Haven’t watched this video & won’t….left this sad story long ago (because those nice Dutch folk leading the ‘investigation’ into this tragedy do know how to keep the status quo playing on repeat until the message sinks in)….Anyway I’ve said this before and i’ll say it again like a sad old broken record….(I should copy and paste this story)….
The only reason for the shooting down of this innocent civilian airliner that makes any sense is that it was a convenient news cover for Operation Protective Edge which was receiving some bad press as it continued at this very time. Joint Ukraine/Israeli citizen oligarchs were no doubt excited to jump at this opportunity to prove their worth to the ultimate cause – The promotion of, during its formation, and now the protection of the result, the terrorist state of Israel, being a core aim of the chosen world leadership for over a century now…. A century of such mammoth sacrifice of innocence in forever war in order to achieve success for the cause of “we-are-better-than-you-are” that if exposed may well, um, force real change?….But i’m not holding my breath….and of course might be wrong….
Truly excellent work! The full story would take days to explain, but the team have managed to fit in all the most important facts and arguments in less than 30 minutes – an outstanding achievement. Anyone seriously wishing to know the truth about MH17 can hardly grudge 30 minutes of their time.
Malaysia has announced it will announce the perpetrators in 2018..
SINGAPORE, November 16. /TASS/. The names of those responsible for flight MH17 crash in Ukraine will be known no later than in 2018, Malaysian Transport Minister Liow Tiong Lai was quoted as saying by The Star newspaper Wednesday.
The minister said the Joint Investigation Team (JIT), comprising Australia, Belgium, Malaysia, the Netherlands and Ukraine had identified 100 individuals linked to the tragedy.
READ ALSO
Poroshenko extends mandate of mission probing into MH17 crash
Russia hands international investigators new data on MH17 crash — minister
Half Russians believe MH17 was downed by Ukrainian military — poll
Russia wants MH17 probe to assess Kiev’s failure to close airspace
Russian MP says investigators’ conclusions on MH17 crash ‘premature’
“They have to call every one of them to investigate all the details,” he said. “When we have identified who shot the aircraft, we will do everything in our power to get the court in Netherlands to prosecute those responsible.”
A passenger Boeing-777 jet of the Malaysian Airlines (Flight MH17 from Amsterdam to Kuala-Lumpur) was shot down above the eastern Donetsk Region on July 17, 2014. All 283 passengers and 15 crew – citizens of ten countries – died in the disaster.
The Ukrainian authorities and forces of the self-proclaimed Donetsk People’s Republic have repeatedly accused each other of downing the plane.
On July 21, 2014, the UN Security Council demanded a full and independent investigation. Russia’s representatives have repeatedly objected to the manner of the investigation and pointed to the data provided by Russia being neglected.
Last year, the Russian manufacturer of the BUK missile, Almaz-Antey, submitted evidence that the missile could have flown only from the settlement of Zaroshchenskoye that was controlled by the Ukrainian army at the time of the tragedy.
Such brazen statements are astounding because the Lockerbie show trial has been debunked years ago:
“UN Observer: Lockerbie Trial a US/UK CIA Fake “A spectacular miscarriage of justice.”
…
1. The credibility of a key forensic expert in the trial, Mr. Allen Feraday (UK), has been shattered. It was revealed that “in three separate cases men against whom Mr. Feraday gave evidence have now had their convictions overturned˜ (BBC, 19 August 2005). Mr. Feraday had told the Lockerbie court that a circuit board fragment found after the disaster was part of the detonator used in the bomb on board Pan Am flight 103. In the first case where Mr. Feraday’s credibility had been questioned the Lord Chief Justice had stated that Mr. Feraday should not be allowed to present himself an expert in electronics.
2. A retired Scottish police officer has signed a statement confirming that the evidence that found Al-Megrahi guilty was fabricated. The police chief, whose identity has not yet been revealed, testified “that the CIA planted the tiny fragment of circuit board crucial in convicting a Libyan˜ for the bombing of the Pan Am jet (Scotland on Sunday, 28 August 2005). The fragment was supposedly part of the timing device that triggered the bomb. The circumstances of its discovery – in a wooded area many miles from Lockerbie months after the atrocity – have been mysterious from the very beginning.” http://www.williambowles.info/spysrus/lockerbie.html
I’m surprised Saker is presenting this rehash of confused and conflicting propaganda, no matter how well-intentioned. The main issue being the glossing over the “Ukraine military planes nearby”. For “cover from rebel BUKs”… ya, right.
The info and tests by the BUK manufacturer showed that IF… I repeat IF, IF IF… the type of shrapnel the Dutch “investigators” CLAIM… repeat CLAIM, CLAIM, CLAIM was found, that it MUST have come from an older BUK series Russia no longer has in service. So no BUK smuggled in from Russia by any means or insane route. The Kiev junta military admits it still has that older series operational, and MAYBE the “rebels” do too, but this only keeps the confusion-screen going.
