Russia’s Interdiction of ISIS-Turkey Oil Trade and Attacks on Turkmen jihadi militants Poses Risk of Enlargement of Syrian Conflict
UPDATED
By: JiminNH
The increasing velocity of events in Syria indicates that the conflict may be ready to spill over into a larger conflagration and direct conflict between the forces of the AZ hegemon and the Resistance thereto. A couple of apparently un-related events have rapidly coalesced into armed conflict between an NATO member state and Russia, the consequences of which are yet to be revealed, but unlikely to be anything but more fuel on the fires of the not only the Syrian conflict but the war between the AZ empire and Russia.
Follow the Oil:
Followers of this blog are undoubtedly aware that Russian Pres. Vladimir Putin was outspoken in his comments at a post G-20 press conference on Nov. 16th regarding not only direct aid and support to ISIS by Western allied G-20 member states, but also the nature of those same Western allies who aid ISIS in the transshipment and sale of contraband ISIS oil.
The western “free press” has still yet to report on that presser wherein Pres. Putin stated that he provided evidence of “our data on the financing of Islamic State units by natural persons in various countries. The financing comes from 40 countries, as we established, including some G20 members”, and further where he told of providing imagery and intelligence data that shows the massive oil tanker truck convoys that ship oil from ISIS controlled territory, in his words “convoys stretching for dozens of kilometers, going beyond the horizon when seen from a height of four-five thousand meters”.
Source:
Readers to this blog are also probably aware of the deep ties between Turkish Pres. Erdogan and the various Wahhibi and Salafist groups in Syria, to specifically include Turkish collusion with ISIS in both military support as well as financial support. That financial involvement includes claims that Bilal Erdogan, the son of Turkish Pres. Recip Tayyep Erdogan, is the principal conduit of the transshipment and sale of contraband ISIS oil supplies, and that his company BMZ Ltd. owns and operates both the tanker trucks that send ISIS’s ill-begotten oil to Turkey, and from their onto Ceylan where it is sold on the world markets. BMZ also owns oil tanker ships that then transport the oil to end destinations, in EU markets, Japan and, reportedly, Israel.
Source:
In recent weeks, Russia has been straightforward in reporting its attacks on ISIS’s financial lifeline, i.e. the sale of oil. RuAF bombers and cruise missiles have attacked both oil infrastructure (tanks and transshipment points), as well as the fleet of oil tanker trucks that transship said oil to Turkey.
Sources: RT
and ZeroHedge
Not surprisingly, the Pentagon disputes those assertions.
Source:
Of course, it is only “coincidental” that the USAF-led “coalition” that has been putatively bombing ISIS for over 16 months failed to hit a single one of those convoys until literally hours after Putin’s as-yet unreported press conference.
Source:
Russia’s air war against the financial aid rendered to ISIS by Turkey and its western allies through the illicit and eminently illegal sale of stolen Syrian (and Iraqi) oil by ISIS through Turkey poses a dire threat to ISIS, as well as causes a catastrophic loss to Erdogan’s family business empire.
Russian Air Operations against Turkmen Militiants in Northen Latakia Province
In another sequence of event, Russia’s air expeditionary wing has been engaged in close air support and other air operations targeting the anti-Assad jihadi militias, including the al Qaeda/al Nusra affiliated “Turkmen Brigade”, in the northern Latakia province of Syria. In response to those punitive air operations, the Turkmen militants openly called out for help from Turkey against the RuAF. An article was posted on the Turkish newspaper Todays Zaman regarding the plea for help, in an article headlined:
“Syrian Turkmens ask for Turkey’s help under heavy bombardment by Assad, Russia”
Also days ago, Turkish P.M. Davutoglu warned Russia about bombing the same ethnic Turkmen militias in Latakia province.
Confluence of Events Leads to Direct Conflict
It appears that Davutoglu is a man of his word. These two events have coalesced into an incident whereby Turkish F-16 fighters have apparently shot down the RuAF SU-24 Fender bomber in Syrian airspace, with the pilot and navigator ejecting over Syrian territory. Reports indicate that the Turkmen militants exacted typical jihadi vengeance against the RuAF crewmembers by killing them while parachuting to the ground and/or on the ground. Reports also indicate that a RuAF search and rescue helicopted was likewise attacked by militants, the results of which are not known to this author at the moment.
Russian Pres. Putin has clearly articulated his viewpoint that Russia has been “stabbed in the back delivered by the accomplices to terrorists.” He stated emphatically that the Russian plane posed no threat to Turkey, and that it was operating solely in Syrian airspace against “terrorists” The implication is clear – he just called NATO member Turkey an accomplice to terror, not to mention the killer of two Russian servicemen. While there will undoubtedly be a duel of radar tracking to show whether or not the Fencer violated Turkish airspace, as claimed by Davutoglu, the reality is that a NATO jet just shot down the first Russian aircraft since the formation of the NATO alliance, an operation conducted in support of Turkmen jihadi’s and likely in revenge for Russia’s destruction of the ISIS/Erdogan Oil company.
Likely Outcome:
From this moment forward, we can expect that NATO will provide 100% support for the Turkish claims of the Fencer violating Turkish airspace. After all, since readers to this blog are fully aware that the multiplicity of Wahhabi and Salafist jihadi militants in Syria are but proxy armies for the AZ empire, and its armed forces in the form of NATO militaries, such an outcome is only to be expected.
The real question is what can we expect to be Russia’s response. Beyond FM Lavrov cancelling his scheduled meeting with Turkey, and his call for Russian citizens to boycott Turkey’s tourist destinations, we can fully expect Russia to respond in the military domain.
The respons is likely to be in multiple domains. Reports have already emerged that the Russian naval flotilla off Syria will provide heightened air defense coverage, likely moving naval assets closer to the Turkish/Syrian border.
In the air, at a minimum we coud anticipate that Russia will enhance its fighter cover in support of CAS (close air support) operations near the Turkish border. To accomplish that feat, it is likely that Russia will need to enlarge its air expeditionary wing in Syria with more advanced air-to-air combat fighters.
Russia may well enhance its air-to-air fighter assets in an effort to close of Syrian airspace to Turkish fighter/bombers, which have repeatedly violated Syrian sovereign airspace in operations putatively directed against the Kurds, but likely directed against the Syrian Arab Army and other Syrian assets in the “undeclared” war on the Syrian Arab Republic.
Another likely result is that Russia will formally recognize that reports of the presence of the S-400 SAM system is present in Syria, and that it will be employed in defense of Russian air operations over northern Syria. I would also anticipate that such surface to air missile coverage, perhaps the more mobile Sa-22 Pantsir SAM system, will be moved as far north in the Latakia province as possible to provide more timely protection to RuAF CAS operations.
If so, we will undoubtedly read of Russian SAM operators “lighting up” Turkish and other NATO jets operating in the border region, locking onto those targets with firing solutions in case those SAMS are actually deployed to prevent another shootdown of a Russian plane or to take down the plane(s) that engage in such an attack in the future.
Finally, other unconventional means of protecting airborne assets, such as electronic warfare operations conducted by the fleet, by airborne assets and/or ground based EW systems could well be used to shield and protect the bomber forces. The inherent risk of significant use of EW assets, however, would be that NATO could discover previously unknown Russian capabilities in that crucial domain and have a “head start” on developing EW countermeasures for the likely next phase of the AZ war on Russia.
The key question is whether this unjustified attack on the RuAF plane operating in Syrian airspace will be the incident that causes Russia to provide additional support to its air operations in support of Syrian sovereign rights of self defense in the form of introduction of ground forces. Such ground forces could now justifiably be deployed directly along the Syrian-Turkish border, at a minimum against the Turkmen Brigade which just butchered two RuAF servicemen, but perhaps more expansively along larger swaths of the open border and thereby help close off not only the NATO-ISIS arms supply lines (the reporting of which cost Serena Shim her life) but also the Erdogan family’s illicit enterprise of shipping and selling ISIS oil supplies in western oil markets.
Whatever the case, the gloves appear to be coming off, and those who back the terrorists in Syria, NATO member Turkey among them along with the AZ empire’s GCC allies of Saudi Arabia and Qatar, are increasingly easy to discern. The question is whether Turkey’s “throwing down the gauntlet” and challenging Russia’s air operations will be the trigger event for more conflict, or perhaps the warning shot that makes all parties realize the heightened risks of global conflict that the neo-Ottoman Caliph Erdogan attack against the Russian Air Force just engendered.
Respectfully submitted by JiminNH
JiminNH is a USAF veteran who resides in NH. The motto “Live Free or Die” on the license plate should not be just a quaint historical relic of a once great constitutional republic
Salam Everyone,
God Bless Donald Trump
Trump: ‘Many people jumped and I witnessed it’ on 9/11
About Time!
Rejoice,
Mohamed.
The only detained for celebrating in New Jersey on 9/11 I heard of were five Israelis.
Salam utu on November 25, 2015 · at 3:39 pm UTC
“The only detained for celebrating in New Jersey on 9/11 I heard of were five Israelis.”
How True!
Quoting my above post: “The Anti-Defamation League, meanwhile, criticized Trump’s account as “factually challenged.”
God bless Trump,
Mohamed.
The ADL take the prize for chutzpah! Denying the undeniable, but it makes you aware that they really fear this truth, so revealing is it of what actually happened on 9/11. Usually they’d concoct some stupid cover-story, which their stooges in the MSM would loyally regurgitate, or just ignore it, but outright denial, that’s very interesting.
Bullshit There were no airplanes. All CGI inserted video.
911 was an Inside job. Totally busted. But caused millions of death and wounded man, women and children in Iraq, Afghanistan and now Syria (etc Libye etc.)
Dearest Apollo,
Apollo’s quote:
“Bullshit There were no airplanes. All CGI inserted video.
911 was an Inside job.”
Totally agree!
1. Trump is saying that he was in New Jersey, when he saw people dancing in the streets.
2. At the same time he was in his New York (Manhattan) apartment and saw people jumping out of the windows.
Thus, the very first time the opening of the 9/11 discussions at a very high level. He is the top President Candidate from Republican Party.
Hellary is very quiet these days!
Rejoice,
Mohamed.
/the-nato-destruction-of-the-ruaf-su-24-fencer-and-turkish-murder-of-the-russian-servicemen/comment-page-1/#comment-179312
Seriously, the towers didn’t come down at the same time. nuff said.
RR
No, the towers didn’t come down at the same time. Donald Trump was in both New Jersey and New York at the same time.
How can Donald Trump be in two places at a single time? This is an impossibility. This is what I am pointing (saying) that it is impossible for Donald Trump to be at both places, i.e. New Jersey and New York at the same time.
Best regards,
Mohamed.
quantum tango.. I hear he is a good dancer..
I think Trump said he was in Manhattan, but saw people cheering on television.
Donald Trump says he saw people cheering 9/11 attacks in Jersey City – FOX NEWS, November 22, 2015
I don’t know what he saw but I think he’s not referring to Arabs, but to the dancing Israelis [Google].
Salam Lumi,
Lumi quote: “I don’t know what he saw but I think he’s not referring to Arabs, but to the dancing Israelis [Google].
I believe you are correct. About time the politicians to discuss this issue at the highest level.
Rejoice,
Mohamed.
Trump, as they all are (New York real estate, for crying out loud!) is a stooge of the Israel Lobby. He appears to be deliberately confusing the ‘dancing Israelis’ with Palestinians. I doubt that it is accidental.
Correct!
So few have figured out that basic fact.
But in 2001, remember there was NO digital TV broadcast signals; it was all the old NTSC analogue standard.
So, it produced analyzable obvious flaws when the digital masks were added into that analogue signal to be pushed out over the (now defunct) TV narrowband VHF & UHF bands.
Hence the huge push a half-dozen years ago to get everyone out there & buy a hi-def noo digital TV, with a government voucher, yet.
So the next epic production won’t have those flaws.
As a retired CGI professional I can attest that it was pretty damn shoddy work they tried to foist on us that day. This is probably the most persuasive and comprehensive documentary about the absolutely controlled MSM coverage of 911, must viewing if you haven’t seen it: September Clues. A forensic analysis of The Mighty Wurlitzer in action.
You are wrong, but also correct… You are correct in that there were not airplanes. But, to all observers and cameras there were… They were no photo shopped or graphic manipulation of any kind. They were advanced holographic imaging. This technology is now known! The military has been using it for decades…
Trump is amusing to watch much of the time. He is a cannon so loose that he often confounds the official lies. But he’s also a dangerous man. You might want to think twice before celebrating a guy who’s talking about surveillance on all American mosques, instituting a national database of all Muslims, and making Muslims all carry a special ID card. And we’re not even getting into what he wants to do to Hispanics.
Nonsense, resulting from unethical behavior by CNN (which deleted a crucial intervening sentence). Unfortunately, unethical is not illegal.
What crucial intervening sentence, exactly? Colour me unconvinced.
Meanwhile, if unethical were illegal, not only Trump but Clinton, all the Republican dwarfs, and even, I hate to say it, Sanders would be behind bars rather than running for President.
Why would you hate saying that about Sanders: he’s the worst kind of lying deceptive pig around.
Sanders is a lying pig who works for the same people that McInsane works for. The poor lefty dupes out there that believe the socialist swill he spews are sheep to slaughter to this fake “independent” candidate.
Why would you hate to say the truth about Bernie Sanders? He’s the Bernie Madoff of politics, he’ll bait and switch any of his duped fans, he”ll take your money and give it to his previous set of chumps, take the next guys money and give it to you all the while further hollowing out the economy of his “host”. Same goes for the souls and beliefs of his duped followers: he’ll steal their dreams and Rob them of their trust after he’s finished screwing the US he’ll get a reward for service – that is if that traitor ever gets to power.
USA President doesn’t make the laws, the President implements the laws.
What Donald Trump is doing is exposing 9/11.
The other day Ann posted a link to Rebekah Roth on some web radio. On the subject of 9/11 and the Israel connection. Go find her various Interviews on YouTube. It’s quite something. I’ve been wondering for a while whether you’re right, Mohamed … Man! If this is true and common people in the US realize what Israel has done … then what?!
Salam Lumi,
Thanks. Yes I have seen them. I forgot who posted the links to Rebekak Roth first but I remember that sister Ann kept on repeating those links in several threads. I also remember the Sampson option, but it is time now to discuss openly 9/11 at the highest level.
Kudos to Trump,
Mohamed.
Mohamed,
Thought the Sampson Option is a fantasy that the Israelis have, I doubt they’d do it.
About 70 % of Israelis have dual passports ( some even more than two). When they jump ship they need Europe and U.S. to land on. The Sampson Option would leave them with no place to jump to.
The wealthy Israeli Jews will not allow a Sampson Option, though they certainly dream of it. Fortunately, for the rest of us they KNOW ( though they may not admit in in public) they cannot survive without the REST OF US Christians and Muslims and OUR countries.
