Introduction:
First things first, this is a very long statement (5300 words). It is also an extremely important one since it deals primarily with grand strategy issues (it discusses the “whats” not the “hows”). To put it succinctly, this is a common vision of the future shared between Russia and China. It is therefore also a common goal setting document. Considering its scope and objective, this is most definitely a crucial historical document.
Next, it is really important to understand who the target audience of this statement is. By definition, the target audience of such a document is the entire planet, but by its language I would argue that it is pretty clear that this is not a document addressed to anybody in the West (for one thing, it is too long for the average western reader and it is too long to be reprinted or read in full in the general press). There is a saying which all Russians know: “the East is a delicate/refined matter” (it comes from a famous Soviet movie). The style and contents of this joint statement shows that it is primarily aimed at the Russian and Chinese public, especially those in position of power: to a typical western reader the text itself looks long-winded and full of well-meaning platitudes. The Russians and the Chinese understand each other much better, and not only can they read between the lines and they can evaluate what is said and what is only suggested. The fact that some things are only alluded to does in no way make them less crucial. Again, the audience here is most definitely not a western one.
Having said all that, I want to pick, roughly in order, some key parts of that speech and try to unpack what this joint statement really says. This is a somewhat arbitrary selection, in reality, word letter and comma matter here, but for the sake of brevity, I won’t comment on the full text. I do, however, recommend that you take the time and read it here: http://10.16.86.131/joint-statement-of-the-russian-federation-and-the-peoples-republic-of-china-on-the-international-relations-entering-a-new-era-and-the-global-sustainable-development/
***
Key excerpts from the RU-CH Joint Statement: (emphasis added)
Some actors representing but the minority on the international scale continue to advocate unilateral approaches to addressing international issues and resort to force; they interfere in the internal affairs of other states, infringing their legitimate rights and interests, and incite contradictions, differences, and confrontation, thus hampering the development and progress of mankind, against the opposition from the international community.
Translation into plain English: the USA and a few of its vassal states want to maintain a world hegemony and ignore international law. This is a threat to the peace and security of our entire planet. We oppose this.
There is no one-size-fits-all template to guide countries in establishing democracy. A nation can choose such forms and methods of implementing democracy that would best suit its particular state, based on its social and political system, its historical background, traditions, and unique cultural characteristics. It is only up to the people of the country to decide whether their State is a democratic one.
Translation into plain English: there is no one way to establish real people power, and outsiders are, by definition, disqualified from judging the degree of “democracy” of any nation. Each nation has the right to decide how it wants to live, how it wants to formally structure its people power and only the people of that nation can decide whether their country’s organization faithfully expresses and upholds their national values. Outsiders cannot think of themselves as “teachers of democracy”.
The sides reaffirm their focus on building the Greater Eurasian Partnership in parallel and in coordination with the Belt and Road construction to foster the development of regional associations as well as bilateral and multilateral integration processes for the benefit of the peoples on the Eurasian continent. The sides agreed to continue consistently intensifying practical cooperation for the sustainable development of the Arctic.
Translation into plain English: we, the locals, are (and have been) building a Eurasian community which will encompass the entire Eurasian landmass and its adjacent Arctic waters. This Eurasian landmass will be sovereignly ruled by those nations who compose it.
The sides are gravely concerned about serious international security challenges and believe that the fates of all nations are interconnected. No State can or should ensure its own security separately from the security of the rest of the world and at the expense of the security of other States.
Translation into plain English: security is always and by definition collective. There cannot be security for some at the expense of the security of others. The AngloZionist Empire’s notion of unilateral security is basically putting a gun to the head of each nation on the planet with the very explicit threat to pull the trigger if that nation dares to resist this typical act of imperialist aggression.
The sides reaffirm their strong mutual support for the protection of their core interests, state sovereignty and territorial integrity, and oppose interference by external forces in their internal affairs.
Translation into plain English: we are, and will, be standing side by side and we will jointly defeat those forces who are trying to prevent us from achieving and maintaining true, full, sovereignty.
The Russian side reaffirms its support for the One-China principle, confirms that Taiwan is an inalienable part of China, and opposes any forms of independence of Taiwan.
Translation into plain English: Russia will support the Chinese efforts to reintegrate Taiwan. Russia has got China’s back.
Russia and China stand against attempts by external forces to undermine security and stability in their common adjacent regions, intend to counter interference by outside forces in the internal affairs of sovereign countries under any pretext, oppose color revolutions, and will increase cooperation in the aforementioned areas.
Translation into plain English: China will support Russia in her efforts to prevent the USA/NATO/EU to turn the Ukraine into an anti-Russia or to overthrow governments friendly to Russia. China has got Russia’s back.
The sides believe that certain States, military and political alliances, and coalitions seek to obtain, directly or indirectly, unilateral military advantages to the detriment of the security of others, including by employing unfair competition practices, intensify geopolitical rivalry, fuel antagonism and confrontation, and seriously undermine the international security order and global strategic stability. The sides oppose further enlargement of NATO and call on the North Atlantic Alliance to abandon its ideologized cold war approaches, to respect the sovereignty, security and interests of other countries, the diversity of their civilizational, cultural and historical backgrounds, and to exercise a fair and objective attitude towards the peaceful development of other States.
Translation into plain English: the West is trying to destabilize, subvert, control and destroy any country which is not willing to become a US vassal state. NATO is an aggressive, violent and totalitarian superstructure whose aim is to prevent any country from achieving sovereignty. It is just the latest iteration of Anglo imperialism. Its ideology is based on hate and projection of its own hateful worldview and ethos unto others. Its nature is imperialist and its motto divide et impera. We will oppose that geostrategic malignant tumor together.
The sides are seriously concerned about the trilateral security partnership between Australia, the United States, and the United Kingdom (AUKUS), which provides for deeper cooperation between its members in areas involving strategic stability, in particular their decision to initiate cooperation in the field of nuclear-powered submarines. Russia and China believe that such actions are contrary to the objectives of security and sustainable development of the Asia-Pacific region, increase the danger of an arms race in the region, and pose serious risks of nuclear proliferation.
Translation into plain English: AUKUS is yet a further iteration of Anglo imperialism. It is dangerous and we will oppose it together.
The sides call on the United States to respond positively to the Russian initiative and abandon its plans to deploy intermediate-range and shorter-range ground-based missiles in the Asia-Pacific region and Europe. The Chinese side is sympathetic to and supports the proposals put forward by the Russian Federation to create long-term legally binding security guarantees in Europe.
Translation into plain English: China fully backs the Russian ultimatum to the West. The West’s rejection of the Russian demands also affects to Asia-Pacific region and, therefore, it affects and even threatens China’s national interests. Russia and China have a common goal to resist the West’s imperialistic policies.