The most telling evidence swept under the rug is the massive, very localized spread kill damage to the cockpit area by OBVIOUS round 30mm armaments of the type routinely loaded into Ukie SU25’s… no BUK of any series can produce that. And THAT is the key info the manufacturer’s test was intended to show.
But any of the BUK “story” is only applicable IF the Dutch investigation can be trusted… trusted about as far as you can throw the approx 220 tonnes of supposed WW2 “safekeeping” physical gold the Dutch repatriated from the US about the same time as “investigation report” was released. When Germany and France are still waiting for their WW2 gold? Pull the other leg. Oddly, Canada “sold” about that exact amount of physical gold about the same time, and the gold bars the Dutch got back were “recast”, not the same bars originally taken for “safekeeping”, which they should have been. Makes one go HHHMMM.
The BBC local affiliate TV crew on the ground within hours of the shoot down, where MH17 was hit, interviewing the eyewitnesses who heard the MH17 explosions… these eyewitnesses saw NO vapor trail which a BUK would have made. The witnesses live in a war zone and know all too well which weapons leave which signatures, unlike the comfortable arm-chair MSM/internet consumers of US/NATO propaganda.
So in a thumbnail of known info, the Kiev junta air traffic controllers deliberately diverted and lowered MH17’s flight path over the kill zone (a BUK can easily reach well above the standard cruising height, so why lower MH17 a few 1,000 feet?) and junta SU25 planes were admitted as “nearby” (and known to be capable of firing air-air missiles up to the height MH17 was lowered), and the well-documented 30mm munitions cockpit damage, and no witnessed BUK ground-to-air vapor trail, somehow don’t make for more accurate “questions”?
The convoluted and impossible BUK rationales are simply to distract from the obvious, Occam’s razor conclusion. A deliberate junta air-to-air shoot down. Murder, a war crime. By the Kiev neo-nazi junta.
I was also surprised Saker (or one of his moderators) would let this “sow confusion in all directions” rubbish onto the site. There is no evidence the Novorossian self-defence militias had any operational BUK missile launcher, or the expertise to use it.
They did recover a non-functional launcher in June that had been abandoned by the Ukrainian army, but both the Ukie army and Novorossian militias have stated it was not operational nor capable of being restored to operational status. Hence the need to claim Russia supplied the BUK which the Ukies claimed shot down MH-17.
I won’t bother to reiterate what “nice try” just stated above since he or she covered it off so well.
And when the Empire of Kindness shoots down an Iranian passenger jet about 30 years ago, it’s “Oops, our bad. Oh well, collateral damage.” And “we will not apologize..”
He mentions Debaltsevo in the video, and how close it was to falling to the Novoossiya militias. As I recall, there were one or two other ‘cauldrons’ cooking in the area of the shootdown. I have wondered (speculatively from 10s of 000s of miles away) if Kiev was hoping to open a lede to the cauldron(s) for ‘humanitarian’ reasons. And if that was the motivation for this atrocity.
At the time of the shoot-down Debaltcevo was under DNR control. As the video mentions it would fall to Ukrainians within a few days, and be retaken during the famouos battle of Debaltsevo in february of 2015. There was no coudron in Debaltsevo during the summer – this would happen almost 6 months later
There were no cauldrons at that time. Donetsk was close to becoming a cauldron as the Australians and Dutch where looking at sending forces to enforce an exclusion zone around the crash site which would have cut off Donetsk. The “rebels” were on the back foot and being pushed back until several weeks after the shootdown. It was two weeks after the shootdown that Ukie forces pushed into the crash zone and from that point in time no investigation could proceed due to sporadic fighting in the area and then sporadic shelling of the site from Debaltsevo until the Ukies were cooked in the cauldron there.
Great investigative work. Thank you. You did ask for comments about your statements and I have one regarding the route the Buk is said to have taken after the “launch” back to Russia. You said it seemed strange that the route meandered back to Donetsk and debaltseve and then to Lugansk to cross the border when the launch site was only a few miles from the Russian border. However, if you study the war maps of the time (mid july 2014) you will see that most of the territory adjacent to the Russian border was controlled by Kiev forces and only a small section (near Lugansk was not. This being so, it would be reasonable to expect the Buk to take the route it did (if indeed it did anyway). Just a point you need to bear in mind.
Haven’t watched this video & won’t….left this sad story long ago (because those nice Dutch folk leading the ‘investigation’ into this tragedy do know how to keep the status quo playing on repeat until the message sinks in)….Anyway I’ve said this before and i’ll say it again like a sad old broken record….(I should copy and paste this story)….