Btw……40 % of Israelis want to emigrate.
http://www.haaretz.com/print-edition/opinion/fear-is-driving-israelis-to-obtain-foreign-passports-1.365454
http://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/bye-the-beloved-country-why-almost-40-percent-of-israelis-are-thinking-of-emigrating.premium-1.484945
http://en.idi.org.il/analysis/articles/emigration-from-israel-%E2%80%93-the-overlooked-or-hidden-facts/
Regards,
Carmel by the Sea
Salam Sister,
I fully agree with you about their dual nationalities and also most of them are ready to leave, as the radicals are becoming very strong in Israel. Also, I agree with you about the Sampson Option that they will not use, and it is just hot air. Obama White House called, Netanyahu a chicken shit.
Now to reality. The USS Liberty was sunk by Israel on 8 June, 1967. Lots of Americans by know about it but they don’t care for one or more of the following reasons.
1. It happened long time ago.
2. They have loyalty to Israel.
3. They are trying to keep their heads above water.
4. Israel lobby is to strong.
5. They are scare of The Big Brother.
When 9/11 happened, if Dubya had come out and said it is Israel, he would have been impeached due to his incompetency. Within no time not only they identified that it is bin Laden but started preparing the nation for war against both Afghanistan and Iraq. The Israel Lobby was very strong in 2001, much more stronger than in 1968.
If anyone thinks that Americans are stupid and/or their leaders are not patriotic, they have something wrong in their thinking. With the help of both Houses, and both Parties, Obama got Iran Nuclear Deal and in the process made both AIPAC and Netanyahu history. The US Congress changed the title from “Treaty” to “Deal”.
The Treaty Clause empowers the President to make or enter into treaties with the “advice and consent” of two-thirds of the Senate.
It is about time that in USA people should discuss openly in public what happened on 9/11 at the highest level, especially at present both the Lobby and Netanyahu are both very week.
God is Greater,
Mohamed.
Salam brother Mohamed,
As usual you make sense. Yes, indeed genocidal maniac Netanyahu became history with the Iran Deal. He is no longer the “leading man” in the Middle East. Between the Iran Deal and Putin he’s done for.
I also agree with you in that it is high time the issue of 9/11 is discussed openly. Speaking for myself I have always since that day, believe the Israelis did it
Even without the information we now have and there is much nowadays, I smelled those murderous Israelis from far away.
Carmel by the Sea
The artists in the WTC are friends of friends of mine, so I want to inquire: Did Rebekah Roth, like, just ask them what went down — preferrably BEFORE accusing them of mass murder? That would be the polite thing to do …
Contact info:
http://www.gelitin.net/projects
Won’t ever stop to amaze me how the world is such a small place and acquaintances of people talked about on this remote spot on the outskirts of intergalactic thinking will invariably show up à propos in place and time …
As I can’t claim to be acquainted with either Rebekah Roth or the Israeli artistic agents in question, I can only refer to you to Rebekah’s homepage which features a contact form that you may use for the aforementioned inquiry.
I saw the tailgate party as well. I have no idea what they were celebrating but they were celebrating.
They are all Ukronazis now.
Almost all Anglo-Zionist newspapers support Turkey and terrorist against Russia.
NATO just made a huge blunder. Instead of being sorry, and calling Erdogan to “the carpet”…
NATO has, by their formal reaction, accepted the principle that, by International Law – if You are being attacked, You have the right to follow Your enemy and attack him on his own territory.
Some of the terrorists are based in Turkey. Expect Assad, with backing from Russia and their allies, to perform attacks inside Turkey.
This will call Erdogans bluff, as NATO will never ignite a WWIII, as long as Russia is allied with China.
But this is only my opinion – I may be wrong. May be WWIII is exactly what these crazy people want…
The Turks are now “thumbing their noses” at Russia: Turkish Prime Minister: I Gave Order to Shoot Down Russia’s Plane Myself, http://sputniknews.com/military/20151125/1030762042/turkey-davutoglu-aircraft-orders.html
It appears that this was a well-calculated move by Turkey & The Empire to make Russia appear weak, to effectively neutralize the hitherto successful image projected by Russia of being an unquestioned new military player on the world stage.
All the Russian protestations & warnings notwithstanding, it seems there is little that Russia can actually do now. If it reacts in a major military way, it will be badly cursed, but if it does not do so, it will be doubly cursed. Non-military alternatives are at least unclear. All we can do is wait for the events to unfold in real time.
The saved co-pilot has spoken – proves the filthy lies of Erdogan and Co. No warning; shot in the back; didn’t violate airspace – cowards!:
http://sputniknews.com/russia/20151125/1030742094/pilot-su24-resqued-no-turkish-space-violation.html
I wouldn’t be surprised that they tried to kill both pilots to keep them quiet……How will NATO play this now?
Turkish NATO false flag goes wrong for Turkey and US.
https://www.rt.com/news/323431-saved-pilot-turkish-su24/
‘Turkish jets gave us no warning before shooting’ – rescued pilot of downed Russian Su-24
Published time: 25 Nov, 2015 14:33Edited time: 25 Nov, 2015 17:41
” The 39-year-old airman, who
won the Top Navigator award at Russia’s biggest military flying competition last year,
says he will ask to return to front-line service as soon as he is declared fit. “
Because he (the navigator) wants to avenge the murder of his pilot and comrade. That’s a quoted from the BBC TV news service: they quoted it only once, then like the true psychopathically they are, they realized they let the truth slip out and excised that quote from all subsequent broadcasts.
I have just read a longish analysis of the current situation with the shootdown of the Russian plane, by Andrew Korybko, at Global Research.
It sounds quite subtle and convincing to me, but wondering what experienced analyst here think of his analysis:
http://www.globalresearch.ca/whys-the-us-hanging-turkey-out-to-dry/5491411?utm_campaign=magnet&utm_source=article_page&utm_medium=related_articles
Namely, it also sounds as though the Americans would have to be better chess players than Putin in order to put forth a gambit and arrange a board with the pieces arranged with the subtlety that Korybko hypothesizes . . .
But at the same time seems like we should consider the idea that the shootdown was some kind of “not what it seems.” The Americans could have put Erdogan up to it in order to better control him—just when he thought he would be able to get NATO behind him. Like, he walked out on a limb and the Americans are holding a saw . . .
Katherine
It’s important to keep in mind the schisms within the US powers, so when you say ‘the US supported something’ it’s ambiguous.
If you want American permission to do something, such as shoot down a plane, who would ask? The ambassador? your CIA contact? One of the senators or congressmen you know? The State Department? The Dept. of defense? (and who specifically within those agencies)? The office of the president? Obama himself? You won’t get the same answer from them all.
I was just about to write the same thing. One of the dangers of this situation is the reality that Washington is deeply divided between at least four major factions and those factions are, in the main, subdivided. This means that, at any time outside forces could push one or more of these factions into having greater influence. This puts more power in the hands of non-American actors.
Spectacular.
Thank you Katherine.
I would only suggest that Russia should avoid assisting with the partition of any country. The main beneficiary would be Israel. The benefits for the US and Russia, as described by Korbyko, may not materialize and the precedent is bad.
Re “I would only suggest that Russia should avoid assisting with the partition of any country. The main beneficiary would be Israel. The benefits for the US and Russia, as described by Korbyko, may not materialize and the precedent is bad.”
That is pretty much my thought. Like, Russia shouldn’t let itself be tempted to go out on a limb like maybe Erdogan has been tempted to do. In the case of Russia, that might be getting drawn into the neato idea of creating this Kurdistan state, and then it turns out that this statelet becomes a continuing destablizing factor for everyone. It can play off the two suitors (representing the unipolar and the multipolar worlds as represented by I guess the AZs and the Russians) against each other. Who has time for such nonsense? Lots of scheming etc This souinds to me like a big waste of time and energy..
It can create headaches for Turkey, too. but is that really good?? Wouldn’t it be better to aim for encouraging democratic processes that result in reasonable leaders and governments in the countries that already exist, have armies, embassies, universities, etc.?
Even to encourage the creation of such a state within Turkey would seem to have downsides because it increases unpredictablitiy and also state accountability. Just another can of worms.
Putin sticks up for Syria partly because he sticks up for the idea of sovereign states. Encouraging one little new state whether as part of Syria or part of Turkey would seem to set a bad precedent for Russia itself. And really the wrong kind of “congruence of interests” with the Americans, seems to me.
Even a loose cannon like Erdogan must know it’s insane to provoke Russia. Shooting down the jets was heinous and unnecessary even if they actually did cross over Turkish territory for a few seconds. Could it have been planned by anti-Erdogan elements within the Turkish military? I’m sure there’s a lot of bad blood since Erdogan’s Islamists moved to reduce the power of the generals. If the Russian reaction caused an economic crisis in Turkey, the military could take advantage of the resulting chaos. I wouldn’t be surprised if we saw some a coup attempt in the upcoming months.
I’ve heard that Ergodan put all the serious opposition in jail before the election and that the election was rigged right from the get go….so therefore the population is probably intimidated by the tyrant and his devils….
And I think that this article is right on the money about the reason for the attack…revenge for bombing the oil trucks…
My guess is that Ergodan is a total egotist and probably is angry about his son’s losses…what fools the guys that pulled off the technical part of the shoot down are…idiots…hopefully Turkey doesn’t have nuclear weapons.
Ann, all the opinion polls before the Turkish election pointed to a stalemate as in the previous election, but-lo and behold-Sultan Erdogan won a famous victory. If it had happened in Russia or Iran the Western MSM presstitutes would be screeching their carapaces off.
Russia under Putin’s leadership has shown time and again that decisions are made calmly, rationally and with foresight. I do not expect Russia to depart from that modus operandi irrespective of what just happened. The account with Turkey will be settled, but at a time and place of the Kremlin’s choosing.
In the meantime bring in the S-400s, seal off the Syrian Turkish border, ensure that bombers are escorted and unleash the Spetsnaz to hunt down the likes of Alpaslan Celik and liquidate them ruthlessly and methodically. In doing all this Russia must continue to make no distinction between these Terror Groups and the so-called ”moderates”. There are NO MODERATES!
NATO for its part can either bring Erdogan to heel or prepare to face the consequences- but they should first familiarize themselves with Russia’s revised Nuclear Doctrine.
Welcome Jim in NH.
Russia will destroy the Turkmen.
Notice, Syrian planes flying in the same zone were not shot down. They wanted the Russian plane.
Even the Syrian helo that rescued the shot down crew of the Russian helo was not shot down, though the videos showed Turkmen with MANPADS.
It was all about nailing a Russian plane. Clearly, a kill for Obama and the Hegemon.
It is larger than Turkey’s madness.
Retired USAF General Thomas McInerney stated just minutes ago on Fox Business channel that the shoot down was illegal, preplanned, immoral and outrageous. That NATO should condemn it.
His reference was four and half years as General defending Alaska and said he intercepted Russian planes a thousand times and they never had an issue between Russians and US. Overflight of territory is normal, happens all the time and there are interception rules that are used. The F16s did none of the normal things and merely followed orders to shoot the Russian plane out of the sky.
He was outraged.
He also stated the S400 closes all airspace over Syria, seals it except against fully stealthed planes.
He expects that some day in the months ahead Russia will take down an F16 if things continue as is.
He suggested the US should be working with Russia and complimented their air operations as working within International Rules of Warfare very effectively.
He is no Russian lover. He is a very razor edge military man. But he is honest and outspoken.
He does not think the US wants to defeat ISIS.
yes, it looks as if the US military and the deep state spokesmen are reading from different play books
Former Vice Chief of Staff of the US Air Force, Lt. Gen. Tom McInerney, told Fox News: “This airplane was not making any maneuvers to attack the territory…it was probably pressing the limits, that’s fair. But you don’t shoot ’em down just because of that.”
“I don’t really trust President Erdogan in what he is doing,” he added. “I think it was an overly aggressive maneuver and at NORAD [North American Aerospace Defense] command region we would not use this kind of rules of engagement. That had to be preplanned.”
“From this moment forward, we can expect that NATO will provide 100% support for the Turkish claims of the Fencer violating Turkish airspace.”
Yes, they would, if they could.
But the Turkish position is – unfortunately for the creators of the fantasy army known as ISIS – simply untenable in this case.
It was an ugly and cowardly ambush.
The facts are obvious. And more facts will soon be known. So instead of covering Erogan, the US, the EU and NATO will be forced to distance themselves from him. And be it only as a face-saving exercise.
Erdogan just made the biggest mistake of his life.
Yes it was an ambush. I am sure it was planned and coordinated with some elements in US and Israel. Yes, Erdogan may pay the price for it. But what would it be? I am sure that Putin knew of such a possibility form the day one. The question is what did Russia plan for such an occurrence? I do not see much indication that they have a Plan B. In fact one can think that Russia has no means for a Plan B. Conventional forces of Russia are too weak and Russia cannot project its power far beyond its border, even to Turkey if challenged. All the talk now about the cruiser Moskva, S-400, fighter protection seems like afterthoughts and half measures only. These half measures, if they were in place yesterday, could not prevent what happened yesterday . I am sorry to say that to an objective observer, observer who nevertheless sympathizes with Russia’s mission in Syria, Russia seems awfully ill prepared for such an mission. Putin knew it. It was a gamble. It was his gambit. But the Empire using Erdogan’s hand executed a check mate move. Russia has no means to retaliate. At least I do not see it. And w/o the retaliation things will not be the same. Russia and Putin have lost face. Nobody should expect that western MSM will show any understanding or sympathy. The western MSM are the main weapon of the Empire. That has been known as well.
The problem here has nothing to do with force projection. Turkey is pretty dashed close to Russia; if the Russians wanted to do Turkey over bad, they could. Invade and hold? No, we’ve seen how hard that can be nowadays when the citizens hate the invaders. But, blow away a lot of stuff? Oh, sure.
The problem is that that would mean war with NATO, which in turn would mean WW III. The question isn’t what can Putin do, the question is what can Putin do without ending the world. And there Putin does have a lot of constraints. If it were me, I would be very tempted to have assassinated whoever is standing next to Bilal Erdogan, president Erdogan’s son who buys the oil from ISIS, and quietly pass the word “We could have executed your son for his terrorist activities. We chose not to. Don’t make us regret that choice.” I do think he has some avenues, and I don’t think in the end this will be worth it for Erdogan, but he is constrained.
It’s certainly a problem, and solutions tend to make the logistics worse. For instance, close fighter escort for all the bombers anywhere near Turkish airspace means fighters taking up more airbase, leaving less room for the bombers. Fewer bombers, fewer sorties, less pressure on ISIS.
On the third hand . . . this event can be effectively obfuscated by the media in North America and much of Europe. But in less aligned places, like say the Stans and other bits of Central Asia where they’re worried about Islamic terrorism but not really in the NATO corral, I suspect this event is going to play poorly for the West.
@utu
I just don’t agree with your assesment, Russian has shown superbe and fluid planning and execution. They have demonstrated force projection in multiple fronts including, most recently, via 24 hour strategic bomber sorties. They seem to have gamed out several situations: they had pre-delivered and installed the S-400 radars w/o the missiles (so saker and cassad were wrong, the S-400 was not deployed, but ready to go), the missiles and launchers are now on their way to Syria according to the Russian MoD. That clearly indicates forethought (already having most of the S-400 components in theatre, and only operationalizing it when such an incident occurs), a tactic that turns a supposed setback into an advantage each time. This stupid move by the Turks will make their planes sitting ducks if they try to cross over into Syria to bomb the Kurds (checkmating any US-NATO objections since the Kurds are US allies). So the Turks have only limited their options while expanding Russia’s options.