The sides note that the denunciation by the United States of a number of important international arms control agreements has an extremely negative impact on international and regional security and stability. The sides express concern over the advancement of U.S. plans to develop global missile defense and deploy its elements in various regions of the world, combined with capacity building of high-precision non-nuclear weapons for disarming strikes and other strategic objectives.
Translation into plain English: Russia will not allow the US to militarily encircle China and China will not allow the US to militarily encircle Russia. Russia and China stand back to back and will protect each other, thereby foiling any Anglo plans to encircle either one, or both, of these nations.
The sides oppose attempts by some States to turn outer space into an arena of armed confrontation and reiterate their intention to make all necessary efforts to prevent the weaponization of space and an arms race in outer space. They will counteract activities aimed at achieving military superiority in space and using it for combat operations.
Translation into plain English: Russian and Chinese space programs will make a joint effort to defeat the Anglo attempts at militarizing space, both countries will help each other to develop future space capabilities and to create and deploy the means to prevent the US from threatening them from space.
The sides emphasize that domestic and foreign bioweapons activities by the United States and its allies raise serious concerns and questions for the international community regarding their compliance with the BWC. The sides share the view that such activities pose a serious threat to the national security of the Russian Federation and China and are detrimental to the security of the respective regions.
Translation into plain English: the USA clearly has an active biowarfare program. Russia and China feel threatened by this and they will act together to stop the USA from developing illegal and dangerous bioweapons.
The Russian side notes the significance of the concept of constructing a ”community of common destiny for mankind“ proposed by the Chinese side to ensure greater solidarity of the international community and consolidation of efforts in responding to common challenges. The Chinese side notes the significance of the efforts taken by the Russian side to establish a just multipolar system of international relations.
Translation into plain English: Russia and China agree that the new, post Western, world order they want to achieve will be based on the brotherhood and solidarity of all those countries who, rather than exploiting the entire planet for the benefit of a few, want to see an international systems based on shared values rather than on greed and the oppression of the weak by the strong. In that system, relations between countries will be based on international law and the United Nations as its cornerstone and not by some ad hoc “alliances of the willing” or any other such illegal nonsense.
They reaffirm that the new inter-State relations between Russia and China are superior to political and military alliances of the Cold War era. Friendship between the two States has no limits, there are no ”forbidden“ areas of cooperation, strengthening of bilateral strategic cooperation is neither aimed against third countries nor affected by the changing international environment and circumstantial changes in third countries.
Translation into plain English: “relations between Russia and China are superior to political and military alliances of the Cold War era” is pretty darn clear: Russia and China are more than allies or “just” symbionts, the alliance they have formed is not a western-style piece of paper which can be revoked or ignored. Russia and China have decided to establish a true “friendship which knows no limits“, that is a brotherhood that is much bigger in scope and much deeper in nature than any formal alliance. The two countries see a common future and will stand by each other as two loving brothers. Note: the choice of words “friendship with no limits” has been carefully crafted to not make sense to a western audience which will see it only as “pious and vague platitudes with no binding obligations” but which will be very clear to those who come from the Russian and Chinese civilizational realms. Simply put: nobody in the West truly believes in “friendship” between states, only situational allies and personal interests. The concept of friendship has a very different meaning in China and Russia. Furthermore, “no limits” is also nonsensical in western geopolitics. Again, to a Russian or Chinese audience the paragraph above means and expresses much MORE than any “alliance”, “treaty” or “agreement”. Western political leaders simply cannot fathom or imagine what Russia and China are saying here – their minds simply cannot comprehend what is being said here.
Russia and China aim to comprehensively strengthen the Shanghai Cooperation Organization (SCO) and further enhance its role in shaping a polycentric world order based on the universally recognized principles of international law, multilateralism, equal, joint, indivisible, comprehensive and sustainable security. They consider it important to consistently implement the agreements on improved mechanisms to counter challenges and threats to the security of SCO member states and, in the context of addressing this task, advocate expanded functionality of the SCO Regional Anti-Terrorist Structure.
Translation into plain English: China and Russia will develop their full-spectrum security cooperation. Just as the CSTO recently, the SCO will soon grow more powerful “teeth” and bare them if/when needed. And don’t be fooled by the reference to “anti-terrorism” choice of worlds. The recent CSTO operation in Kazakhstan was also an “anti-terrorist” one :-)
Conclusion:
The release of this joint statement is the geostrategic equivalent of Putin’s famous speech in which he described the new Russian weapons systems: it will initially be dismissed by western politicians who will then slowly undergo the five Kübler-Ross stages of grief (denial, anger, bargaining, depression and acceptance). This “limitless friendship” working towards a “community of common destiny for mankind” is the absolute worst nightmare of western imperialism and it is only made worse by the fact that there is absolutely nothing which the West can do to foil, oppose or even slow the progress of Russia and China towards their common goal and future.
Far from “attacking” the West or from invading anybody, Russia and China have been doing something for years already, and now what that “something” is – is quite clear (at least to those with the sobriety and intelligence to see it): Russia and China are simply leaving the united West behind, letting it do its own thing (political, cultural, economic, military and even spiritual suicide) while they build an alternative.
You could say that Zone B does not want to destroy or bring down Zone A. Zone B want to offer an alternative to Zone A and then let each nation decide for itself what zone it wants to live in.
There is one word which is missing from this statement. That word is “Iran“.
It is not missing because China or Russia don’t care about Iran or don’t realize how important Iran will be for the future of the Middle-East and even our entire planet. They know that very, very well. The reason the word “Iran” is missing is simple: while Iran is most definitely a friend and ally of both Russia and China, Iran does not share a “limitless friendship” or brotherly symbiotic relationship with either country. Neither is Iran a full member of the SCO, yet (but will be soon). Talk about true diversity! These countries have completely different cultures, histories and political systems, yet they fully support each other. That is the “there is no one-size-fits-all template” model already being built before our eyes! I also believe that Iran’s bid to become a full member of the Shanghai Cooperation Organisation was approved but in needs to be formalized. Yet both China and Russia understand that Iran is crucial, not only as a gateway for Russia and China into the Middle-East, but also as a crucial member of the supra-ideological system of alliances Russia and China want to create. In fact, these countries have been helping each other for years already. But there is more, look at this:
- Russia is a democratic and “social” state, with a weird, and changing, mix of capitalism and traditional Russian collectivism.
- China is a unique mix of capitalism and Communist state control
- Iran is an Islamic Republic.
Talk about true diversity! These countries have completely different cultures, histories and political systems, yet they fully support each other.