The only reason for the shooting down of this innocent civilian airliner that makes any sense is that it was a convenient news cover for Operation Protective Edge which was receiving some bad press as it continued at this very time. Joint Ukraine/Israeli citizen oligarchs were no doubt excited to jump at this opportunity to prove their worth to the ultimate cause – The promotion of, during its formation, and now the protection of the result, the terrorist state of Israel, being a core aim of the chosen world leadership for over a century now…. A century of such mammoth sacrifice of innocence in forever war in order to achieve success for the cause of “we-are-better-than-you-are” that if exposed may well, um, force real change?….But i’m not holding my breath….and of course might be wrong….
Truly excellent work! The full story would take days to explain, but the team have managed to fit in all the most important facts and arguments in less than 30 minutes – an outstanding achievement. Anyone seriously wishing to know the truth about MH17 can hardly grudge 30 minutes of their time.
Malaysia has announced it will announce the perpetrators in 2018..
SINGAPORE, November 16. /TASS/. The names of those responsible for flight MH17 crash in Ukraine will be known no later than in 2018, Malaysian Transport Minister Liow Tiong Lai was quoted as saying by The Star newspaper Wednesday.
The minister said the Joint Investigation Team (JIT), comprising Australia, Belgium, Malaysia, the Netherlands and Ukraine had identified 100 individuals linked to the tragedy.
READ ALSO
Poroshenko extends mandate of mission probing into MH17 crash
Russia hands international investigators new data on MH17 crash — minister
Half Russians believe MH17 was downed by Ukrainian military — poll
Russia wants MH17 probe to assess Kiev’s failure to close airspace
Russian MP says investigators’ conclusions on MH17 crash ‘premature’
“They have to call every one of them to investigate all the details,” he said. “When we have identified who shot the aircraft, we will do everything in our power to get the court in Netherlands to prosecute those responsible.”
A passenger Boeing-777 jet of the Malaysian Airlines (Flight MH17 from Amsterdam to Kuala-Lumpur) was shot down above the eastern Donetsk Region on July 17, 2014. All 283 passengers and 15 crew – citizens of ten countries – died in the disaster.
The Ukrainian authorities and forces of the self-proclaimed Donetsk People’s Republic have repeatedly accused each other of downing the plane.
On July 21, 2014, the UN Security Council demanded a full and independent investigation. Russia’s representatives have repeatedly objected to the manner of the investigation and pointed to the data provided by Russia being neglected.
Last year, the Russian manufacturer of the BUK missile, Almaz-Antey, submitted evidence that the missile could have flown only from the settlement of Zaroshchenskoye that was controlled by the Ukrainian army at the time of the tragedy.
More:
http://tass.com/world/912696
The Australian FM Julie Bishop has announced a Lockerbie-style show trial against Russia:
“There can be a Lockerbie-style prosecution, a tribunal that’s set up by the international community,”
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-10-02/mh17-lockerbie-style-tribunal-should-be-considered-bishop-says/7896136
Such brazen statements are astounding because the Lockerbie show trial has been debunked years ago:
“UN Observer: Lockerbie Trial a US/UK CIA Fake “A spectacular miscarriage of justice.”
…
1. The credibility of a key forensic expert in the trial, Mr. Allen Feraday (UK), has been shattered. It was revealed that “in three separate cases men against whom Mr. Feraday gave evidence have now had their convictions overturned˜ (BBC, 19 August 2005). Mr. Feraday had told the Lockerbie court that a circuit board fragment found after the disaster was part of the detonator used in the bomb on board Pan Am flight 103. In the first case where Mr. Feraday’s credibility had been questioned the Lord Chief Justice had stated that Mr. Feraday should not be allowed to present himself an expert in electronics.
2. A retired Scottish police officer has signed a statement confirming that the evidence that found Al-Megrahi guilty was fabricated. The police chief, whose identity has not yet been revealed, testified “that the CIA planted the tiny fragment of circuit board crucial in convicting a Libyan˜ for the bombing of the Pan Am jet (Scotland on Sunday, 28 August 2005). The fragment was supposedly part of the timing device that triggered the bomb. The circumstances of its discovery – in a wooded area many miles from Lockerbie months after the atrocity – have been mysterious from the very beginning.”
http://www.williambowles.info/spysrus/lockerbie.html
I’m surprised Saker is presenting this rehash of confused and conflicting propaganda, no matter how well-intentioned. The main issue being the glossing over the “Ukraine military planes nearby”. For “cover from rebel BUKs”… ya, right.