Russia is not weak, on the contrary, that nation seems to getting stronger with each development.
@ Anonymous on November 25, 2015 · at 11:32 pm — hey had pre-delivered and installed the S-400 radars w/o the missiles (so saker and cassad were wrong, the S-400 was not deployed, but ready to go), the missiles and launchers are now on their way to Syria according to the Russian MoD…
You are dead right, brother
/the-nato-destruction-of-the-ruaf-su-24-fencer-and-turkish-murder-of-the-russian-servicemen/comment-page-1/#comment-179274
One plane goes down after 7 1/2 weeks surrounded by hostile Nation’s that have been waging war there for four years…..and it had to be an ambush besides….after having concluded MOU that all coalition members adhere to proper contact protocol so as to avoid mishaps….plan B is continue bombing the HECK out of NATO ISIS and if anybody get’s in the way shoot them down. It’s all in the memo.
RR
The pilots statements should be broadcast throughout the World.And especially throughout every “nook and cranny” of Russia.The people of Russia and the World need to know the truth.And expose the Turkish government for the liars and murderers they are.Then I would ask the Russian people how they want this handled, if I was advising Putin.If they demand vengeance and retaliation.Then so be it.Or,if they want Putin to handle the situation as he thinks best.Then also,so be it.But let the choice be the people’s,the dead heroes were sons of the Russian people.
My feelings on the situation and what should be done are portrayed in this music:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fWDgs34wilk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UvG8khJ9k7I
What if the people demand all out nuclear war against America who is behind all this and has caused Russia so much suffering? The war that Putin is trying to avoid and may yet? Still want a referendum? You may not like the results.
“The surviving pilot of a Russian plane shot down by Turkey on the Syrian border has said no warning was given.
Capt Konstantin Murakhtin told Russian television there was “no way” the jet could have violated Turkish airspace, as Turkey said it did.”
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-34925229
“An American military spokesman in Baghdad, Col Steve Warren, told reporters that recorded communication between Turkish and Russian pilots showed that the Turks warned the Russian plane 10 times before shooting it down.”
Who you going to believe ? someone who was there,or a Yank spokes model/person ?
Did the pretend officer produce the taped traffic recordings ? er.. No !.
Warnings were given every day.. You are approaching Turkish air space.. Big deal.. they were in Syrian air space and no country can give warnings in someone else’s air space.. And Turkey every single day violates its neighbors air space.. And as long as you are flying inside your approved air space turkey can shove it. Remember Turkey considers 5KM inside Syria as Turkish air space which Russia does not recognize and I bet 100% if Turkish jets try to enforce that, they will be targeted and shot down.
According to the NY Times the tapes with the warning were played at the NATO meeting.
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/11/25/world/europe/turkey-syria-russia-military-plane.html
So what?! anyone can make a tape, the MSM assesses the viewership & readership of the West as being severely stupid (sadly its probably close to the truth).
Uh look there’s an audio tape that prove that extraterrestrials like to violate Turkish airspace, here’s the transcript:
Turkish ATC: “fast moving object you are abbroaching Turkish airspace at Mach 50, please turn back or you will be violation of our airspace”
ET: “(total silence)”
Turkish ATC: “unidenfied flying object approaching Turkish airspace faster than any man made craft ever could at your present speed and heading you will be over Ankara in under 3minutes, please turn back or we’ll be forced to throw a hissy fit!!! Turn back now!!”
ET: “(total silence)”
There see now we have absolutely unassailable proof that ETs like to violate Turkish airspace. Because the Turks provided us with an audio tape!
Turkey: Oh, and BTW, we shot at E.T. and may have made an interstellar power mad. Does Article 5 cover us?
NATO: …
Article 5 is like dodgy insurance coverage; you’re not necessarily as covered as you think.
“What it means ultimately is that Article 5 requires nothing from anybody. Every country can react as they see fit. Countries don’t have to participate.” – Stephen Saideman, the Paterson Chair in International Affairs at Carleton University, regarding France’s invocation of Article 5 wrt the Paris Attacks and Canada’s commitment.
http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/paris-attack-france-nato-canada-article-5-1.3327041
Now, by supporting Turkey against Russia, USA has come out in the open that they are more concerned with ousting Assad than countering ISIS, who are joined with the Syrian ‘rebels’ and both facilitating the US agenda. It means that the US is in fact Assad-centric and would rather aid and abet ISIS to achieve their aims.
From Afghanistan to Libya and now in Syria, it is fantastic to observe how the Americans create “Rebels” against the regimes they want to destroy. Americans have fought pseudo-wars since Vietnam and have lost each eventually. The Afghanistan cannot be considered as US victory against the Russians as the Russians coolly went back while the Americans are losing their soldiers almost daily there.
Oh! It is oil after-all, they are there in ISIS controlled part of Iraq and Syria, why can’t the Americans arm-twist the ISIS in a deal “oil-for-arms (to be air-dropped too)!”
For once, the world realise the US vs Russian rivalry and support Putin.
“From Afghanistan to Libya and now in Syria, it is fantastic to observe how the Americans create “Rebels” against the regimes they want to destroy”.
It goes back even longer than that as the long suffering people of Latin America will tell you. Try the contra death squads in Nicaragua which they have modelled their middle eastern “rebels” on. And as for their continued presence in Afghanistan they are only there for the opium poppies, the cultivation of which has simply gone off the charts since the Americans arrived. They are leading a global drug running cartel using their jihadi cut throats to transport the stuff. These scumbags make the Gambino family look like boy scouts.
Know the truth, the USA has terrorised Latin America since the Monroe Doctrine of the 1820s, 200 years of invasion, subversion, the imposition of fascist despots, exploitation and the creation of numerous death-squads, killing millions and keeping hundreds of millions in poverty and squalor. And the Monroe Doctrine went global after 1945, and into overdrive after 1989. The USA, in my opinion, represents ultimate human Evil, and the death-knell for our species, due to numerous unique factors that made the governing US elite the collection of diabolical psychopaths that they are, and the US population so overwhelmingly brainwashed, ignorant, co-opted and jingoistic.
Good news from RT about the one surviving pilot
http://russia-insider.com/en/one-2-russian-pilots-shot-down-turkey-rescued-back-airbase-syria/ri11442
Yea he also gets a hero medal.. He was rescued by SAA and HEZ special forces!! Why RT say Russian?????? Russian special forces where hiding in a house..
YPG attacking erdo’s terrorists.. Most likely to cut off the supply rout to Aleppo and linking up with their faction holding parts of it. Before when they tried to move, Turkey bombed them..
More great news.. Militant ACTIVIST: A #FSA Brigadier General “Rashid Bakdash” killed by #SAA #NDF Today!
Elijah J. Magnier @EjmAlrai ·
I was told that #Russia is very keen to support the #Kurds now more than ever
Syrian Kurds are ready to start cooperation with Russia to combat terrorism in the country, Salih Muslim Muhammad, the leader of the Kurdish Democratic Union Party (PYD), said.
“Until now we haven’t had the opportunity to establish cooperation with Russia. But we would be happy if such opportunity appears. Russia hasn’t yet approached our region as it is active in the West. I think in the future we’ll be able to establish a dialogue on military cooperation with the Russian side,” he told Sputnik.
@ mmiriww on November 25, 2015 · at 6:12 pm UTC — Russian special forces where hiding in a house
Isn’t it reasonable to beleive Minister Shoigu, and not you in this case ?
That was from one of the people who went to rescue the Russians so give it up.. Not a single word about the Hez who risked their lives to save the Russians. Even if ‘some’ Syrians were mentioned.. Who trained the Syrians as well? Some of them were even shown in the picture with the rescued navigator as well.. Then again the Anna news crew who were used as translators were not mentioned.. So Russia is still trying to please Israel.. Other wise they would have mentioned that the Hez is the front line troops taking on terrorists.. Almost 700 of them have died..
And then again, frankly I don’t care who believes me.. Neither do I care what others believe.. Accept everything with a grain of salt as any real valid information is as precious as gold.. Hence I notice all and accept little.. Because everything might have some truth to it.. Like we now know the Russian marine was hit in the leg and neck while running for cover from the helicopter.. We don’t know when that was.. Was he planting explosives before that? Or did he die when the TOW missile hit.. Would any of it make a difference? Not really.. he died doing his duty.. maybe knowing more makes his death more meaningful in way but he died no matter what.
Sadly, at the cost of one Marine, Aleksandr Pozynich.
https://www.rt.com/news/323527-details-su24-pilot-rescue/
“BMZ also owns oil tanker ships that then transport the oil to end destinations, in EU markets, Japan and, reportedly, Israel.”
Israel, gee, what a surprise.
Memorial at the base for the Pilot..
https://twitter.com/sayed_ridha/status/669537248749076480
Rescue team that rescued downed #RuAF pilot consisted of 18 #SAA SF & 6 fighters from #Hezbollah
Navigator is not leaving Syria… “I’m going to ask our command to keep me on this base — I have a debt to repay, for my commander.” #RuAF
RuAF pilot of #RuAF Su-24: There were no warnings given by #Turkey, we did not enter Turkish airspace, I know area like the back of my hand
Unlike (some) Turks, #Russia-ns were able to find the right embassy to throw eggs at :)
Following downing of #RuAF Su-24 by #Turkey, #Russia said that incident would not deter them from carrying out airstrikes on Turkish border
Body of ex #Iran envoy to #Lebanon; Ghadanfar Roknabadi who disappeared during Hajj stampede has been ID’d/returned
SAA regain points on Mt Zahia in Jabal Turkmen which was taken by #JN when #Turkey shot down #RuAF Su-24 yesterday #Latakia
Russian Air Force responds to Turkish military aggression by increasing the number of airstrikes over Latakia:
Terrorists Fleeing Syria’s Lattakia in Hundreds after Army’s Large-Scale Operations
Russian President Vladimir Putin Wednesday underlined his country’s determination to defend the Russian military forces operating in Syria against any threats by terrorists or any enemy country.
The Russian Air Force did not need to attack Turkey directly in order to retaliate; instead, they have responded to the Turkish military aggression with an increase in the number of airstrikes over the Turkmen Mountains (Jabal Al-Turkmen), Kurdish Mountains (Jabal Al-Akrad), and the Prophet Jonah Mountains (Jabal Nabi Younis) of northern Latakia.
According to several battlefield reports from local sources in northern Latakia, the Russian Air Force’s SU-24 fighter jets and their MI-24 Hind Helicopter Gunships have already conducted three dozen airstrikes over the Turkmen Mountains, Kurdish Mountains, and the Prophet Jonah Mountains, while following the same route their downed pilots took the day they were shot down by the Turkish Air Defense.
The field source further added that the Russian Air Force has been ordered to respond to any-kind of provocation next to the Turkish-Syrian border; meaning, the Russian Air Force has been given the green light to retaliate against any group that fire on their aircraft.
The Russian Federation’s president, Vladimir Putin, has stated that Russia will not militarily retaliate against Turkey; however, he did warn that any future attack on Russian military assets will not go unpunished.
http://www.almasdarnews.com/article/russian-air-force-responds-to-turkish-military-aggression-by-increasing-the-number-of-airstrikes-in-northern-latakia/
Russian defence minister Shoygu: Russia ready to work with Egypt against IS branch in Sinai
Russia to consolidate anti-terror efforts with Egypt – Defense Minister
https://www.rt.com/news/323350-shoigu-sinai-plane-crash/
Okay so Mohamed was right on that point.. But not on the many others..
Living and working in Qatar since September, this greatly concerns me, especially since the Russian military has proven it can strike Qatar from the Caspian Sea!
In the meantime I think Russia can return the favour by firing its S-300s/S-400s at any Turkish aircraft as soon as it crosses 1 milimetre into Syrian airspace. As hard as it may be Putin must still keep the moral/legal high ground.
This latest incident also risks pushing Russia deeper into mission creep. Ground forces are needed to seal off the Turkish-Syrian border; unless Iran does it, Russia + CSTO could end up being pressured to do so.
/the-nato-destruction-of-the-ruaf-su-24-fencer-and-turkish-murder-of-the-russian-servicemen/comment-page-1/#comment-179272
Doesn’t ISIS have an embassy in Qatar? I was hoping Russia would send a few cruise missiles that way myself.
Cheers,
RR
Lavrov being unusually blunt:
Downing of Russian Su-24 looks like a planned provocation – Lavrov
https://www.rt.com/news/323404-lavrov-syria-s24-turkey/
The way USA, nato, eu closed ranks immediately, shows all of these were involved in setting up this provocation. The way the zio-media have portrayed this provocation very uniformly shows the zionazis are also deeply involved in the setting up this provocation.
Hi Jim, thanks for this. The navigator pilot said (from RT) that there were no warnings:
He said: “You need to understand the difference in speed between a tactical bomber like a Su-24, and that of the F16. If they wanted to warn us, they could have sat on our wing”
??
Can you translate this for the non-military people?
Was there a dog fight between the two planes? Is there any way the Russian pilot could have avoided being shot down once the other plane made its hostile move?
There’s a standard interception procedure for pilots who have been intercepted by a military jet -usually because they have strayed into restricted airspace or because of an emergency requiring nearest runway.
Here’s the FAA’s US procedure -a series of signals to assure compliance and prevent any escalation of the situation:
https://www.faasafety.gov/files/gslac/courses/content/24/293/Interception%20Procedures.pdf
Here’s a game version -perhaps the Turkish pilots were trained by this:
http://wiki.flightgear.org/Aircraft_interception
PCR pulls no punches:
http://www.paulcraigroberts.org/2015/11/25/turkey-is-lying-paul-craig-roberts/
Serbian girl on November 25, 2015 · at 4:45 pm UTC
Hi Jim,[…..]
He said: “You need to understand the difference in speed between a tactical bomber like a Su-24, and that of the F16. If they wanted to warn us, they could have sat on our wing”. ??
It is standard practice for interceptors to draw level and either hand signal, to force down or wave off interlopers.
The interceptor fighters are a much faster beast.
cheers.
Hi Serbian Girl,
Others have responded, but I wanted to confirm as well.
The SU-24 Fencer is a bomber, not a fighter, and therefore not as fast or agile as a fighter like the F-16. There would have been no “dog fight” as you may think of it, as the Fencer can’t really fight.
When normally attempting to intercept another plane, the interceptor (Turkey F-16) would, if radio communication is not possible, approach the “offending plane” (Fencer) on the side, wing to wing, and signal, by hand or tipping of wings up and down, that he is intercepting the “offending plane” and diverting his course. That his what he meant by “sat on our wing.”
Turkey says the F-16 pilot communicated. The RuAF survivor says they did not give any warning. Only one can be true.
While a Fencer can be armed with air to air missiles, he could defend himself if he knew he was in a fight. I have no idea if the Fencer was armed.