This model will attract and easily include those Latin American countries which will choose “21 century socialism” (primarily developed by Cuba, Venezuela and Bolivia) ideology. It will also be far more attractive to many African countries than the “western imperialist boot” (examples include Mali, Burkina Faso, Congo and, potentially many others).
The map below shows the current situation.
The Russian-Chinese joint statement tells us all we need to know about how this map will change in the near future.
Andrei
Dear Andrei.
what a well written article.
Funny, we live in opposite sides of the world but have both learned to read between the lines, and I came to the same conclusion as you have just written.
Your world map explained in one glace what is happening in the world, right now.
Cheers.
Quote: what a well written article”
Concur. Saker, thanks for this^ “effort post”.
A worthy piece of work, and much appreciated.
Russia…China…and Iran aren’t destroying themselves demographically by importing legally their demographic replacements….neither is India….
Labor self-sufficiency so as not to demographically destroy themselves…
The expected casualty toll from a full Russian invasion, according to experts, an estimated 5 to 25,000 Ukrainian troops killed or wounded, 4000 Russian troops killed and an estimated 25 – 50,000 civilian casualties – along with 1 to 5 million refugees and IDPs into Europe.
The more time passes, the more things become clear: Biden does not care about Ukraine, what he wants is war against Russia. But beware! Not a United States war against Russia, but a European war against Russia where the United States will have a supplier role.
Biden wants war against Russia.
The more time passes, the clearer things become: Biden doesn’t care about Ukraine, what he wants is war against Russia. But beware! Not a United States war against Russia, but a European war against Russia where the United States will have a supplier role. The American military-industrial complex will thus be in heaven, and the United States will not have to suffer from a war on its territory.
This is how the United States and NATO, in their response to the letter sent by the Kremlin detailing Russia’s security requirements, rejected all Russian demands, de facto declaring their desire to do battle.
To that end, Biden activates his poodles. Poland, for example, always ready to cause trouble in Europe, has announced that it will start delivering arms to Ukraine next week. Turkey for its part, as a member of NATO, has sent several observation and combat drones to Ukraine. It also seems that their quality leaves something to be desired since the Russian electronic defense systems make all these drones totally useless: They are put out of harm’s way as soon as they take off. Range of Russian electronic defense systems: 600 km. A drone sent by Kiev to spy on the Belarusian border was thus sent to the carpet as soon as one of its wings had grazed the Belarusian territorial limit.
Estonia has also sent “cyber specialists” to Kiev to strengthen the defense of networks against possible Russian computer attacks. When we remember that attacks last year put all the administrations of Estonia out of service for several days, we understand the qualities of their specialists… And NATO of course has been pouring tons of weapons into Ukraine for several weeks.
Faced with this, Ukrainian President Zelensky seems to react, he and his government declare almost every day that there is no evidence that Russia is preparing to attack. This does not sit well with Biden and according to some sources, the Americans could launch a campaign to smear Zelensky by portraying him as a coward in order to incite extremist forces to take power in Ukraine. And thus to guarantee a war!
On the ground, Zelensky all the same accepts the participation of foreign troops in possible battles, reinforces the military positions on the borders and it is clear that he is preparing an offensive against Donbass. According to the Intelligence of the Donetsk and Lugansk republics, heavy weapons, foreign instructors (British and American) and CIA operators are on the front line.
Diplomatically, Biden’s pugs are agitated. Macron called on President Putin for… For what? According to a senior civil servant “to be able to make people talk about him in France where he is hated by his people”… He will be in Moscow on February 7 (then in Kiev on the 8) and Vladimir Putin is no doubt trembling! Moreover, according to a source in the French government, Macron intends to take BHL in his luggage… But in Kiev only: BHL is apparently afraid to come to Russia, who knows why… It will be interesting to see if he is in Kiev alongside Macron, he who openly called for war against Russia!
Hungary, for its part, announced its support for Russia, and signed a huge gas supply contract. China has also lent its support to Russia.
On February 14, the Russian Parliament will most likely decide to “recognize” the independence of the republics of Donetsk and Lugansk. In these 2 republics, more than a million citizens have received Russian citizenship and it is perfectly clear that if Ukraine attacks, Russia will go there to defend its nationals.
In the Western media the forecasts are going well and every week an “imminent invasion” (of Ukraine) of Russia is announced. But nothing happens. Quite simply, none of these media “under the orders” of Western governments dares to “predict” that Russia will intervene only if (or when…) Ukraine attacks its nationals in the Donbass.
And according to sources at the Russian General Staff, this will happen between February 18 and 22.
Boris Gennadevich Karpov
https://boriskarpov.tvs24.ru
war is coming
” But beware! Not a United States war against Russia, but a European war against Russia where the United States will have a supplier role”.
I can assure you that few in Europe want to go to war against Russia. The days of Napoleon, Kaiser and Hitler are over, becoming part of history. How many Europeans in their right state of mind want to die for the imperial interests of Wall Street and Washington DC ?
sadly, I don’t share your optimism about Europeans…
IMHO they truly are the “great supine protoplasmic invertebrate jellies” (to use BoJo’s own words).
Then this begs the question of what Russia wants if no agreement is possible, land for past energy debts rings a bell.
No one talks about the real action, they just react politically, and badly at that.
We can talk about the History of Agreements but more importantly we’re talking about the Future of Mankind should these satanic vermin not be eliminated, some sanctioned. banished to some Island like Napoleon but without the luxuries of a bidet. Screw burying any hatchet, unless it’s into the forehead of those who are responsible for genocidal colour revolutions and bloodshed. I promise not to wince when my bayonet splits Hillary’s anus.
Same.
After engaging with several Europeans across the web, they seem deeply entrenched in hegemonic liberal extremism. From an American POV: An entire continent filled with liberal Democrats, and that just doesn’t sound like a fun time to me. I mean Republicans are bad but Democrats are worse. The devil you know, etc.
The Saker
BoJo cannot be taken seriously. He is an Eton boy, trained to protect the interests of the UK elite. Some have even said that he likes to impersonate Winston Churchill. What this means is that he is living in the past, in the days of World War One and World War Two, when you had mass conscription for war and when enthusiasm was not lacking, at least not in the beginning. He really thinks that Europeans would rally and support a major war against Russia which, in my opinion, is simply not the case.
Boris is a member of the “educated” but “idiot” class
He is quick witted, speaks Latin and is very articulate, but seems oblivious to common sense and rational thought.
he is not quick witted
I saw him once on a TV show in JUSA – and was shocked with how boring, bland and irrelevant he was in everything he said.
for some reason I thought he would be very funny and interesting
perhaps because he looks like an obese clown?
agree with he belong to same group as current District of Clowns…..
