate the Dalai Lama as consciously lying to turn this allegation into a fact.
I’m rooting for Russia. Russia has common cause for a time with China. I actually wish China well too, and I rejoice to whatever degree it can help terminate the zionist evil. But I lament the tragedy of Tibet. The world is not an evenly balanced place.
China rots, unlike a fish, from all levels. So, beloved and brave Chinese youth, look left….look right…look behind….look in front and you may spot the scent of stinking fish amongst your collegues. This many learned from the Tienanmen Square episode. The rulers of China want too much authority, given their helplessness in cleaning up the corruption in China (at least Mao admitted that he was a failure in doing that). Indeed, many are utterly a part of it. Those who get rich rarely reach back to help their brothers with whom they had shared a precious bowl of rice for Chinese, more than any other people in the world, think of Karma for others and nothing to interfere with their own good luck. In Russia, corruption is only tamped down by national pride. Russians are willing to sacrifice almost anything for their beloved mother Russia– including the eating of their children by oligarchs with loyalty only to global currency.
But don’t look West for salvation as all you ever got from there is bad hedonic habits. Just look at Obama’s game with Ukraine, wherein a cooked-up revolution is headed by the very plutocrats that made Ukraine such a savage backward 4th World nation. Can you imagine: so much filth coming at Ukraine from the West that Putin is made to look like the good guy!
So, your lesson is clear: do nothing that makes things worse and replaces the shit of today with the shit of tomorrow. You need clean streets in Hong Kong, not debris from the destruction of every good thing that’s new floating in the shit of the long ages of China. Don’t depend on the moral outrage of the world to save you from the fearful pounding of China. The only thing that crook Churchill ever said that was right is the advice to “jaw, jaw, jaw….” instead of destroying what generations have sacrificed to build. You must find the soft paternal spot in the leadership of China. Look at the leaders’ medical records and then tell them: with your health future so bleak, do you want to die remembered as a vicious monkey king?
Russian youth has come to realize that in Putin’s heart there is a loving longing for a happy Russia in a prosperous and orderly humanity. The trick is to get him to realize how much he will love himself when he is himself, that self. There is reason to hope!
But the Chinese leaders are too insecure to even trust their wives and children. They know nothing but Mao and Obamma, neither of which was much of a success. It is, therefore, up to you to find those bonds that fortuitously have begun to be felt between Russian youth and Putin and have ceased to be felt between America’s youth and it’s leaders or the EU’s youth and its leaders, and pull on them until they feel deep inside the comfort of a happy new place where the older prepare for an honorable old age after setting the young on a right tract through jaw, jaw, jaw. That demands that you not be too infantile or too hormonal, too scared or too show-offy. You must be the best that you can be, the you deep in your human DNA folding souls. Rather than obstruct your parents, convince them that you want a better China for your children, their grandchildren. I wish I knew what to advise you but I can only say that in these days of pre-WWI land-grab and guns pointing fever it is up to you to show that your high-tech eyes see an alternative to wasting your lives squeezed into little holes in the useless Wall of China. You will revolutionize China, not for profit but for the meaning of your lives: to leave things BETTER than they were when you were born. Make your China appreciate that fact and you will win over the very leaders that oppress you for they rule with their knees shaking from fear at how nearsighted they were born and how farsighted their imaginations are thrusting them. All they need is for you to convince them: “Do not be afraid, for we will help you reach the Promised Land.”