Once his avionics and defense systems were alerted to a missile launch (assuming it was radar), he could only take evasive action and deploy countermeasures. If the killing missile was a heat seeking missile, and he saw it, he could deploy flares as countermeasures and hope they worked. If he didn’t see the missile and his avionics didn’t detect it he may not have known he was being shot at until it was too late to even do that.
Regards,
Jim
This article mentions some things about turkey/Erdogan that are probably also connected with provocation against Russia and indicate that Erdogan was fully behind the carrying out of this war crime, contrary to the supposition it was done behind his back.
Here is What Turkey’s Erdogan Fears Most
http://sputniknews.com/analysis/20151125/1030749446/turkey-erdogan-greatest-fear.html
“Unknown air traffic position onto Humeymim 020, redirect to 26 miles. This is Turkish Air Force speaking – en guard. You are approaching Turkish airspace. Change your heading south immediately.,” the Turkish officer was repeatedly saying.
There was however no response from the Russian side, which Al Arabiya’s source says has been the case for weeks.
The MEA pilot explained that from what he gathers, Tuesday’s incident was not the first as he had heard similar warnings over his radio transmission for the past month.
“I heard similar warnings two or three times a week, on every flight I took for the past month.
“What was different this time is that the Turkish officer was shouting and seemed tense, while the warnings were much calmer in previous times… this is why I knew something was going to happen,” he added.
“Turkey has indeed warned previous planes against entering its airspace on multiple occasions. This might have been a situation where Turkey simply felt they had warned them so much and now had to take action after being ignored,” Goldman said.
http://english.alarabiya.net/en/News/middle-east/2015/11/25/-I-knew-it-was-going-to-happen-MEA-pilot-recalls-downing-of-Russian-jet.html
So let m get this straight, the serial rapists of the weak is warning other countries? Turkey violated Greek air space over 2000 times just in jan 2014.. And routinely violates every other countries air space..
So a pro-jihadi website reports that. And people are supposed to buy that BS. I wonder if the Russian people will buy that. I doubt it.The call was “recorded”. Why would a plane record a random call they heard. And if they did,it certainly wouldn’t be from the start.There would be a “hmm,wonder if I should record this. For what reason I don’t know. But maybe I should”,then they would start recording. It also says he told the plane “you are approaching Turkish airspace”,not you are “in” Turkish airspace. A plane can “approach” all they want to. As long as the plane wasn’t “in” Turkish airspace the Erdogan stooges should shut their “pie-holes”.
Just a bully.. they push around everyone else but Russia is not everyone else.. Remember they shot down Syrian jets 5km inside Syria.. The Russian jet was only 1km inside Syria.. Erdo thinks since its in nato it can push anyone else around but I think soon S400 will ensure everyone respect Syrian air space in including Israel.. Syrian foreign minister also called out Turkish violation of Syrian air space and shooting down the jet.. Se the video clip.. shows contrails of the AAM inside Syria over head of the camera crew form anna news.. SU24 was shot down inside Syria no matter what.. Russia made 30 sorties in the last 8 hours using jets and helicopters in the very same area wiping out the kinsmen.. As well as 4 cruise missiles..
Very good.There certainly needs to be “heavy” punishment for those that murdered the pilot and the ones on the rescue helicopter. Shooting the plane down was horrible in itself. But murdering the pilot and attacking the rescue helicopter were “unforgivable” offenses. And need to be punished similar to Putin’s statement from years back, “if we find them in the toilet,we will waste them in the toilet”.
As a former air traffic controller, I can say that the quote at the beginning sounds like so much gibberish to me. I have no idea what’s attempting to be said.
It’s a pretty garbled transmission and does not contain expected radio protocol or readback request. The background voices you hear afterward transmission voice ends are indicative of a fake -it sounds like it was created in a boiler-room normally used for telephone scams.
I’d also like to know what radio frequency it was supposedly transmitted on and whether that was one agreed to and monitored by the Russian jets. You can transmit on endless frequencies that nobody relevant will hear.
Excellent summation. Thanks.
War is a business. 40 countries and many more individuals are in on the profit.
But war is something more: a passion, a displaced sexual fetish and a blood feud going back for millenia.
I was just reading Tolstoy’s Hadji Murat; it’s introduction mentions an early 1700’s war with Turkey and Russia’s subsequent conquest of the Caucasus, resisted by Muslims.
I recall the Russian philosopher, Irene Caesar’s contention that Russia’s real enemy is the Khazars who today are using Muslims as proxies. Russia destroyed the Khazar empire way back when. The Khazars adopted the Jewish cover and now might be called “Ziozars.”
Ziozars hated the Czars and still hate the Czars descendants. Khazars were traders all along the trade routes. Ziozars are still in the trading and money-changing business, now global. The Jewish state is still their cover. Their real objective is the restoration of the Khazar empire and world domination by trade and money.
The Khazars by blood are extremely aggressive and brutal and in mind are intelligent and clever. They have a long range plan that goes way back and into the future. They never forget what Russian did to them and seek total revenge. They have learned how to manipulate men and money.
Their blood lust is carried on by a select few, sometimes one man running a vast network of money and mercenaries.
Putin probably knows this. Irene Caesar says Putin was once in the employ of the Khazars as a double agent. He wanted out and they tried to kill him. Putin learned a bitter lesson and set out to save himself and Russia.
What I’m getting is that this war is a war of worlds apart. It’s a war for control of the world which is nothing new. What is new for me is the blood lust dimension which goes deep into time and space. I think I’m on to something but it’s dark and dirty, slippery and slimy and not something I can talk about in polite company.
Fortunately, I follow a blood line of love which is nothing of the sort described above. I’ve spent something like a half million words trying to track the story down and sort it out. In brief it’s Loverarchy and Patriarchy, The Lover and the Payer, Peace and War, Count Tolstoy and Count Dracula, Love and Lust…but words fail as they always do because it’s a matter of blood and heart, not matter and mind.
So I failed. So what? “We chirp and we chatter; what does it matter?” “I’ve had so little time to fail.”
“My love she speaks like silence
Without ideals or violence
She knows there’s no success like failure
And that failure is no success at all
My love winks, she does not bother
She knows too much to argue or to judge.”
-Bob Dylan
“I don’t get upset when I once again fail
It’s just the down time before going full sail
Love is the power that makes the world go ’round
I love in the hour my heart hits the ground”
-thelovegovernment.com
“Fortunately, I follow a blood line of love”
The blood line of love
is not a blood line at all.
Love transcends blood
transcends body and mind.
As does truth, as does trust
as we all intimately know –
We crystal clear vessels
of the blood line of love.
zweistein, who would ever have thought you were so poetically gifted… that is a lovely poem.
Humans are all in the blood line of love from our original ancestors who were lovers. The line was desecrated by patriarchy. Now we have mixed blood of lovers and killers.
There are ten tests to discriminate healthy blood from bad blood, five major and five minor with branches.
Major:
1. Thought
2. Diet
3. Pets
4. Marriage
5. Money
Minor:
6. Drugs
7. Contraception
8. Abortion
9. Prostitution
10. Pornography
“You are not to eat the blood of any flesh, for the life of all flesh is its blood.” Leviticus 17:14.
Out of the Arya nations i.e the slavs to the hindus only Bharat worships the mother still. Let’s hope they wake up out of secuarlism, because as Oppenheimer says: the maternal lineages of central south & mid east + europe begin in Bharat Varsh.
Yes. The Khazars. Or in religious parlance Gog and Magog. They are the helpers of the Anti-Christ. And most Muslims do not even know. Such a shame.
/the-nato-destruction-of-the-ruaf-su-24-fencer-and-turkish-murder-of-the-russian-servicemen/comment-page-1/#comment-179283
The human personality is highly malleable and can change in a generation depending on social conditions. I don’t put much stock in genetics myself other than the fact that their is only about a 2% difference between human and baboon or one of those families. Perhaps we are not to far from the tree after all.
RR
i have been saying this for a long count, the Mayans forecast this even gave a rough dead line by the end of the “4 consecutive blood moons” and the end the world will become more harmonious, the Khazars have failed, what we are seeing now is blood thirst, brutality.
There you have it. Davutoglu has practically admitted that the reason the Su-24 was shot down is that it was bombing a part of Syria that Turkey claims as its own territory. This is a very evolved idea of self defense.
Exactly ! ,this area that was the staging ground,marshalling area for the US/Saudi/Qatar funded and equipped anti-Assad army.
Standard MO, take a local grievance,fund it,fuel it with gasolene and invite any and all mercs, to join the gravy train, mucho US dinero, US $$$$$$$$$$$$$.
This is the birthplace of ISIS/ISIL/Daesh.
Destroy the placenta and the offspring dies,seal the Syrian/Turk border and onto the next confrontation with the evil Israhell and the caliph [insert name and US C.V.].
Setting up the Baghdad command and control centre,was in my view,a master stroke,legitimising the action by the allies,Russia,Iran,Iraq and Syria.
Iraqis want rid of all US presence in their country and the only way is to be no longer in need of US ‘help’.
When Empires enter your country they never ever leave!
witness:
Germany.
Britain.
Japan.
Iraq.
Kuwait
Bahrain
Kosovo
Afghanistan.
all the Nato countries and vassals.
For every US base in the world,there is a willing local ‘elite’ taking the US paycheck,hookers & ‘blow’.
and they are only the obvious ones.
Where is the Angel of death when needed ?
It’s interesting to compare Erdogan with Assad in the light of cruel, ruthless, bloodthirsty dictator. I don’t know much about Assad, but judging by recent events it’s Erdogan that comes off worse. Probably that’s why the Americans chose to back him.
Russian Su-30s strikes Al-Qaeda “Rebels” in Aleppo CS
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f4qbOWj9ofQ&feature=youtu.be
SU30?? I thought the SU30 and SU35’s were air superiority fighters… they are not generally used for bombing runs.. It is a multirole fighter for all-weather, air-to-air and air-to-surface deep interdiction missions. costs more and carries half the load of the SU34’s..
The stupid terrorists keep shooting guns at it. Most likely kill some civilians down wind.
Anna news has footage of the Su24 being hit filmed by own crew.. contrail shows the missile fired inside Syrian territory.. Russian marine hit by bullet in the neck.. Shows which house the helicopter crew hid in..
with English subs.. in Russian.. Footage of Syrian Army Rescuing Second Russian Pilot and Helicopter Crew
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=umsp9wIjolY&feature=youtu.be
So Turkey is going to accuse anna news of creating fake footage of the rocket hitting the SU24 inside Syria just above them?
It may just be as simple as reducing the gas flowing through the pipeline that Turkey is buying from Russia. No immediate military response needed. Of course Turkey has all the oil from ISIS to bargain with others for the gas replacement.
Good article with some good points to bear in mind.
http://www.paulcraigroberts.org/2015/11/25/turkey-is-lying-paul-craig-roberts/
Turkey Is Lying
Paul Craig Roberts
Tyler Durden at Zero Hedge has posted the flight paths of the Russian aircraft according to Turkey and to Russia. http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-11-24/17-seconds-changed-world-leaked-letter-exposes-turkeys-hair-trigger-reality
We know that Turkey is lying for three reasons.
One reason is that NATO governments lie every time that they open their mouths.
A second reason is that Turkey’s claim that the SU-24 was in Turkey’s airspace for 17 seconds but only traveled 1.15 miles means that the SU-24 was flying at stall speed! The entire Western media was too incompetent to do the basic math!
A third reason is that, assuming Turkey’s claim of a 17 second airspace violation is true, 17 seconds is not long enough for a Turkish pilot to get clearance for such a serious and reckless act as shooting down a Russian military aircraft. If the SU-24 was flying at a normal speed rather than one that would be unable to keep the aircraft aloft, the alleged airspace vioation would not have been long enough to be noticed. A shootdown had to have been pre-arranged. The Turks, knowing that the Russians were foolishly trusting to the agreement that there be no air to air encounters, told pilots to look for an opportunity. In my recent article, I gave a reason for this reckless act: http://www.paulcraigroberts.org/2015/11/24/turkey-has-destroyed-russias-delusion-of-western-cooperation-paul-craig-roberts/
Turkey’s explanation to the UN Security Council gives itself away as a lie. […]
The Independent. which is usually not particularly pro-Russia, is actually quite anti-Turkey this morning, with columns accusing Ergodan of ordering the shoot-down as part of some domestic political ploy and the lead story quoting the Russian navigator as saying that the Su-24 didn’t stray into Turkish airspace.
Good outline. Russia’s ambassador to the UN should do the same thing that these uSA did when they presented the evidence of missiles in Cuba. Call out the natural persons involved and use already existing UN resolutions to call Turkey a state sponsor of terrorism and by extension NATO. The Syria’s air space is now closed to all uninvited air forces. If France has come into some agreement with Syria, explicitly name France as exempted from the exclusion because France agreed to be under Syrian/Russian effective operational control.
Name names of the individuals involved in business with ISIS/L and demand that those individuals be either turned in to the World Court or to Russia or to Syria.
Russia has to go to the UN, preferably on a Monday or Tuesday, mid-day. It has to be such an extraordinary event that it cannot be ignored, and it has to be the news of the week.
Interesting if only for the pics:
NOV 25
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3333117/Downed-Russian-pilot-picked-Syrian-army-envoy.html#ixzz3sSw7Pa15
Check out this caption below its picture (a ways down the page)—looks like they’re mocking either Turkey or Putin, or both. They can read a calendar too, & it says that after 25 days from that Oct 31 Russia jet down over the Sinai he’s done nothing, remember that was 224 lives, so what do you think he’ll do now, or in the next 25 days from this recent incident?
‘Reducing tensions’: The Turkish army truck was pictured heading to the Syrian border near Yayladagi as Prime Minister Ahmet Davutoglu said he is seeking to reduce tensions with Moscow, calling Russia is Turkey’s ‘friend and neighbour’
A lot of the Turkish involvement with ISIS and AQ that is now becoming public knowledge and openly spoken about by Russia would have been known for a long time by most intelligence organisations including the French for some time.
Throws a bit more light on why the French didn’t ask for NATO involvement, even with US urging, after the Paris attacks.
I’m pretty sure Erdogan’s plan to ambush/murder was green-lighted by Obama’s neocon advisers as a reasonable way to increase the cost to Russia of fighting Obama’s “moderate” terrorists.
If it leads to actions that spool out of control? Well…who could have known…with Stalinesque control of the western media…there is no down side to Politician’s [D] or [R] advocating for wars of aggression anymore.
All I can recommend is that Putin regain his composure [he did seem to lose his cool] and continue down the path of independence from servitude. Absorb the cost imposed now, but think asymmetrically. The gulf states seem to be the weak link here, perhaps China could conduct joint exercises in the gulf with Iran?
I woke up this morning to Lavrov’s confirmation of something I suspected yesterday when I was looking at the radar flight paths released by Turkey… I was thinking, considering the speeds these jets are capable of, looking at the map and the area where the alleged airspace “violation” occurred, the Russian jet must have been in Turkey airspace anything between a few seconds to around five minutes tops. The question in my head was… how can Turkey deploy, intercept and issue 10 warnings to the offending intruder, all in a time window of five minutes maximum?