The native populations in Western Europe have become pussified. The non-native populations less so but they feel zero allegiance to the West. That would leave Eastern Europeans but which ones exactly and at which numbers? Seems like substantial mobilization, percentage-wise, might be achievable in Poland and the Baltic countries as well as, to a lesser extent, in Bulgaria and Romania. It’s doubtful whether that would suffice especially as nobody is accustomed to modern large-scale conventional warfare, let alone nuclear. Not too long ago, Andrei Martyanov made a program about brain injuries in modern warfare, particularly taking into account what happened when the Iranians attacked a US air base in Iraq in the aftermath of the Soleimani assassination. This kind of thing is not on anyone’s radar in the West.
If it’s about the ruling circles in politics and the media, they feel extremely safe in their positions as witnessed by their disregard for the suffering that they have inflicted and are still inflicting by their Covid policies. They cannot imagine that anything, anyone could ever challenge them in the comfort of their bubble existence. They will falter all the more readily as soon as any such challenge will ever come to pass.
Europe might talk of war, but is not ready for it. Politicans like Macron, Scholz and Draghi actually seem to be getting cold feet (quite literally given the naural gas situation), and even Zelensky is showing signs of it.
Which europeans? While ordinary people in the western europe may have been brainwashed to do US bidding (which is doubtful, they’re not that stupid), there are very few ordinary people in the eastern europe countries that would move a finger to fight against Russia.
Indeed, our politicos may have sold us out to US for a tap on the shoulder (not even for 30 pieces of silver as the usual proce goes), but the ordinary people aren’t idiots. On the other hand – you’re probably judging it from what you see in the MSMs, but let me assure – our MSMs are bigger parrots to the US party line than CNN and BBC themselves. In other words, compared to our MSMs, CNN and BBC are beacons of truth.
Exactly- mr. Kovachev
Nobody in Sweden wants a war with Russia. They’re fooled into thinking Russia will start a war. The Russophobia is real, but I assure, none of the plebs want war.
The expected casualty toll from a full Russian invasion, according to experts, an estimated 5 to 25,000 Ukrainian troops killed or wounded, 4000 Russian troops killed and an estimated 25 – 50,000 civilian casualties – along with 1 to 5 million refugees and IDPs into Europe.
I wonder who those “experts” are.
@ Mr. Martyanov
As Lord Salisbury told the Viceroy of India, in yet another anti-Russian hysteria (1877), “The Russians are cooominggg…,”
“… No lesson seems to be so deeply inculcated by the experience of life as that you never should trust experts. If you believe the doctors, nothing is wholesome: if you believe the theologians, nothing is innocent: if you believe the soldiers, nothing is safe. They all require to have their strong wine diluted by a very large admixture of insipid common sense.”
Lone Wolf
@ Andrei Martyanov
There is a very interest article from Alexander Dugin : Why a War will be good for Ruusia ‘
On Telegram , or anti-empire blog , I would very much appericate your thoughs .Thank you.
Tom 123
I would very much appericate your thoughs .Thank you.
I don’t read Dugin because I think he is not mentally sound, apart from being ignorant on many key issues of geopolitics. He is a prominent demagogue, though.
I TOTALLY agree with Andrei Maryanov: Dugin is a sad and ugly clown, a well read and well spoken one, but a dangerous clown nonetheless. Folks like Dugin (or that idiot Kedmi) want war – which no sane person would ever wish for, much less so a person with ethics/morality.
There is a reason why I never even mention Dugin and his toxic hallucinations on the blog.
Amen! Anyone who thinks war is worth entertaining raises my suspicion. I have read something of his, back around 2014. He said Russia is like a heart beat or a breathing organism that expands and contracts. I think he was implying that Russia should have swept the moment when Donbass took to the streets and swept aside Ukraine. This is not how one develops a secure, civilized zone. I am speaking off memory, but I believe it was back when he was teamed up with another site.
Some will argue that the Pravij Sektor, Bandarists will cause trouble for East Ukraine and Russia. Well, it does for the entire Ukraine. East Ukrainians stood up, but none of the rest did. They must grow tired of their own stupidity and fix it themselves. Russia shouldn’t fix it for them.
I personally like this place and Andrei Martyanov for the English/Russian discussion. Tass for headliners. Rest, I just look in Russian news for headliners. US media is revolting crap.
To be honest, I have read a couple of Dugin’s books, mainly to get an idea of his thoughts on ‘Eurasia.’ A bit obtuse in parts but he does have some interesting ideas about Russia as a civilisation, and an old one at that. Having said that he does seem to be convinced of the inevitable conflict between the ‘civilisation of the Heartland’ (Eurasia) and that of the Sea.
I don’t keep track of social media for lack of time, so thanks for bringing his demagoguery to the fore — that has changed the complexion somewhat.
Cheers.
To be honest, I have read a couple of Dugin’s books, mainly to get an idea of his thoughts on ‘Eurasia.’ A bit obtuse in parts but he does have some interesting ideas about Russia as a civilisation, and an old one at that.
A person who seriously promotes Hyperborean Theory and argues that Stephen Hawking didn’t know the nature of time, as Dugin argued, should be observed by serious psychiatrist. In related news, Dugin barely graduated from Stavropol agricultural college–the only formal education he has.
Dugin has been promoted a lot in the western so-called “alt media” as some kind of nationalist guru, despite the fact that Dugin claims to be against nationalism as we would understand the term. How extensive Dugin’s intellect is can be seen by watching no more than 10 to 15 minutes of his supposed debate with Bernhard Henry Levi, an Atlanticist fascist of the first order – which was described by some as the “debate of the century” & “a triumph for Dugin’s 4th theory” etc. ect. Dugin shows himself as the idiot he is in this debate, he neither substantially challenges Levi on anything at all, but goes some way to rubbing up to him & fawning over him – Dugin basically could not believe himself that he was honoured with such a high place as debating the esteemed & legendary Levi. I watched 30 minutes of this nonsense & turned it off before I puked over myself – I later forced myself to watch the rest, in snippets, just to confirm what I had thought all along – that Dugin is actually an Atlanticist shill, he is an advocate of a form of globalism himself, his Eurasianism is an anti-Russian ideology in its essence, to the extent it has an essence, & Dugin himself can barely put together a coherent sentence expressing a concrete idea or observation, in this he has really mastered the western school of philosophy by disguising total BS in abstract & vague terminology. He is an imbecile – & the west loves him, he is their ideal Russian (non) nationalist.