The info and tests by the BUK manufacturer showed that IF… I repeat IF, IF IF… the type of shrapnel the Dutch “investigators” CLAIM… repeat CLAIM, CLAIM, CLAIM was found, that it MUST have come from an older BUK series Russia no longer has in service. So no BUK smuggled in from Russia by any means or insane route. The Kiev junta military admits it still has that older series operational, and MAYBE the “rebels” do too, but this only keeps the confusion-screen going.
The most telling evidence swept under the rug is the massive, very localized spread kill damage to the cockpit area by OBVIOUS round 30mm armaments of the type routinely loaded into Ukie SU25’s… no BUK of any series can produce that. And THAT is the key info the manufacturer’s test was intended to show.
But any of the BUK “story” is only applicable IF the Dutch investigation can be trusted… trusted about as far as you can throw the approx 220 tonnes of supposed WW2 “safekeeping” physical gold the Dutch repatriated from the US about the same time as “investigation report” was released. When Germany and France are still waiting for their WW2 gold? Pull the other leg. Oddly, Canada “sold” about that exact amount of physical gold about the same time, and the gold bars the Dutch got back were “recast”, not the same bars originally taken for “safekeeping”, which they should have been. Makes one go HHHMMM.
The BBC local affiliate TV crew on the ground within hours of the shoot down, where MH17 was hit, interviewing the eyewitnesses who heard the MH17 explosions… these eyewitnesses saw NO vapor trail which a BUK would have made. The witnesses live in a war zone and know all too well which weapons leave which signatures, unlike the comfortable arm-chair MSM/internet consumers of US/NATO propaganda.
So in a thumbnail of known info, the Kiev junta air traffic controllers deliberately diverted and lowered MH17’s flight path over the kill zone (a BUK can easily reach well above the standard cruising height, so why lower MH17 a few 1,000 feet?) and junta SU25 planes were admitted as “nearby” (and known to be capable of firing air-air missiles up to the height MH17 was lowered), and the well-documented 30mm munitions cockpit damage, and no witnessed BUK ground-to-air vapor trail, somehow don’t make for more accurate “questions”?
The convoluted and impossible BUK rationales are simply to distract from the obvious, Occam’s razor conclusion. A deliberate junta air-to-air shoot down. Murder, a war crime. By the Kiev neo-nazi junta.
I completely agree, “nice try”.
I was also surprised Saker (or one of his moderators) would let this “sow confusion in all directions” rubbish onto the site. There is no evidence the Novorossian self-defence militias had any operational BUK missile launcher, or the expertise to use it.
They did recover a non-functional launcher in June that had been abandoned by the Ukrainian army, but both the Ukie army and Novorossian militias have stated it was not operational nor capable of being restored to operational status. Hence the need to claim Russia supplied the BUK which the Ukies claimed shot down MH-17.
I won’t bother to reiterate what “nice try” just stated above since he or she covered it off so well.
And when the Empire of Kindness shoots down an Iranian passenger jet about 30 years ago, it’s “Oops, our bad. Oh well, collateral damage.” And “we will not apologize..”
He mentions Debaltsevo in the video, and how close it was to falling to the Novoossiya militias. As I recall, there were one or two other ‘cauldrons’ cooking in the area of the shootdown. I have wondered (speculatively from 10s of 000s of miles away) if Kiev was hoping to open a lede to the cauldron(s) for ‘humanitarian’ reasons. And if that was the motivation for this atrocity.
At the time of the shoot-down Debaltcevo was under DNR control. As the video mentions it would fall to Ukrainians within a few days, and be retaken during the famouos battle of Debaltsevo in february of 2015. There was no coudron in Debaltsevo during the summer – this would happen almost 6 months later
There were other cauldrons cooking before Debaltsevo.
Debaltsevo was merely the final, largest, and most widely known cauldron.
There were no cauldrons at that time. Donetsk was close to becoming a cauldron as the Australians and Dutch where looking at sending forces to enforce an exclusion zone around the crash site which would have cut off Donetsk. The “rebels” were on the back foot and being pushed back until several weeks after the shootdown. It was two weeks after the shootdown that Ukie forces pushed into the crash zone and from that point in time no investigation could proceed due to sporadic fighting in the area and then sporadic shelling of the site from Debaltsevo until the Ukies were cooked in the cauldron there.
Great investigative work. Thank you. You did ask for comments about your statements and I have one regarding the route the Buk is said to have taken after the “launch” back to Russia. You said it seemed strange that the route meandered back to Donetsk and debaltseve and then to Lugansk to cross the border when the launch site was only a few miles from the Russian border. However, if you study the war maps of the time (mid july 2014) you will see that most of the territory adjacent to the Russian border was controlled by Kiev forces and only a small section (near Lugansk was not. This being so, it would be reasonable to expect the Buk to take the route it did (if indeed it did anyway). Just a point you need to bear in mind.