As I always say, I’m no military expert but one would imagine an operation like that would take several minutes… something like 20, maybe even longer, rather than five minutes, let alone a few seconds. The point is that this episode sounded dodgy from the start, even if I wasn’t spot-on on the technicalities.
Downing of Russian Su-24 looks like a planned provocation – Lavrov
https://www.rt.com/news/323404-lavrov-syria-s24-turkey/
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I’m extremely elated at the news that the second pilot was found and rescued, thanks to [from some unconfirmed reports I’ve been reading] an elite team comprised of 16 men, half Syrian forces half Hezbollah. But whoever they were: bravo gentlemen! Bravo!!!
-TL2Q
The Turkish/ISIS oil tanker convoys have been photographed and destroyed. The man in charge of the ISIS/Turkey oil operation has been named. What is Reuters leading headline?
U.S. sanctions businessman helping Syrian government buy oil from Islamic State
http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/11/25/us-mideast-crisis-usa-sanctions-idUSKBN0TE23P20151125
Propaganda/bending the truth is one thing, but this? Desperate times call for desperate measures from the US I guess. Or a total departure from reality.
Not even in the same league as what the Mockingbird Telegraph is pumping out 24th:
Until Turkey shot down a Russian fighter jet over its border with Syria on Tuesday, Vladimir Putin seemed to have convinced himself that Nato countries were just not serious about confronting Russia’s increasingly belligerent military conduct.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/vladimir-putin/12013896/The-Russians-had-it-coming-to-them.html
“And yet, until yesterday, Nato had done precious little to persuade Mr Putin to rethink his cavalier attitude towards other nations’ borders. ”
Ah, so — it was NATO who is responsible for shooting down the plane — admitted in this article. Well, good — now Russia knows who to blast for it: NATO, and any members of NATO is fair game to make war on.
Thanks for the tip, Con Coughlin.
Anon, that Telegraph piece was from Con Coughlin, a well-known fascist. If memory serves me well ‘con’ is a vulgar French term that just about suits Coughlin-if you do a gender re-assignment.
Even better—25th Wed now Turkey has switched its PR to outright claiming the rooskies are incinerating aid convoys to refugees!
Footage filmed at a crossing on the Syrian side of the border with Turkey’s southern province of Kilis showed trucks burning on Wednesday after what aid workers said was an apparent air strike.
Turkey’s state-run Anadolu agency said seven people were killed and 10 wounded in strikes that it said hit a convoy taking supplies to refugees in Azaz on Wednesday.
http://www.todayszaman.com/diplomacy_casualties-reported-as-airstrikes-hit-aid-convoy-near-turkey-border_405297.html
According to the refugees from ISIL-occupied Syrian provinces of Idlib and Aleppo, the militants are using Turkish lira as the main currency. The use of Syrian pounds is punishable by death, in keeping with ISIL’s version of sharia law.
The cash is being regularly supplied from Turkey’sterritory. Turkish soldiers are providing security for the shipments. In recentdays, Russian Aerospace Forces have been active in locating these columns and launching precise strikes against them.
Therefore the attack on the Su-24 is likely connected to the Turkish unwillingness to permit a large shipment of money to be destroyed, or to have such shipments recorded on video while crossing the border from Turkey under Turkish army escort.
This scenario is also supported by the fact that the Turkish fighter was patrolling only one sector of the border (which is confirmed by both Turkish and Russian information), and initiated the intercept of the Su-24while it was still approaching the border, before it even had a chance to crossit.”
http://southfront.org/su-24-shot-down-over-cash/
Moderate terrorists cursing erdo because Russia has stepped up attacks on them. Turkey moves tanks to the border… Russia has even bombed the border crossing into turkey held by the moderate kinsmen terrorists…
Gee guess erdo don’t want to send any more jets to show Putin whos boss?? And does he think even hundreds of tanks would make any difference?
Turkish tanks continue to be sent to the the border with #Syria as tensions with #Russia increases
Turkish trucks/TIRs were hit by #Russia-n airforce as they have just got in and gathered near Bab Al Salam gate
Russia bombs #Azaz today, the heart of the Turkish-aspired “safe zone” in northern #Syria.
Russia’n warplanes bombed the #Syria’n – #Turkey border crossing at #Azaz -trucks burning
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vuy_5U8uaG0
https://twitter.com/taylieli/status/669569562338328576
Earlier I could not understand why Russian airforce had not shut down that section of the border. It seem the AQ/ISIS logistics is run by Turk nationals and perhaps Putin was hoping Turkey would see the light and stop support of the terrorists.
Now all stops are out and blowback from the plane ambush will see an abrupt and painfull end to Turkish logistics into Syria.
http://syrianperspective.com/2015/11/exclusive-to-syrper-alqaeda-leader-al-jawlaani-target-of-russian-aircraft-shot-down-by-islamist-terrorist-erdoghan.html
Usaamaa Al-‘Absi Al-Waahidi, a/k/a “Abu Muhammad Al-Jawlaani”, the commander of Nusra/Alqaeda was in the Jabal Al-Turkmaan area when the ill-fated Su-24 was about to go in for the kill.
Let’s track the route of the Su-24 bomber which flew out of Humaymeem AB (a/k/a Baasil Al-Assad International Airport). Based on Russian information supplied to the world press, the Su-24 and a Su-34 took off in tandem from the airbase and, with the latter flying cover, pulverized several areas of the Jabal Al-Turkmaan region which is a hotbed of pro-Erdoghaan rodents and Alqaeda sympathizers. After the first sortie, the planes headed east over Idlib Province and made a turn back at the area of Turk Occupied Syria at Hatay just north of Boonsiyya. The aircraft were accosted by 2 Lockheed-Martin F-16s armed with AIM 120 AMRAAM air-to-air missiles which were fired at the Sukhoi-24 and struck it on the tail destroying it completely. THERE WERE NO RADIO SIGNALS FROM THE RAT ERDOGHANI TURKS. NONE ONE SINGLE MESSAGE. Instead, the appearance of the F-16s was more like an ambush to please the child-molesting Arabians who are baffled by the concatenation of failures and catastrophes which have plagued them for months. I will reveal to you shortly why the Turks attacked this airplane.
Amazingly, or by some queer coincidence, 2 Turk news crews were on site to film the episode. One group was from the Anadolou News Agency, an Erdoghan propaganda factory, and another from the Haberturk TV News system, another Erdoghan-worshiping lie-assembly line.
———————————————————–
How is it this guy, with his modest site, is able to scoop “news” outlets & reporters with untold near infinite budgets to reveal what was really behind that Russian jet being taken out?
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Assuming the higher-ups in Turkey knew this too, in realtime, would explain the urgency of an order being given to do just that.
Looks like that sultan of the souk is so impressed with his performance in pulling one off on Putin that he’s awarded hisself a promotion!
Turkey’s prime minister says his government plans to adopt a new constitution, emphasizing that the newly established administration is in favor of a presidential system.
http://www.presstv.ir/Detail/2015/11/25/439148/Turkey-Erdogan-Davutoglu-presidential-system-constitution
The strategy of those who shot down the Fencer is tied to the ongoing Russian attempt to build a gas pipeline to Southern Europe. The multinationals were able to browbeat Bulgaria to stop the gas line from landing on Bulgarian sharers. Putin turned to Turkey that now get 57% of its gas. in order to expand the delivery through Turkey into Europe. Now someone does not want this to take place . Maybe Turkey has found cheaper gas to the South so they want Assad deposed to get the gas in . so this shoot down may have been orchestrated to break off negotiations with Russia. It could have been pressure from EU and NATO to create a crisis that would end the negotiations that they did not support
Sultan Erdogan’s War on…Russia – Pepe Escobar
“[..] Here’s Erdogan’s warped reasoning in a nutshell. The Paris tragedy was a huge setback. France started discussing close military collaboration not within NATO, but with Russia. Washington’s unstated aim was always to get NATO inside Syria. By having Turkey/NATO — clumsily, inside Syrian territory — attacking Russia, and provoking a harsh Russian response, Erdogan thought he could seduce NATO into Syria, under the pretext (Article 5) of defending Turkey.
As Bay-of-Pigs dangerous as this may be, it has nothing to do with WWIII — as apocalyptic purveyors are braying. It revolves around whether a state which supports/finances/weaponizes the Salafi-jihadi nebulae is allowed to destroy the Russian jets that are turning its profitable assets into ashes”
“[..] So the real target was not a Su-24, but the evolving possibility, after the Paris attacks, of a real coalition — the US, Britain and France on one side, the “4+1” (Russia, Syria, Iran, Iraq plus Hezbollah) on the other side — finally converging their interests into a unified fight against ISIS/ISIL/Daesh.
Where would that leave Ankara, which for years has invested heavily in the Salafi-jihadi nebulae, from Jabhat al-Nusra to Ahrar al-Sham and myriad other outfits, culminating with aiding and abetting and even funding ISIS/ISIL/Daesh?”
“[..] So Ankara, with a missile, thought it might completely change the narrative.”
“[..] Bilal Erdogan, the Sultan’s son, is a major profiteer of illegal trading of stolen Iraqi and Syrian oil. Imagine his terror after Putin revealed to G-20 leaders in Antalya — Turkish territory! — how Russian intel has identified most of the mobster maze of connections pointing directly to ISIS/ISIL/Daesh.
Imagine mobster/Turkish commodity dealer sentiment at the prospect of losing their cut with the impossibility of buying Syrian stolen oil to the tune of $50 million a month. After all the Russian Air Force had already destroyed oil farms, refineries and most of all over 1,000 tanker trucks — and counting; imagine the prospect of losing all the oil flow, the money flow, a Smugglers Inc. scattered in the desert with no place to go.”
Full Article here> http://sputniknews.com/columnists/20151125/1030730838/turkey-erdogan-war-russia.html
Same theme here this interesting investigative report on the Brit aided & abetted ISIS “oil smuggling” , put out end of July/2015 a full 2 months b4 Putin finally actively intervened.
Says it uses crowd funding to pay for the reporters.
https://medium.com/insurge-intelligence/britain-s-secret-ties-to-governments-firms-facilitating-isis-oil-sales-210d21470e65#.wtqs4g1le
The relationship between British and Kurdish energy companies, and senior British politicians, raises questions about conflicts of interest — especially in the context of a ‘war on terror’ that is supposed to be targeting, not financing, the ‘Islamic State.’
Using a carefully cultivated network of intermediaries and ‘middlemen’ in the Kurdish region of Iraq, as well as in Turkey, ISIS has been able to produce a phenomenal 45,000 barrels of oil a day, raking in as much as $3 million a day in cash by selling the oil at well below market prices.
But the sheer scale and impunity of this oil smuggling network has caused local politicians to ask whether certain officials in the KRG and Turkey are turning a blind eye to these operations.
Iraqi, Kurdish and Turkish officials have accused both the KRG and Turkish governments of deliberately allowing some of these smuggling operations to take place.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OoKk6hOVKJM
CrossTalk on downing of Russian military jet: Dangerous Skies
Published on Nov 24, 2015
What does the downing of a Russian Air Force jet by Turkey tell us about the war against the Islamic State? How many sides are there in the conflict? And who benefits from a very divided front? Is ending the Syrian civil war as elusive as ever?
CrossTalking with Joe Lauria, Afzal Ashraf, and Flynt Leverett
thanks Blue, I’ll watch it now.
Stuff some cruise missiles up the turkey’s a$$ for Thanksgiving.
Oh, boy! Don’t these Turks love to dig their own graves and keep on digging and digging…
…and digging…
…
Turkish intelligence chief: ISIS is a reality and we must stop Putin from crushing the Islamic revolution – FortRuss [back in Oct – 2015]
“Turkish intelligence chief: Putin’s intervention in Syria is against Islam and international law, ISIS is a reality and we are optimistic about the future.
Ankara— Hakan Fidan, the head of Turkey’s National Intelligence Organization, known by the MİT acronym, has drawn a lot of attention and criticism for his controversial comments about ISIS.
Mr. Hakan Fidan, Turkish President’s staunchest ally, condemned Russian military intervention in Syria, accusing Moscow of trying to ‘smother’ Syria’s Islamist revolution and serious breach of United Nations law.
“ISIS is a reality and we have to accept that we cannot eradicate a well-organized and popular establishment such as the Islamic State; therefore I urge my western colleagues to revise their mindset about Islamic political currents, put aside their cynical mentalité and thwart Vladimir Putin’s plans to crush Syrian Islamist revolutionaries,” – Anadolu News Agency quoted Mr. Fidan as saying on Sunday.
Fidan further added that in order to deal with the vast number of foreign Jihadists craving to travel to Syria, it is imperative that ISIS must set up a consulate or at least a political office in Istanbul. He underlined that it is Turkey’s firm belief to provide medical care for all injured people fleeing Russian ruthless airstrikes regardless of their political or religious affiliation [..]”
Link> http://fortruss.blogspot.co.uk/2015/11/turkish-intelligence-chief-isis-is.html
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You can’t ask for more crystal clear intentions about Turkey’s motives than that!
-TL2Q
This is a crime called “justifying terrorism”, criminal legal figure, at least in Spain.
Seems to be a fake:
http://www.aa.com.tr/en/turkey/statement-from-anadolu-agency-/448685
Turkey and Ukraine agreed on joining forces to strengthen security in the Black Sea.
KIEV (Sputnik) — Turkey and Ukraine agreed on joining forces to strengthen security in the Black Sea, Ukraine’s state-run defense concern Ukroboronprom said Thursday.
“Ukraine and Turkey together will build the marine industry to enhance the safety and security in the Black Sea. This area will be one of the key aspects of cooperation between the two countries,” the company’s statement said.
Kiev is currently adopting the policy of attracting foreign investments in the defense-industrial complex of the country, which was discussed during the Turkey Defence Week 2015 held on November 10-12 in Ankara, according to the statement.
Read more: http://sputniknews.com/world/20151126/1030783022/turkey-ukraine-cooperation-sea.html#ixzz3saoDyHgi
so watch out Rus, those straights might be closed some time.Especially if Ukr gets stronger with NATO, then can claim it is at war with Rus, then as a NATO ally of Turkey, Turkey can close them?
Temptation surely.
TL2Q, you are, unwittingly, I think, reproducing disinfo. To be fair, this disinfo was also for a short period carried by Thierry Meyssan’s Réseau Voltaire, before they issued a rectification:
Rectificatif : une intoxication contre Hakan Fidan
Stuff like that is produced to subvert the struggle for truth. How can you recognize it? Well, in this case the notion that an official Turkish authority demands that ISIS be allowed an official representation in Istanbul should have been a strong clue.
@ Lumi:
Thanks for the heads up. In the same article I posted, at the bottom of the page, it reads:
“Update. This story had such a huge global resonance that Anadolu Agency issued a statement:
Statement from Anadolu Agency
ANKARA
We hereby state that the recent stories on some foreign media outlets claiming that Anadolu Agency did an interview with Turkish National Intelligence Organization (MIT) Undersecretary Hakan Fidan and published it are totally false.
It is known that the MIT has no such practice of speaking to media.
These fabricated stories by foreign sources are regarded as part of an international psychological campaign against Turkey“
http://fortruss.blogspot.co.uk/2015/11/turkish-intelligence-chief-isis-is.html
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So I suppose we can put a tick on this one, just to be on the safe side.