Concur on Kedmi—could smell a rat the first time I heard him on some Russian show, pretending to be pro-Russian but really only pro-Israel. And then there’s that “former” KGB agent who jumped ship when the USSR went down and is making the rounds on YouTube as an “expert” on Communist subversion, a go-to for neocon McCarthyists. Don’t recall the name, but what a weasel.
Yes, Dugin is absolutely crazy.
Those figures come from Faux News https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kokM8pdOIJg As to where they obtained those figures? Who knows?
Ah, OK. Lt. Colonel Davies, however, is one of those American military professionals who makes sense and knows what he is talking about. At least that part of having him on Fox is positive. So, most likely Fox “experts” pull those numbers out of their asses. If it comes to, God forbids. real war in Ukraine, Russia will simply demolish C4ISR infrastructure of VSU and will obliterate large portion of Nazi battalions like Azov, after that LDNR forces will mop up. Russia does not want or need Ukraine, at all in any form.
“Russia does not want…”. Yes, Russia has been struggling with demographics for ever. A land to easily accommodate 300 million and counting on just 144 million. Late 1800s: Over 170 million. A century of wars, internal persecutions and revolutions have created a significant deficit. Thus, US/UK barking about Russia’s aggression, expansionism shows a desire to mock the nations – and a revelation of their own ideology and workings.
I only see any of this possible, by decision of the nutcases in Nationalists part of Ukraine to go on an offensive, encouraged by the US/UK. All this for propaganda points the US can use against Russia. The play is infantile in its creation, but seeing how the leadership of these countries are, it is a vague possibility. I still think Western media and bot armies are effective of creating hype. A Russophobic ‘Steve Jobs’ character in a turtle neck sweater speaking on stage would be a cherry on top. Don’t think the idiot Psaki can sell anything.
If any Western decision maker does go for it, the world will be a very, very different place the following day. And it won’t be a benefit to them or anyone. I personally think this is an operation to shape opinions and manufacture consent. I think economic factors of the US is shaping these policies.
As the Saker said, they removed embassy staff out of Ukraine, but no one did that in Russia.
Thank you both for sharing expertise and knowledge.
Dear comrade Martyanov,
I would strongly disagree.
Russia needs every SQ ft of Ukraine except Western Ukraine, Russia need northern part of Kazakhstan…etc. Russia needs every single part of former USSR where Russians lived.
It is not about land, reason is simple, if that piece of land is not yours, it will belong to your enemies.
All these borders made by Lenin, Stalin, Khrushchev etc. were for internal USSR use and drunken puppet Yeltsin recognize them as state borders, instead of fixing everything before dissolution caused by naive Gorbachev.
My guess is that in case of an agression by the neo-nazis against Donbass, the Russians will not need to put a foot in Ukraine to destroy the attacking neo-nazis bataillons. That means zero casualty for Russia,
I guess the same “experts” who dream that the russians are going to fight any potential war by sending one tank at a time to be destroyed by Javelins that the US MIC sold to the Ukies recently. Assuming that you’re the same Andrei Martyanov, who’s writing https://smoothiex12.blogspot.com, you know better than anyone that this won’t be the case ;-)
The Empire has made it abundantly clear that they will fight Russia to the last Ukrainian. The few Ukrainians I have met are not stupid. It is hard to believe the Ukrainian people, their military and their government officials are unaware of this. It is one thing to shout about their hostility to Russia, especially if that brings all sorts of handouts from the West, but it is quite another thing to commit mass suicide on behalf of an Empire which regards you rather like cattle in a feed lot.
They are not stupid (well, not all), but they have been majorly propagandised in the last 30 years. I was told that most 40 and under simply do not have an understanding of reality, because all they’ve ever heard is western nonsense. Those over 40 may have some sense of perspective.
(A funny story: when I was last in Kiev (1995), it puzzled me that many young women walked around in see-through blouses. This was their declaration of freedom! Of course, if one knew how conservative USSR was in these matters, it’d make some sense, but still…! Utterly bizarre, and also revealing (no pun intended).)
Things are apparently so bad, that a family friend, who was an ukr. diplomat, resigned and stayed in a nearby country, with the entire family. Said there is no hope in Ukr., Kiev overrun with military and secret service personnel from “friendly” countries (and this was last year, before all the brouhaha).
Quote: Macron intends to take BHL in his luggage… But in Kiev only: BHL is apparently afraid to come to Russia, who knows why…..”
I’m fairly certain BHL is person non grata in Russia. As is Nuland. But a waiver was granted for her official role.
BHL may not want the scrutiny of public discussion on his status.
Thanks for providing a translation of Karpov’s article, wic.
I don’t know who Karpov is but like most he’s predicated the ‘action’ between the Ukraine and RF on the Olympics. Everybody waits for the Olympics to end; why is that? Why can’t the war that the West is lusting for start tomorrow, perhaps initiated by Nato which has troops in the Ukraine, behind Zelensky’s back ?
I believe Macron’s visit to Moscow is important, as is the visit of Germany’s Scholz, not only on the possible impact on Nato — which is showing some cracks on its edifice — but also the Normandy Four meetings; perhaps we could see some movement on Minsk after that.
If the RF General Staff thinks that some sort of armed action is going to take place between ‘February 18 and 22’, we can be pretty sure that the RF military, which prefers to deter armed conficts rather than fight a war, would have taken steps to prevent the said action. Having said that, we do not necessarily have to be informed of the actions taken by the RF General Staff, of course.
Feb 18 to Feb 22 sounds about right. The US coup of 2014 was on 2/22/14. Also Crimea was “given” to Soviet Union on Feb. 19 1954. US empire likes to play with dates and numbers for its attacks.
Especially on the following dates: 20-02-2022 , or two days later, on the
palindromic 22-02-2022. with six 2’s. These chaps are addicted to kabbalistic numerics.
My bet is on 22-Feb. I may lose the bet due to a) RF preventative action,
or b) sudden onset of rationality among deep circles.
Best regards, Spiral
This is the most major political manifesto of our times. This is how the next 40 years is going to develop.
@amarynth,
Since the statement is aimed at the non-West world in its syntax and lexicon, I’m not so certain of its manifestation.
If the world reads it and agrees, it will be the guiding document for the arrangement of global powers and responsibilities.
But the West, the US in particular, practices ignorance and avoidance of such statements, speeches, and proclamations.
What it could be is an unspoken invitation for others to coalesce their efforts and wishes with Russia and China.
In particular, since AUKUS was pinned in this statement, ASEAN nations and India are stakeholders in the peace-making China and Russia are offering.
If the other nations refuse to support the containment of China, AUKUS will be restricted to a vast island in the South Pacific, outcast, alone, visited by its “partners”, but left behind. Australia is the big loser in the US-UK plans for war in the Asia Pacific.
US, NATO and AUKUS are impediments to this geopolitical stratagem.
We shall have to see momentum of other nations moving toward and along with Russia-China to see a forward trajectory of this coordination for a new era. Otherwise, it is a defense document and energy alliance. Nothing more.
The west seems intent on creating a modern feudal system. The exact opposite of what China and Russia are working to implement.
West never abandoned feudal system. The one change was hiding feudal families (Houses) behind walls of proxy institutions.
The other is that serfs do not believe that Masters have Mandate of Heaven. Now they believe in democracy.
And now the serfs are coming to the realisation that “democracy” is two wolves and a lamb voting on what is for dinner. There are far more lambs than wolves, and I have seen what happens when an inexperienced dog gets run over by a mob of sheep. Not pretty.
But it does give rise to interesting possibilites
@ Larchmonter445
I agree with what you stated ,but the west will not go down the new path until there is war and or
the US Dollar is removed one way or another ( this is there greatest weapon ) ,but also the removal of the dollar
may start the war.
Thank you
Tom 123
Dear Larchmonter,
Two statements of yours that I totally concur with:
1) Australia is the big loser in the US-UK plans for war in the Asia Pacific.
2) Otherwise, it is a defense document and energy alliance. Nothing more.
“ Otherwise, it is a defense document and energy alliance. Nothing more.”
I think it depends on how effectively Russia and China can help the many people in Zone B stand up for their own rights, as Russia has done for Syria and Iran for Lebanon. In this, Latin America and Africa will have a big part to play, especially with elections coming up in Brazil.
Note I say people and not current governments, many of which are regimes chosen by Western interests.
Concordo plenamente. O único ( e grande senão), no caso do Brasil, é que somos um dos três únicos países do mundo onde as eleições são digitais e sem impressão do voto para auditagem !!! Além disto, nem o atual governo nem o provável próximo dão sinais de saírem do jugo atlanticista.
Rússia e China serão o ponto de inflexão da atual zona B. Mas nossas elites são lentas e burras.
I fully agree. The only (and big problem), in the case of Brazil, is that we are one of the only three countries in the world where elections are digital and without printing the vote for auditing !!! Furthermore, neither the current government nor the likely next one show signs of getting out of the Atlanticist yoke.
Russia and China will be the inflection point of the current zone B. But our elites are slow and dumb.
“…elections are digital and without printing the vote for auditing !!! ”
Rigging elections was never the problem. Implementing blatantly obvious corruptable system tells couple of things.
One, Brazil is to important for Them to be lost. Two, they perfectly know They would lose by landslide without cheating. Classic cheating won’t do it anymore.
I didn’t know about paperless voting. Now, I feel much better about Brasil.
@Larchmonter445
“We shall have to see momentum of other nations moving toward and along with Russia-China to see a forward trajectory of this coordination for a new era. Otherwise, it is a defense document and energy alliance. Nothing more.”
Even if I agree with you that this statement By Russia and China may become only a defense document and energy alliance in case it stays restricted to Russia and China, allow me to disagree with the choice of words “Nothing more”. Even though it may not have been your intention, these words tend to minimize the impact of such an alliance. I think this alliance will make a major difference in the economic relations between nations, allowing Russia and China to impose a major obstacle to the West’s imperialism, opening opportunities to other countries to also progress under lesser yoke from the West. That, on the other hand, may provide the momentum you mentioned.
But further than that, I tend to agree with @amarynth. I think the masses in the West are tired and starting to despair because of the state of conflict and divisiveness that has been seeded for so long on the West. I’d say many people are longing for a more collaborative society. If Russia and China can pull something concrete from this document, it may very well provide the catalyst to other nations to join the new order. If that is the case, I think this document may be seen in the future as a major political manifesto. As you said, we shall have to wait, but, at least in my case, I’ll wait with hope.
Speaking of hope, I’d like to reply to a comment above by @war is coming. I know we have a rough road ahead of us before we can reach a more peaceful and friendly order. The Saker posts many articles here in this blog about the current situation in eastern Europe. The elites in the West will not go down willingly and peacefully. A local war may indeed happen, and for that we must be ready and prepared. It makes sense to discuss the current situation. However, at least to me, this post in particular by the Saker is a post of hope. I must admit it was a shock to read the comment by @war is coming which only talks about the prospects of war. To me, it sounded the exact opposite of what the post was all about. Even though the current situation demands us to be prepared, and that certainly entails discussing defensive and offensive actions, I think man cannot live on this state of mind only. I think Putin even said that when Russia published her ultimatum. We need hope, too. So, even though that comment may be pertinent in other posts in this blog, I get the feeling it is misplaced in this thread. My opinion only. Call me Pollyana if you wish… :-D
Smaller nations are like Remora fish, following a shark. They have to have benefit to follow. They may switch due to cultural similarities. Though economic benefit is a key driver. I think political influence is bought. It will be an interesting time. Remember the US Air Base in Kyrgyzstan? They made a deal and closed it, but US came in with a bigger briefcase and lo-and-behold it remained open. These type plays, plus other nations making determined decisions to join new economic sphere’s is entirely possible. Lot of nations have their economic potential suppressed. I don’t think anything is predictable, but the Chinese/Russian friendship shows promise of a new system others can lean on and that, I think, IS a thing that can cause change.
@Ugh…
Correction. The US currently has no military installations inside C. Asia. They closed the Kyrgyzstan base in 2014.
They have a far more dangerous weapon in the region; bioweapons labs. Gladly, it seems that Russia /China are having a close eye on them.
You are right, time has passed since that drama and it has since passed back to Kyrgyz control.
And the biolabs in the area are definitely a bad thing. There was a Lady who did some investigative work at the Lugar center. She filmed red license plated vehicles from the US embassy showing up there, an entomologist being one. There are other centers now. So nations are right to be concerned.
Agreed. While it was a formalization of something which has been ongoing already, is is now clear that Russia and China have come to the same conclusion: we are now strong enough to speak plainly, at least to our own people and those in Zone B.
Zone A is dead. It was not even killed.
It committed suicide.
Hugs
Zone A is not dead. Yes, our professional class, the elites are generally rotten, but if you think it’s over, you are mistaken. For example, here are two young men running for the Senate and the House respectively, J. D. Vance, and Patrick Witt. They are likely to win. I can find some interviews, or you can do so yourself. These men are impressive in every way and there are others. It’s not clear who is going to win this battle yet, the totalitarians or those who believe in the American system (which is codified in the US Constitution) and personal liberty.