So, the Agency in question is denying the interview with MIT, interesting wording they chose in the bold paragraph [emphasis was mine, of course].
On the other hand, Turkey is not known for being ‘freedom of the press’ lovers, so who knows?
But we do have this breaking news today, which does involve MIT…
…
Turkish newspaper editor in court for ‘espionage’ after revealing weapon convoy to Syrian militants
“Dündar arrived at an Istanbul court on Thursday, saying that he and his colleague “came here to defend journalism.”
“We came here to defend the right of the public to obtain the news and their right to know if their government is feeding them lies. We came here to show and to prove that governments cannot engage in illegal activity and defend this,” Dündar was cited by Today’s Zaman.
The articles, published on Cumhuriyet’s front page in May, claimed that Turkey’s National Intelligence Organization (MİT) is smuggling weapons in trucks into Syria and was caught doing so twice in 2014. The trucks were allegedly stopped and searched by police, with photos and videos of their contents obtained by Cumhuriyet [..]
More at the Article > https://www.rt.com/news/323557-turkey-arrests-editor-cumhuriyet/
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TL2Q
Since it’s Thankgiving holiday in America, that means its TURKEY-HUNTING season in more ways than one.
The Turks and their Neo-Ottoman ruler Erdogone, whom they elected, had best keep that in mind.
For instance, it’s high time that the the Kurds receive more help in resisting the Turkish occupation of their homeland.
For those with penchants for ruthless analysis and this from RI
http://russia-insider.com/en/politics/classic-rules-combatting-turkish-aggression/ri11446
If I am not hugely mistaken this is “Buratino” in action.
https://youtu.be/SQsxnwphNzU
Just watched this, I totally recommend it to Mr. John Pilger’s admirers out there ;-)
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John Pilger on Paris, ISIS and Media Propaganda (280) – RT
Afshin Rattansi goes underground with John Pilger. Award winning journalist and author, John Pilger talks to us about how Washington, London and Paris gave birth to ISIS-Daesh. Plus we examine the media’s role in spreading disinformation ahead of a vote in Parliament for UK bombing of Syria [..]
LINK> https://www.rt.com/shows/going-underground/323420-paris-isis-daesh-uk/
-TL2Q
There were televised scenes of Iranians celebrating, and we were told that they were celebrating the 9-11 attacks. Only trouble is that it was dark in Iran at the time of the attacks and still dark in Iran at the time of the televised viewing. Unfortunately, the celebration of whatever took place outdoors in bright sunlight.
When you set out to deceive. . . .
In Germany, images of “jubilating Palestinians in Gaza” were shown on TV, allegedly celebrating the attacks. I remember a colleague of mine boldly commenting: “This time, the Palestinians went too far.” The images of celebrating Palestinians were taken from an unrelated occasion, of course. Just goes to show how zionists control the media and how it works to impress the mind of most people.
By the way, it cannot have been completely dark in Iran when the towers were destroyed, which was 13:59 and 14:28 UTC, Teheran being UTC+3:30 and sunset on 9/11 at 19:18 local time.
http://www.timeanddate.de/sonne/iran/teheran?monat=9&jahr=2001
But your point still stands because it wouldn’t have been in bright daylight, not even with live images and people immediately celebrating. Plus, we know how zionists keep lying and lying and lying … because it works so well on the sheeple.
ops I stand corrected :) I get confused between time zones.. Yes it was late in the afternoon almost evening and I was just waiting for the US markets to open.. But yea 5pm or so in Teheran.. I never saw any Iranians celebrating..
From what I recall it was like 8 in the morning.. Some Palestinians came out to dance but the PLO ran them off.. No one really celebrated.. More like everyone was in shock.. Not because they are fond of Americans but because the invincible cloak of Americans were shattered.
Interesting.
http://edition.cnn.com/2015/11/25/europe/nato-putin-turkey-syria-analysis/index.html
The Turkmen commander, whose people shot at the Russian pilots turns out to be a real Turk coming from Turkey. http://anfenglish.com/news/turkmen-commander-turns-out-to-be-turkish-nationalist
Under the Montreux Convention if Turkey is at war, or feels herself at risk she can close the straits from the Black Sea to the Mediterranean.
Closure of the straits would last maybe 36-48 hours. Freeing the Straits is something the Russian military conducts exercises for. I’m sure Greece wouldn’t mind regaining control over Constantinople.
Perhaps you mean “Turkey would last 36-48 hours.” A new acronym would be created for TSFKAT, The State Formerly Known As Turkey.
Closing the straits would be a huge casus belli.
Another article delightfully clear cutting in its analysis but from Fort Russ
http://fortruss.blogspot.com/2015/11/i-dare-you-turkey-possible-russian.html
teranam 13 In view of the US holiday I second your recommendation, and for those that did not read the entire article, maybe you will after this excerpt:
“If the situation is seen from the point of view of Kagan and his allies, then the Turks were compelled to do what the US military didn’t want to. If we call things by their names, then Turkey was sacrificed. Thanksgiving Day is soon and this is perhaps the most vile and filthy of all holidays known to humanity, a holiday of betrayal as a life style and strategy for success. Each year the kindness of those who the future Americans waged a genocide against is remembered and rejoiced. This can only be a holiday for someone for whom Judas is a hero. A traditional treat on this “holiday of backstabbing” is a roasted Turkey. If this is not a coincidence, then it is impossible not to recognize that our opponents present a rather peculiar sense of humor.”
The Orthodox (ie Russian) point of view on our exceptional “morality” is often refreshingly ironic and instructive. LOL
much appreciate the link too, a good read
Turkey deliberately funding/supporting Turkomen to fight against Syrian state……but also a threat shown to Russia and Syria, we can do much more if you push further…..against our wishes
The truth about Thanksgiving Day is that it was a national holiday created by Abraham Lincoln to commemorate the victory at the Battle of Chattanooga, Tennessee, the turning point of the Civil War, and it had nothing to do with the Pilgrims and the Indians saving their butts one cold lonely winter. All that stuff is myth that was tacked on later.
Meyssan NOV 23:
http://www.voltairenet.org/article189385.html
The objective is no longer to overthrow the secular Syrian régime, nor to destroy its army, but to create a colonial state straddling the border between Iraq and Syria, to be managed by the Kurds, in order to apply a stranglehold on the Arab states. The dream of an Israeli nation between the Nile and the Euphrates is back.
http://www.voltairenet.org/local/cache-vignettes/L400xH300/1_-_1-148-39853-2-9334a.jpg
On this map, published in 2013 by Robin Wright in the New York Times, we can see Sunnistan, which Daesh was to create in June 2014, and from where they proclaimed the Caliphate, and also Kurdistan, that France and Israël now want to create. You may note that on this map, nothing is planned for the Christian populations, who will either have to be transferred to Europe, or else exterminated.
Can Turkey close Bosphorus to Russian navy?
Yes they can close Borphorus to the Russian Navy. Thats the reason Turkey is in NATO. Otherwise who would want them?
http://www.presstv.ir/Detail/2015/11/25/439161/us-afghanistan-kunduz-campbell-msf-hospital-doctors-without-borders
The United States says the deadly airstrike that recently destroyed an Afghan hospital in the northern city of Kunduz was the result of a “human error, compounded by process and equipment failures.”
General John Francis Campbell, the US commander in Afghanistan, made the remarks at a press conference in the capital Kabul on Wednesday, further admitting that the US forces took 17 minutes to act after being warned by Médecins Sans Frontières, or Doctors Without Borders, which was running the hospital in the country.
An excellent article on Turkey from an Unexpected source:
http://blogs.timesofisrael.com/nato-turkey-annexation-of-north-syria-like-north-cyprus/
n October, reports from two CHP deputies in the Turkish parliament corroborate previous testimonies that the notorious sarin gas attack at Ghouta was a false flag orchestrated by Turkish intelligence, willing to commit the war crime of sacrificing 1,300 innocent civilians to goad US into the Syrian war to topple Assad.
Turkey’s unhealthy pattern as arsonist-firefighter so exasperated NATO member Germany, that in August Berlin removed its Patriot batteries from Turkey.
…
Erdogan has given a green light for Russian and Iraqi jetfighters to shoot down Turkish planes over Iraq. As China and India are also contemplating joining the Russian coalition, this would complicate the situation in both Syria and Iraq considerably.
..
In July 2015, a formation of Turkish fighter jets also violated Greek airspace a total of 20 times before being chased off by Greek aircraft. By antagonizing Cyprus, Greece, Egypt and Iraqi Kurdistan,Turkey is ironically the great unifier driving these countries to side with Russia in the Mediterranean.
Well loose canon Erdogan and his cabal just entered Iraqi airspace today to bomb Kurds – again no warning.
http://sputniknews.com/military/20151126/1030769250/turkish-planes-bomb-iraq.htm
Also Russia has just announced it has broken all military ties with Turkey not just the so-called hotline that was launched in order to avoid possible air incidents during the destruction of terrorist infrastructure in Syria.
http://sputniknews.com/military/20151126/1030815285/russia-turkey-military-ties.html
Good luck when the S400 takes down any of your planes entering Syrian airspace – as its arrived in Turkey! Erdogan refuses to apologise and continues his arrogant responses.
No Turk Stream and now further economic cancellations to contracts etc.
At the same time the US troops are on the ground in Syria – hmm…..
http://sputniknews.com/middleeast/20151126/1030793973/us-troops-border-turkey.html
And throwing their toys out the pram about the Russian self-defence systems are not in line with their safety memo – what the one your ally Turkey violated? And US said wasn’t a problem.
Cowards and those who were silent to the murders are cowards too.
3 years ago a Turkish jet entered Syrian air space and was shot down by the SAA
What was the response from NATO commander Anders Fogh Rasmussen?
“It is another example of the Syrian authorities disregard for international norms peace and security and human life”
Should we be even a little surprised at the absolute hypocritical stance from these prostitutes? I think not. They are itching for a war and they’ll cheer us all on from deep within their bomb proof shelters
https://t.co/dVuHJxhrnI
Energy exports from Russia to Turkey are the biggest part of the trade relationship. After Germany, Turkey is the second-largest buyer of Russian natural gas. Russia’s Gazprom supplies about 27 billion cubic metres of Russian natural gas a year, or almost 70 percent of the total gas Turkey consumes.
Halting gas flows “would be a very tough decision as the export markets are bad, they are not rising but only getting tighter,” said Mikhail Krutikhin, a partner at the RusEnergy consulting firm.
“The loss of such a big market (as Turkey) would be very sensitive both for the state budget and for Gazprom.”
http://www.todayszaman.com/business_russia-economic-retaliation-on-turkey-wont-cut-too-deep_405300.html
28 children killed in Fatma al-Zahraa’ school east of #Mosul by #France Air Force, said #Baghdad, #Iraq. France carries out airstrikes on #IS in #Mosul, ended up hitting a school killing 27 children
According to ANHA reports trucks who were carrying weapons from #Turkey to Nusra/Sham hit by the airstrikes
Russia/n airforce cover the sky of reef #Lattakia bombing all day as it is waiting4 #Turkey reaction.Allies Ground troops advanced n d area
Turkmen & #AlQaeda Terrorists in #Latakia #Syria say that #Russia is annihilating them right now http://www.naharnet.com/stories/en/195395 …
It is also clear that reef #Latakia and Jabal al-Turkman (protected by #Turkey) will be the price of the #Russia #Su24
Heavy Russia Raids in Syria Area where Plane Downed, Says Monitor
Russian warplanes carried out heavy raids in Syria’s northern Latakia province on Wednesday, a day after Turkey downed one of Moscow’s jets in the area, a monitoring group said.
Warplanes believed to be Russian also carried out strikes near the Turkish border in northern Aleppo province, killing at least three people and setting alight several trucks carrying aid and goods for sale, the monitor and activists said.
“Russian warplanes have since last night been carrying out heavy air strikes on the Jabal Akrad and Jabal Turkman regions” in the north of Latakia province, Syrian Observatory for Human Rights chief Rami Abdel Rahman said.
He said Russian planes had carried out at least 12 strikes in the area since the morning, but had no information on any casualties.
A media activist on the ground confirmed the heavy strikes, which he said centered around the Jabal Nuba area where rebels on Tuesday destroyed a Russian helicopter that was forced to make an emergency landing by opposition fire.
One member of the crew was killed but the rest were rescued.
http://www.naharnet.com/stories/en/195395
http://www.dha.com.tr/dhayayin-3/
Lavrov: Yes Turkish FM did call me to apologize, however the whole time he was trying to justify the shooting down of the craft.
Lavrov: We hear about illegal organ trade that is run through #Turkey, using organs of slaughtered Syrians
RUSSIA: Russia has banned any Turkish poultry from entering the country, claiming it has unsafe bacteria.
BREAKING AS HELL:Impressive Hell-fire by #Russian #MLRS in #Ghab_Plain #Hama, Alahuakbaaaaaaaaaaar.
https://twitter.com/Syria_Protector/status/669580787583475713
Impressive Hell-fire by Russian MLRS in Ghab Plain – Hama
Full footage
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SQsxnwphNzU&feature=youtu.be
WOW!!!!!
Rescue team that rescued downed #RuAF pilot consisted of 18 #SAA SF & 6 fighters from #Hezbollah
Recent photo of the rescued #Russian Pilot due to special #SAA, #Hezbollah operation in #Lattakia cs
https://twitter.com/Syria_Protector/status/669597610391543810
#Russia deputies have reportedly submitted a bill to hold to account anyone who denies the #Armenian genocide.
Piles of dead Turkmen terrorists killed in Latakia today. These are your kinsmen Erdogan
https://twitter.com/Souria4Syrians/status/669640753237348356
Remember this ugly face saying there is but ONE GOD. He is One of the criminals involved in murdering the brave Russian pilot.
https://twitter.com/Souria4Syrians/status/669118300966793216
They have removed all the pics of the special forces group that rescued the Russian navigator, maybe because it showed their faces..
mmiriww
“They have removed all the pics of the special forces group that rescued the Russian navigator, maybe because it showed their faces..”
ANNA News blurts the faces, or diverts their cameras so as to not show faces, when interviewing Syrian military. This is to protect the families of these men, should the zionazis be able to id them. The more elite the unit they belong to, the more important it is to reveal less actionable info.
Always remember, the zionazi is not a normal human being, but a collage of all what is most cowardly, duplicitous, parasitic, selfish, bigoted and delusionally supremacist. To name just a few of their more “minor” failings as human beings.*
*Personally, I think the jury is still out on whether zionazis are actually human beings at all, and instead are some sort of devolved mutants. Something like a subspecies of Charles mansons/Jeffery dahlmers. But that’s my own prejudices at work… ;D
Well this had 6 Hez operatives as well as the 12 SAA special forces which I think meant the tiger force.. They did not look like the usual military special forces and I think one even had that thing the arabs wear around the neck. The SAA guys looked more military while the hez guys looked like infiltration units. Yea first time I seen them and their faces.. Compared to fully decked out US special forces, and the Russian SF shown in the pictures also look decked out but not as much as the americans, these guys did not have any armor or special equipment. What I am trying to say is, unlike their rep the hez special forces do not in any way look impressive or mean even compared to the Syrians let alone the Russians or Americans. They looked like homeless people with cheap guns…
https://twitter.com/Syria_Protector/status/669597610391543810
Sorry to jump in, vot tak, but having recently read a lot of Miles Mathis’ stuff, any mentioning of Charles Manson keeps triggering my still lit up neural circuits.