I agree with you Amarynth – In fact to me it is a real ‘Great Reset’ that will draw many other nations to their system given they say it is to be a “Community of common destiny for mankind”.
This Joint Statement proves the importance of Euro-Asia, as pointed out by English geographer Halford Mackinder in 1904. The Anglo-American elites, who control private banks and corporations, have since the 19th century done their utmost to prevent a German-Russian-Chinese economic and political alliance, as advocated by Bismarck. The two world wars (where Russia was the chief target) and subsequent regional wars were the result. The strategy failed. Russia and China have a de facto political and economic alliance, with occupied Germany left out, at least for now.
What the Anglo-Americans failed to do with military means, they tried with political, attempting to create a rift between China and Russia. In 1971 Nixon sends Kissinger to China in an attempt to bring it into the Western camp. The Chinese play along, but do not turn their backs of Russia, with the result that they are reaping benefits from both Russia and the US. The Anglo-Americans again turn against Russia, instigating the 2014 coup in Kiev and hoping to bring Ukraine into NATO, so that NATO missile systems would be placed close to the Russian border. It did not turn out too well, with the result that today we have the situation that we have.
These methods by the Anglo-American elites have led to a rift being created in both the EU and NATO, as nobody in Europe can forget the two world wars, nor are the majority of continental European countries prepared to lose trade due to Washington’s sanctions, a perfidious tactic to both weaken Russia and bring Europe closer to the US. As one analyst has stated, it’s only a matter of time before a rift occurs between the elites of continental Europe and those of the US which, after all, is on the other side of the Atlantic. Continental Europe’s turning towards Russia and China will mean the end of both the EU and NATO.
Bravo BF…the entire scenario summed up in just three pragraphs.
The Anglo/American/Israeli alliance’s irrelevance has now been formalised and announced to anyone on the globe that cares to listen. I hope Europe is… they will be the biggest losers if they back the wrong horse.
BTW a wonderful unpack and explanation of this incredibly important agreement by Andrei… a huge Bravo to you as well.
Cheers
Col
B.F., excellent overview of the historical capsule and well summarized and parsed Saker.
The only addition I have is a reminder of the importance of the media horn for the Hegemon. They are down to control of the narrative and drowning out reality through overwhelming noise.
“To put it succinctly, this is a common vision of the future shared between Russia and China”
Zone A has no wholesome vision. Anglo-Zionists are like their children the Azov Battalion – they require an ugly climate filled with hate in order to be unobtrusive, to thrive and to exploit nations.
If they lower the media hysteria, folks would have the peace of mind and quiet to absorb the implications of this document, and realize who is the enemy. It would be Game Over without Zone B having to fire a bullet.
“The only addition I have is a reminder of the importance of the media horn for the Hegemon. They are down to control of the narrative and drowning out reality through overwhelming noise.”
Absolutely! The media noise here in Australia is absolutely deafening and relentless – so much so, that on social media I’m seeing people who I thought had reasoning active brains starting to succumb…..mind you, the government, run by a lying psychopath Prime Minister and psychopathic, incompetents the rest, it’s no wonder.
My impression of American politics is that it is all ‘Politics of Hate’ these days.
That began with Ronald Reagan, him and Roger Ailes, founder of Fox News, or at least manager for Murdoch. They were the ones who seem to originally perfect the Politics of Hate. Money powered negative ads and the politics of hate was the formula of the morning in America.
These days, the Democrats are just the same. Their only message is one of hatred. That hate Trump. They hate the workers. They hate the Russians. They hate pretty much anyone who isn’t an American billionaire. And the subgroups within the party are the same, and they all hate each other. If someone suggested a group-hug in the Democrats, they’d find five knives in their back, and that their scalp was now being waved around as a trophy. The old leftist concept of solidarity has been publicly executed to the cheers of the Democrats.
Its strange, there is little support for the war. But in politics, there is almost no anti-war/peace movement. It used to be within the Democrats after Vietnam. In the last primaries, there was only one anti-war voice, and she was attacked for being Putin’s Agent and got about 1% of the vote and polls. So, the Democratic Party was about 99% pro-war, and 1% antiwar.
A few of the fake lefties have recently made some antiwar noises, but they are powerless and useless and I don’t really believe them since they only seem to have found the position as they discover to their surprise that war is unpopular. None of them have mentioned it before in campaigns or speeches that I can recall. At this point, their credibility is low as they’ve earned the rep of being all talk, no action, no fight. So, when they make vague comments with no plan, no action, not even a suggestion for how to stop the war, nobody bothers to listen to them.
For awhile it looked like there was going to be a Libertarian antiwar movement in the Republicans. But that has now been swallowed by the Trump Cult of Personality, and the Republican stance on war is whatever Donald tweets today. These days I guess that means that the party of Reagan is now the party of brain-damaged, incoherent hate.
If there is resistance, it probably comes outside the political and media areas. It would come from workers who are already overworked and underpaid and stretched to the limit who are now told that everything gets worse because of the war. But it will be disorganized and un-led, and subjected to massive social media/propaganda campaigns to confuse and disorient them. So, my guess the elites can keep control … until they can’t, and all their tricks finally collapse and a sick, hungry and evicted American people says enough. But that may not happen until the country is in ruins and everyone is pushing around wheelbarrows of dollars to buy a loaf of bread.
My compliments for your smart assessment, B.F.
Also my compliments for this great ‘translation’ of Andrei, while most of the Western media are still grasping on what this joint statement means. This means more of the western media than of the messengers, while for instance the very clear statements of Putin’s 2007 Munich speech are litterally emerging before our very eyes, but apparantly too many people in the west are watching but not seeing.
I want to make a clear opinion about Europeans ‘going to war’. It just won’t happen and I say this from Germany. I don’t care what idiot Eton-boy BoJo babbles, does this muppet even grasp what opinions are held here, outside the usual babblers in politics? *They* are not marching, they may want *us* to march.
We won’t.
In the first place: with what? Are people aware in what kind of shambles the Bundeswehr is (thaks Ursula)?
And, by far more important in the second place: for what, for whom, exactly? Do I have to spell it out or do they think that we are stupid? Do those puppets in the Kanzleramt really think that the nuke sites here are not a target, if not the nation as a whole? Including babbling banker puppet Baerbock to whom Lavrov had to explain the Cuba crisis, those?
Furthermore, it is not exactly mentioned in the official historical narratives what happened here after ’45. I’m talking about the Morgenthau Plan (in fact it was Stalin who stopped it), the killing and starvation of 1-2 million POW, the same of about an equale amount of civilians migrating from the east.