In his 80 pages paper ‘The Tate Murders Were a False Flag and the Greatest Success Story of Project CHAOS’ Miles Mathis makes a very convincing (and very entertaining) case that Sharon Tate, Roman Polanski, Charles Manson were all CIA assets and that the ‘gruesome Tate Murders’ were one of the earliest and most brazen CIA hoaxes. Nobody died at the Tate house.
The court case was a total ruse and Charles Manson, Miles Mathis speculates further, probably never went to prison at all. He just showed up there every year or so to give a hoax interview with the fake press to keep the story warm.
I know, there goes another myth. The dominoes keep falling.
http://mileswmathis.com/tate.pdf
just look at that couch; the cheap furniture is the best part of the set.
It seems ALL UK “news” outlets are also the propaganda arm of the anglo Zionists? I don’t bother with most as every single one I have read have proven to be just another outlet to formant consent for the lies of empire.. But it is getting rather ridiculous that 90% of its readers think they all print garbage and yet they keep on doing it.. Maybe until that reaches 100%.. Just amazing that the western politicians are so out in touch with those they rule that they think they can keep on doing what 90% of their population don’t want them do. So that is what the elites in the west call democracy.. The rule of the 10%…
Look at this crap.. They outright say unverified claims were made but by the end of the article those clams ended up as facts.. and the anglo-zionist claims are now facts on the ground…
First.. Is this PROOF Russia WAS warned? Recording emerges of moment Russia told GET OUT of Turkey
Now here is where the propaganda comes in… Turkey insists the Russian plane edged into their airspace and the pilots were told to get out before they were “forced” to shoot them down inside Turkish airspace before they came down in Syria – which the audio backs up.
http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/622028/Audio-Turkey-warning-Russia-jet-stay-out-airspace
Another article about Russia strikes back: Putin’s bombers hit Turkish border crossing in revenge for downed jet.. Shows the population not buying the propaganda.. YET, the MSM at large spout out the very same lies for the last decade.. Then they lose customers and short of money etc etc etc.. But they keep publishing the very same garbage.. and wonder. Why people don’t buy it..
90% Agree with you 5667 voters. Share your opinion!
http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/622093/Putin-revenge-Russia-strikes-Turkish-border-crossings
the audio recording could have come from anytime, especially as Lavrov says it was a preplanned provocation, and was also not clear that the warning could easily have been before Rus plane was going to enter into the so called buffer zone Turkey is claiming,as the planes route was straight for a while heading towards that Turkey land projection but diverted south before it…………and legally can fly within Syria’s airspace.
What a nuclear rollercoaster we are all riding on. Every time there is a shoot down like this, the players go on full nuclear alert with the keys and everything. There won’t be any time off at Minot AFB. No sleep. That’s not good. Submarine crews too. No sleep for the wicked…
So frenchies making fun of hand held GPS devices.. Because of a photo of older SU24’s without upgraded electronics had no built in GPS type devices.. Unlike their rafaels..
#RuAF Su-24 Fencer with a handheld Garmin-like GPS systems in addition to the aging inertial navigation system
https://twitter.com/Tom_Antonov/status/669602424311672833
Also lots of hurrahas about turkey breaking international laws and norms.. Turkey now says the 5km border air space it annexed was where the SU24 was shot down in… And these hurrah idiots consider it as fact. And the border post right next to Turkey which was bombed by Russia heavily is destroying aid trucks and violating turkish sovereignty blah blah blah… No wonder erdo got elected.. These people have very low IQ..
Wonder why Erdo did not shoot those jets down.. RuAF was present in the area the entire day frying kinsmen.. just feet’s away from Turkish border.. almost 5KM inside Turkish annexed Syrian air space..
Don’t forget the PressTV reporter Serena Shim who took photos of Turkish agents providing weapons to terrorists who was killed soon after in an accident by ramming her car with a dumb truck..
https://twitter.com/charlesfrith/status/669431330753675264
https://twitter.com/hashtag/SerenaShim?src=hash
Good to see jiminNH is onto it. I’m guessing that “NH” stands for “New Hampshire”. But I think Atlanta has the breaking news, thanks to Serbian and Russian friends who are getting the first-hand evidence. Here’s what I’d add to what jiminNH has written (and I’ve only skimmed what he’s said).
NATO is not only the operational center for America’s Fortress Europe, but serves as that for Operation Gladio (Molenbeek, Brussels) and Operation Gladio II (Turkey), for the Underground Reich (now the re-emerging Nazi International), and for all fascist (and especially stay-behind) networks throughout the world, including the takfiri groups such as ISIS/ISIL and their parent, the unMuslim Brotherhood.
From the Brussels neighborhood of Molenbeek, NATO’s still-active Operation Gladio launched the Paris Friday the 12th false-flag “massacre” to persuade a reluctant Hollande to support the Operation Barbarossa (South) field maneuvers of NATO in Syria.
The headquarters of Operation Gladio II (which OG-I spawned) is headquartered in Turkey, which is also home to the Turkish Nazi group The Grey Wolves. Quite literally, Russia and Syria are at war with the re-emergent Comintern Pact and what I refer to as the Nazi International (although other anti-fascist researchers have referred to this as the Fourth Reich, ignoring the trail of evidence that links it to the smoldering Reichstag of Bormann and Hitler).
All these global operations link together the Ukrainian OUN/B, the Turkish Grey Wolves, the pseudo-Islamic groups that were parented by Hitler’s regional wartime ally, the unMuslim Brotherhood (which took part in the abortive 1942 coup to let Rommel into Egypt and more recently did the work on the ground in Afghanistan to create al-Qaeda), and various other member-organizations of the post-Wold War II / Great Patriotic War transnational Nazi alliance, including the World Anti-Communist League, whose parent organization masterminded the assassination of John F Kennedy to prepare the U.S. as a nest to receive the leaders of the new Nazi Axis– that is, the new homeland (their word) of Nazism.
I think that Putin got involved in Syria in the nick of time. There should be no idealistic notions as to what to expect from the U.S. and other NATO members. There is much duplicity in their involvement in Syria. Putin should keep at the top of his mind always that U.S./Israeli hegemonic interests will always predominate in any kind of collaboration with Russia on fighting ISIS. Putin should dismiss the idea that the U.S. has any other interest than the expansionist type and it will invest more heavily in that interest than in fighting ISIS. Putin formed the right alliance from the beginning and he should be careful not to resort merely to lip service with this alliance. His alliance galls the hell out of the Empire. This alliance alone can help sustain balance in the region breaking the hegemony that is out to destabilize with chaos and re-drawing the map to the ZioAnglo Empire’s expansionist advantage.
What Turkey did is very dirty and deserves a very serious response, but a lesser bit of everything is the way to go; for now. I don’t think that using the Kurds to hurt Turkey is wise because let’s no forget that Israel has an interest in using the Kurds for its own designs and Zionist aspirations should not be indulged and empowered just to get back at Turkey. The goal is to undermine the Empire not help it expand.
The Empire with NATO would like nothing better than to bait Russia and bleed it dry in Syria. Why fall into that trap? Russia must continue to be the Empire spoiler in the cleverest way possible.
1 day after the Turkish election:
PM Davutoğlu calls for new constitution, new Turkey free of conflict and polarisation
5 days after the Turkish election:
Turkish PM hires top PR firm in EU capital
24 days after the Turkish election:
Turkish Prime Minister: I Gave Order to Shoot Down Russia’s Plane Myself
Some context please:
A new Constitution — Today’s Zaman. November 21, 2015
“…[O]ur president is now the de facto leader of Turkey — and because of this, his clashes with Prime Minister Ahmet Davutoğlu are now quite overt. In fact, these clashes are responsible for the slowness of the formation of our new post-election government. What President Recep Tayyip Erdoğan really wants is to form his own inner Cabinet, and to ensure that true authority lies with his own team, on the economy and other critical fronts.”
http://www.todayszaman.com/columnist/mumtazer-turkone/a-new-constitution_404871.html
Also note this from today:
Turkish PM Davutoğlu forms 64th government of Turkey — Hurriyet Daily News, November 26, 2015
“The considerable delay in Erdoğan and Davutoğlu’s meeting on Nov. 24 prompted speculation as to whether there was a disagreement between the two, with Erdoğan, the founding leader of the AKP, reportedly aspiring to have his “loyalists” dominate the cabinet.”
http://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/turkish-pm-davutoglu-forms-64th-government-of-turkey.aspx?PageID=238&NID=91592&NewsCatID=338
Is it me, or does this look like a power struggle?
Note the time frame of the stalled efforts to form a cabinet >> November 17-24.
Does it surprise you Prime Minister Ahmet Davutoglu hired New York PR firm Burson-Marsteller (reported November 6) to generate soothing headlines as he grabs for power; like this one from just yesterday: Turkey: New government favors presidential system.
Honest Injun — a new constitution is just around the corner ol’ Erdo pal-o-mine.
Also note that Sool-tan Erdogan is now entirely dependent on PM Davutoglu, at least until a new constitution is enacted — which might not ever happened, first because the AKP doesn’t have the necessary 2/3rds majority to change the constitution and second because innumerable people both within and outside of Turkey want Erdogan to be going — going — gone!
Can’t say I blame ’em but —
Who then, exactly, authorized Davutoglu to order the downing of a Russian Su-24 in this unquestionably pre-planned and fully authorized operation?
Is not a power grab not the most logical motivation behind the unbelievably stupid decision to blatantly provoke the Bear and down one of its aircraft?
And who else but good ol’ Erdogan is gonna wear this decision, even if Ahmet Davutoglu jumps up and down screaming damnit I’m the murderer, I’m the murder! for three straight days?
No one is siding with Russia. They only want Erdogan to dissappear.
It is Erdogan, in his own stupid and arrogant way, who seems most interested in tamping down tensions while his Prime Minister, who controls parliament and most of the levers of power, is going full steam ahead in the opposite direction.
The downing of the Russian Su-24 was motivated by efforts to isolate and ultimately remove Erdogan, engineered and supported by external actors all of whom want to see the would-be Sultan gone for good.
So, besides Davutoglu, cui bono?
There have been reports on foreign forums all day Wed. that Erdogan has “unofficially” grounded his airforce due to the planes being “lit up” as soon as they take off. Under the circumstances it seems possible if not probable. The other popular topic was that the Turkman Mountain area had basically been cleared of jihadis by both air and ground attacks.
You can be sure that this is true. Turkey has got away free with shooting down the Su24. This wont happen again. The Su 30s are now flying cap on all missions close to the boarder.
If any Turkish plane fires on a Russia plane again, Russia will have no hesitation at firing inside Turkish airspace and take them out.
Putin beats up priest who wants to kiss his hand..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zXMIjJZTG6U
This is funnier than the other video where Putin smashes a bottle over erdo.. But that was just actors..
The Russian marine was placing explosives to blow up the crashed helicopter when a US made TOW missile was used by US backed moderate terrorists to destroy the helicopter.
Alexander Pazynich, Russian mariner killed when #RuAF Mi-8 AMTSh was targeted by rebels TOW ATGM.
https://twitter.com/green_lemonnn/status/669791047929741312
He is also getting the hero medal..
http://leurenmoret.info/
link re posted from Russia Insider article
http://russia-insider.com/en/americas-hegemony-and-europes-place-chessboard/ri11420
that discusses the leaked McCain-Saakashvilli conversation that we know of from fortruss, sputnik etc about Oct 28th 2015 ,can be interpreted as, or showing that these two did want, or mean , or perhaps facilitate the bringing down of the Rus civil plane in Sinai, and the military plane in Syria?
But also they are planning to bring down an american plane in Syria to then blame Russia
this particular link
http://leurenmoret.info/currents/ukrainian-wikileaks-intervi.html
transcript of interview………..
I am not sufficiently qualified to appraise this possibility raised in this interview………..
eg”McCain confirmed the plan, everything is in place so you know. We got cover from the US Senate. In Syria, Russians must be hit, or else if Russians and Americans fundamentally agree, they will really dump Ukraine. Donbass is on conservation, project Transnistria is suspended. If it goes on, we are done! We should speed things up in Syria!
“
latest from Erdogan
“Turkey’s President Recep Tayyip Erdogan has refuted accusations against Ankara about buying oil from the terrorists of the organization “Islamic state”. The Turkish leader said that, in his opinion, deals with ISIS occur with the Syrian leader Bashar Assad.
“Those who accuse us in buying oil from Islamic State, let them prove it. If you are looking for a source of funding for ISIS, then the first place to look is in the direction of the Assad regime and those who support it”, — quotes RIA Novosti from words of Erdogan.”
What is that moaning and crying sound I hear????? Erdo is that you?????
For the second time since #Russia put foot in #Syria, its own artillery is bombing #Turkmen fighters in Jabal al-Turman and reef #Latakia. Russia/n airforce cover the sky of reef #Lattakia bombing all day as it is waiting 4 Turkey reaction. Allies Ground troops advanced in the area
2nd aid covey bombed by Russia, blowing up nurses bringing in baby incubators and baby formulae and pampers… /sarcasm…
This is the 2d convoy coming from #Turkey into #Syria in the last 24h bombarded and destroyed by #Russia/n Air Force
#Moscow cancels High Level Cooperation Council (ÜDİK), to be held St. Petersburg
https://twitter.com/EjmAlrai/status/669805247003500547
Russia does not double tap???? WTF not????
Map of IS control in Iraq.. what happened to all the IS members????
https://twitter.com/EjmAlrai/status/669803956877598721
I said the first time Russia started bombing.. nato will run like cockroaches leaving the rats to be exterminated.. IS will be left in the 2 large cities they are holding which would cause massive civilian problems if they are bombed so starve them out.. Both cities are in the middle of deserts..
Erdogans Turkmen militia killed by #SAA & #NDF who are advancing in northern Latakia with #Russian air cover.
https://twitter.com/HK2307/status/669668033204350976
Another T72 in Syria with ERA protection.. Seems at last Russia is providing Syria with new tanks with protection..
https://twitter.com/DPRKJones/status/669380380454088704
The men in black are the Syrian military intelligence team who located the Russian Su-24M navigation before participating in his rescue. The team was led by Colonel T.
From a military perspective, and putting in mind that we cannot share everything, yet we can simply say the Russian navigator Captain Konstantin Murakhtin showed a high level of training in survival skills. He truly was a credit to his uniform, his training and his armed forces. We had no doubt otherwise, yet a true word should always be spoken.
Our condolences to the family of the Russian Marine killed during the Mi-8 Chopper incident; and our condolences to the family of Captain Sergey Rumyantsev who ejected, yet was killed by NATO-backed terrorists while was still parachuting. (huh? that was not sergy… BTW)
The rescue mission was conducted by Syrian Spec-Ops from both the Syrian Army and Syrian Military Intelligence, and Russian Spec-Ops.
This act was not the first by the enemy military of Turkey, they once shot down a Syrian Mi-17 chopper and let their backed terrorists brutally kill them in the most inhumane methods.
The Turkish military are nothing but a disgrace to every military uniform in the world.
Syrian Arab Army
MOSCOW, November 25. /TASS/. Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov, in Wednesday’s phone conversation with US Secretary of State John Kerry, pointed to a gross violation of the Russian-US memorandum of ensuring safety of flights of combat aircraft in Syria, the Russian Foreign Ministry reported Wednesday.
READ ALSO
Moscow’s retaliation for downed Sukhoi-24M will depend on what Ankara does next
What’s behind Turkey’s provocative decision to shoot down Russian bomber?
Surviving pilot of Russia’s downed plane rules out Turkey’s airspace violation
Putin: Russia will not tolerate such crimes as attack against its Sukhoi-24 plane
“The situation around an unprovoked attack by Turkey’s Air Force on a Russian bomber, which was fulfilling the task to fight terrorists on Syrian territory, was discussed,” the ministry said.
“The minister pointed to a gross violation of the Russian-American memorandum on ensuring safety of combat aircraft flights in Syria, in which the United States assumed responsibility for observance of relevant regulations by all participants of the coalition it leads, including Turkey,” it said.
An F-16 fighter of the Turkish Air Force downed on Tuesday Russia’s Su-24M bomber (NATO reporting name Fencer) over the territory of Syria.
The Su-24M crew managed to eject, but one of the two pilots was killed by fire from the ground, the search for the second continued. The second pilot has been rescued.
READ ALSO
Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov © Artiom Geodakyan/TASS
Russia planning no war with Turkey — FM
Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov earlier on Wednesday noted that Moscow knows the US always demands from its coalition members in Syria to coordinate use of US combat planes. Thus, he pointed to the possibility of the Turkish authorities agreeing with the United States their decision to order its warplanes in the air to shoot down the Russian plane.
“Some members of the coalition, including those providing their combat planes for strikes against Iraq and Syria have confided to us the planes involved were of US manufacture and the Americans normally request US permission for such operations,” Lavrov said. “As far as I understand, our plane was downed by a US-made F-16. It remains to be seen whether the US requirement is applicable to Turkey, and if it is, I would like to know if Turkey had asked the United States for permission to send its planes on a combat mission and to shoot down a plane, albeit probably an identified one, over Syrian territory.”
VIDEO: ‘MODERATE OPPOSITION’ SHOT AT СIVIL AIRCRAFT AT DAMASCUS
http://southfront.org/video-moderate-opposition-shot-at-%D1%81ivil-aircraft-at-damascus/
Some people seems obsessed with this “looking weak” stuff where Russia “must do” this and that. SunTzu for one wouldn’t agree, looks can deceive and since the opponent also know this, looks are expected to decieve, whether on the second, third or fourth level.
Strategy and facts on the ground are important, pride and posturing to a lesser degree. The following article points out the weakness of Russian supply lines in the case of a war with Turkey.
http://fortruss.blogspot.ca/2015/11/the-motive-how-russias-enemies-benefit.html
Unless a solution exists it seems that anything that could cause Turkey to declare war should be avoided. It is much better to avoid strong talk, apologize for the (possible) border infringement and then work together with them to secure the border and make it inpenetrable. Recognize Erdogans legitimate strategic objectives, promise to avoid supporting the Kurds at this stage and perhaps even offer a compensation to the Erdogan family for the loss of ISIS oil revenues. Do not discount the PR value of bribing Erdogan to stop financing ISIS on the european population.
Nato will certainly recognize this as weakness (and it is) so attempts to exploit it will be made, therefore “inpenetrable” has to be taken literally. With some luck the anti-terrorist operation can then continue without escalating costs.
Remember, remaining resources is a measurement of distance to the use of strategic nukes.
The Russian strategy is to protect Russia.
Russia will not declare war at Turkey because people are not government. when and if people and government are one the same and obviously become mortal enemy to other state, declaring war is necessity and normal thing.
I don’t agree. Putin shouldn’t have to kiss the ring of Turkey’s leadership after having one of Russia’s pilot’s murdered while parachuting, which is a war crime.
Turkey should be the one to make amends for what it did, and, if it doesn’t, Russia can punish Turkey but the method and timing should be right. No doubt the opportunity will arise. For now, Russia owes Turkey zip and should find ways to exact just punishment in the meantime in a way that meets Russia’s objective in Syria. It’s obvious that Turkey wants Russia out of Syria and the best revenge is to escalate the Syria operation targeting all groups even those aligned with AQ and meet the objective sooner.
full text-but important:
“MOSCOW, November 26. /TASS/. Russian President Vladmir Putin says Turkey is deliberately steering the relations with Russia into a dead end, as neither apologies nor compensation proposals for the downed plane have been announced so far.
“We have not heard yet apologies from the highest political level of Turkey. Nor do we hear proposals to repair the damage or promises to punish the perpetrators for the committed crime,” Putin said. He added that “one gets the impression that the Turkish leadership is deliberately steering the Russian-Turkish relations into the dead end, this is regrettable.”
The president noted that “what happened two days ago in the sky over Syria runs counter to common sense and international law: the aircraft was shot down over Syrian territory.”
READ ALSO
Russia FM points to gross violation of Syria flight safety memorandum
Kerry offers condolences over Turkey’s downing of Russian warplane
Surviving pilot of Russia’s downed plane rules out Turkey’s airspace violation
Eighteen Turkish fighter jets patrolled border with Syria — Turkey’s General Staff
The head of state stressed that Russia regards as utterly unexplainable the treacherous stabs in the back it gets from those it had regarded as partners in the struggle with terrorism.
“We see as absolutely unexplainable the treacherous stabs in the back from those we had seen as our partners and allies in the anti-terrorist struggle,” he said, adding that he was referring to the incident of two days ago, when the Turkish Air Force shot down a Russian frontline bomber Sukhoi-24. The president was speaking at a ceremony of receiving credentials from newly-appointed foreign ambassadors on Thursday.
Russia’s Su-24M bomber was shot down on Tuesday by an air-to-air missile fired by an F-16 fighter jet of the Turkish Air Force. One pilot was killed while the other was rescued and taken to the Russian air base. During the operation to rescue the pilot, a Mi-8 helicopter was damaged by gunfire and a soldier was killed.
OPINION
Alexandrova
Lyudmila
What’s behind Turkey’s provocative decision to shoot down Russian bomber?
Turkey claims that the downed Russian combat plane violated Turkey’s air space. However, the Russian Defense Ministry has said that the Su-24M flew over Syria and the air space was violated by the Turkish plane that attacked Russia’s bomber.
The Russian General Staff has warned that Russia will destroy all potentially dangerous targets over Syria and announced about the plans to move the missile cruiser Moskva with the Fort missile system equivalent to the S-300 antiaircraft missile complex to the Syrian coast.
IS emergence results from ‘passiveness’ of some states
According to the Russian leader, the emergence of the Islamic State group results from the passiveness of some states and their accomplicity of terrorism.
“I remind that it is the passiveness of some countries and often direct accomplicity of terrorism that has led to the emergence of the awful phenomenon – the so-called Islamic State,” Putin told the ceremony.
The Russian leader stressed that “any attempts to whitewash terrorism and connive at terrorism should be considered as de facto complicity in terror and complicity in crimes.”
“Terrorists and their illegal trade in oil, humans, drugs, pieces of art and weapons were not only covered up and are being covered up, but someone continues earning money on this,” Putin said. “They earn hundreds of millions and billions of dollars.”
The president also stressed he expects an international counter-terrorism coalition to be formed and to support Russia’s successful operation in Syria.
READ ALSO
Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov © Artiom Geodakyan/TASS
Russia planning no war with Turkey — FM
“I hope that a real broad international coalition will be finally formed to become a coordinated, powerful force, and, in particular, will support actions of the Russian military conducting successful operations against terrorist groups and structures in Syria,” Putin said as he accepted credentials of ambassadors from 15 countries in the Kremlin.
“I’d like to hope the understanding of the need to unite efforts of the international community against terror will come after the terrorist attack on the Russian airliner in Egypt, the tragic events in France and cruel massacres in Lebanon, Nigeria and Mali,” he said.
“We believe all countries are interested in this coordinated joint work,” Putin added.”
plus
MOSCOW, November 26. /TASS/. Russian Prime Minister Dmitry Medvedev has called Turkey’s attack against the Russian Su-24M aircraft an act of aggression towards Russia and ordered the government government to develop economic restrictive measures against Ankara. He said measures of defense, diplomatic and economic nature will be taken in response.
“This is definitely an act of aggression against our state on the part of Turkey, our neighbor and the North Atlantic alliance member also,” Medvedev said.
“Defense and diplomatic response measures have already been taken against this crime and will follow as well,” the prime minister said, adding that economic measures will also take place.
The government is tasked to develop a system of response measures in economic and humanitarian spheres against the aggression act,” the prime minister said. Decisions will be made on the basis of 2006 year special economic measures law designed for such situations, he added.
READ ALSO
Moscow’s retaliation for downed Sukhoi-24M will depend on what Ankara does next
Embargo against goods from Turkey will not be introduced — Kremlin
Harm from attack on Su-24 hard to heal, Moscow wants sensible explanations — Kremlin
Russian-Turkish forum planned for December canceled — official
Russia to strengthen control over food supplies from Turkey — Ministry of Agriculture
“It establishes the following set of measures: suspension of implementing economic cooperation programs, restrictions of financial operations, restrictions of foreign trade deals, changes in import and export customs duties, measures affecting the tourism sphere, transportation, including transit, aircraft and vessels movement, humanitarian contacts, and, finally, use of the workforce,” Medvedev said.
The government was given 2 days to prepare proposals on restricting measures against Turkey. The official also said that these measures won’t have any certain end date.
“I suggest that this should be done in two days so as we can switch to practical procedures as soon as possible,” Medvedev said. “
more
“MOSCOW, November 26. /TASS/. Economic restrictions, which Russia is now imposing against Turkey, are in line with the norms of the World Trade Organization (WTO), Economic Development Minister Alexey Ulyukayev said on Thursday.
“I’d like to say that this kind of restrictions is fully in line with the norms of the World Trade Organization. Article 21 of General Agreement on Tariffs and Trade (GATT) from 1994 enables introduction of various restrictions in trade of commodities and services and in the field of investment in case of threat to national security. We’re evidencing this case,” the minister said.
Ulyukayev said the ministry will “specify the positions, which are most efficient from the viewpoint of undiminished business of Russian companies, which are cooperating with Turkish enterprises,” and “this kind of offers will be prepared very soon.”
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Kremlin hopes for inviolability of international law on Black Sea strait shipping
Putin says Turkey’s “treacherous stab in the back” unexplainable
Moscow’s retaliation for downed Sukhoi-24M will depend on what Ankara does next
Russia will scrutinize all joint projects with Turkey — Kremlin
According to Russia’s federal law on special economic measures from December 30, 2006 as well as pursuant to drafting of regulations in the form of presidential decree and government resolution, Russia can introduce measures aimed at providing security of the country and protection of legal rights and freedoms of its citizens, such as prohibiting or limiting financial, external economic, trade, investment operations, suspension of implementation of all or part of programs in the field of technical and economic aid and cooperation, cease or suspension of force of international trade agreements of the Russian Federation or other international agreements regarding external economic ties, the official said.
Besides, he said, within those measures Russia can change customs duties and set them on a number of Turkish commodities, ban or limit calling of Turkish ships at Russian ports as well as using Russia’s airspace, restrict tourist activity, withdraw from science and technical programs.”
Russia will send 12 #Su27 and #Su30 to #Syria to protect jets during their missions over #Syria.
Russia carried out over 40 raids against #Turkey proxy in reef #Latakia and reef #Idlib in the last 24hours.
What is confirmed is the Turkish convoy didn’t ask permission to cross the borders as geography is becoming an issue
Russia claim it was weapon supply. Turkey will claim Humanitarian aids.
Russian S-400 missile defense system deployed in Syria
A RIA Novosti correspondent has reported that a Russian S-400 missile defense system has been deployed in Syria on Thursday.
The S-400 Triumf (NATO reporting name: SA-21 Growler) next generation surface-to-air missile systems has been deployed to the Hmeymim airbase in Syria where the Russian Aerospace Forces group is stationed.
http://theiranproject.com/blog/2015/11/26/russian-s-400-missile-defense-system-deployed-in-syria/
http://sputniknews.com/middleeast/20151126/1030782946/s-400-syria-russia.html
wow in a day no less??????? sputnik has all the components of the system.. Seems to require 6 trucks…
http://sputniknews.com/infographics/20150121/1017169213.html
Some thoughts on the downing of the Su-24:
a) Gradual escalation by the AZ Empire was inevitable.
b) As The Saker noted (and many of us understand) the Russian forces in Syria are too small and isolated to pick-up a fight with the AZ Empire.
c) The US is probably playing a double, using both RUS and TUR in order to promote their overall strategy. Witness that Wesley Clark (and other US ex-Generals) have unambiguously criticized Turkey, both for the downing of the Russian bomber, and Turkey’s relationship to ISIS. On MSM no less.
d) Other than intensifying the campaign against NATO-rats, there is little that Russia can do at present.
e) Russia in any case would not like to react immediately. By reacting immediately, Russia will have fallen into the time-trap set-up by the AZ Empire. Russia should respond at a time of her own choosing. Remember also that Russia is not there to humiliate Turkey, Russia is there to win the war and establish her influence right in the heart of the Middle East.
f) Faking weakness for a time-period, has been a successful tactic for Russia up to now in this Global Hybrid War. It helps catching the enemy by surprise.
g) The Dardanelles Straights are a serious problem for Russia. Have been for centuries.
h) The economic measures taken against Turkey will have to hurt Turkey alone (such as stopping tourism) not the Russian economy itself which is already under pressure.
Stavros, you have marshaled your thoughts superbly. Your excellent comment should be highlighted in pastel purple or something.
John Pilger, on Paris, Isis and media Propaganda
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article43539.htm
if not posted previously
video of attempted rescue by Rus helicopters , coming under fire, Anna news video clearly stating Rus plane was shot down within Syrian territory.
https://www.rt.com/news/323468-mi8-helicopter-rescue-syria/
me again
“Turkey, a longstanding member of NATO, has long been involved in the funding of the Islamic State, and supports not only ISIL but also other jihadi groups including Ahrar al-Sham and Jabhat al-Nusra, al-Qaeda’s affiliate in Syria, British investigative journalist Nafeez Ahmed reveals.
Referring to fresh evidence and citing various sources, British investigative journalist Dr. Nafeez Ahmed has revealed that Turkey is up to its eyeballs in clandestine collaboration with Syrian Islamist groups including the notorious Islamic State; to make matters worse, the major Western powers are not going to do anything about it.”
Read more: http://sputniknews.com/politics/20151124/1030667934/turkey-funding-arming-isil-alqaeda-oil-smuggling.html#ixzz3scJ9RZOT