It may not be teached officially and it won’t be mentioned in public, but you bet that these stories are told over generations at kitchen tables. We know. And our children will know. And we know darn well that we are an occupied nation, so don’t start would-be smartass gibberish about ‘visitors that are hard to get leaving’ or crap like that. And with ‘we’ I mean citizens, you know, those that generate the money that politicians get paid with.
So, to say it in German: ‘mach es selber, du Drechskerls’.
I think I’ll stay buckled up.
Cheers and best wishes from Germany, Rob
Rob
I believe that the Morgenthau Plan pertained to the entire population of Germany, where proposals were made that the entire population be exterminated and the lands of Germany split between it’s neighbors. It did not come to that. However, something similar happened.
When Germany surrendered in 1945, you had a mass of German POW’s. General Patton of the Third US Army simply released them, sending them to their homes. However, General Eisenhower introduced his famous death camps, a total of ten POW camps, each of 10 square miles, a total of 100 square miles. Prisoners were simply starved to death, being also denied water. Analysts are not sure what the exact number of killed POW’s was, but numbers vary from 700.000 to 1,700,000, the figure of 1,700,000 being more often quoted. The dead bodies were taken to giant military tents, where they were immersed with chemicals which turned their bodies to dust, thus removing all evidence of what was done. This event is still taboo among historians.
Finally, contrary to popular perception, Eisenhower was not an American of German origin. Both of his grandparents were Jews from Sweden.
“In 1971 Kissinger persuaded Nixon to send him to China in a Jewesih attempt to bring it into the Western camp.”
I appreciate the work behind this article.
As a counterpoint to the hope for a bright global future implicit in the joint China/Russia (alphabetical order), declaration, I hope The Saker will forgive me for posting a link to an article which describes the War Crimes committed by the US during the `Korean war. It reveals a complete contempt for morality and International Law and illustrates precisely why North Korea feels the need to protect itself; it shows what kind of future an Anglo American World can look forward to.
https://russia-insider.com/en/history/us-atrocities-korean-war-chem-and-bio-weapons-mass-civilian-bombing-and-execution/ri23685
Thanks immensely for posting the findings of the committee for investigating war crimes and atrocities of US forces against the people of the DPRK.
It’s been a great week/month for us humanitarians. The Great Western Empire finally exposed, naked with no moral values. Feels like someone’s lifted a huge weight off my shoulders and brain. Still, we must keep pushing for these genocidal maniacs are out there, free, heavily armed and dangerous and Interpol wont be out there looking for them.
Hastily convened courts, summary executions and live ICC war crime trials for the Mafia Leaders. Bush, Blair, Clintons, Obama to kick things off.
Hearts & Minds
The conflict with Russia was orchestrated by Apartheid Israhell’s minions within the USG
because Russia is an impediment to Israhell’s design for the MidEast.
https://biblicisminstitute.wordpress.com/2015/06/25/imperial-warmongering/
In the process, the Zionist Neocons, including Bloomberg, mortally wounded America
and the consequences are just getting started.
https://biblicisminstitute.wordpress.com/2014/07/17/is-america-cursed/
Good information for reference thank you!!
“The Russian side reaffirms its support for the One-China principle, confirms that Taiwan is an inalienable part of China, and opposes any forms of independence of Taiwan.”
Translation into plain English: Russia will support the Chinese efforts to reintegrate Taiwan. Russia has got China’s back.
Seems to me that this would have been the perfect opportunity for China to reciprocate and offer the Russian side same support by affirming that Crimea is, and always has been, an inalienable part of Russia. Is Taiwan as Chinese as Crimea is Russian? The joint statement does not recognize that. The vague statement about “Russia and China stand against attempts by external forces to undermine security and stability in their common adjacent regions…” is not an equivalent level of support or commitment.
China has largely ridden Russia’s coat tails for a while now in matters of conflict and destabilisation, while growing ever stronger without having to face the hegemon directly and this tepid/generic” support”, I find disappointing…China now has the resources, close ties/alliances and power (military and economic) to claim its place in the World and this moment should have been its (more forceful) coming out party. What we just got seems to be just more of the same.
I understand that part of the strategy is to let the opponent(s) fall all on their own but, this message not being forceful, and as the Saker says, meant not so much for the West, leaves a lot of room for misunderstanding (interpreted as “weakness”) and may lead to the West (thinking it still has a say) making mistakes/miscalculations and acting dangerously. I was rather expecting a request/plea from Syria for a united Russia/China to force the issue of the total elimination of all foreign actors from their terrritory. Something like that (and I see Syria as the best place, and in most need of, this kind of joint action) would have been an un ambiguous message, both domestically (where it would likely have been well received) and to the “partners”.
Cheers,
“Is Taiwan as Chinese as Crimea is Russian?”
Just about. Both territories were acquired by their present owners in, as I recall, the 18th century. Slightly before the USA was created.
Of course, all nations have come together by a process of accretion. Thus, in the 8th century what is now England was just Wessex. France became a nation with approximately its present borders in the 15th century, ironically as a result of the huge effort required to push out the English invaders. Spain came together at the end of the 15th century, similarly as a result of uniting to expel the Islamic Moors. Italy and Germany did not become nations in their present form (roughly) until late in the 19th century.
As I may have said before, Ukraine and Kiev are to Russia somewhat as Wessex and Winchester are to England. The first Russian state, Kievan Rus, flourished about the same time that King Alfred was ruling Wessex – about 1,000 years before the USA existed.
” Is Taiwan as Chinese as Crimea is Russian?”
The people of Crimea voted to rejoin Russia. I strongly doubt the Taiwanese people would vote to rejoin China. For all the talk about Democracy why isnt this fact applied to the Taiwanese situation by people here ?
Ever thought about why Taiwan is not holding a referendum for independence?
Because they will lose. There is only a small number of the previous warmongers now in control that uses the west to keep being in control. The majority of Taiwanese are content to be a Chinese province.
People need to understand that the recalcitrant province consider themselves the leaders of China – it is a hangover from the war.
” Ever thought about why Taiwan is not holding a referendum for independence? ”
This is a faulty argument. There are many places around the world that have reasons to hold referendums on independence but they dont, because such referendums are almost always forced on the local government by the people. If this hasn’t happened in Taiwan is because the people arent really that interested in rejoining with China.
Second, as you can see below Taiwan has always had its own indigenous , non-Chinese, population. The Chinese started moving into Taiwan at a later time. They arent the original inhabitants.
Third besides the indigenous Taiwanese, and the Chines component, Taiwan’s demographics also consist of many other groups such as Indonesians, Vietnamese, Philippino, and Indians. Its a pretty good bet that those, and other folks, dont want to live under Chinese rule.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_Taiwan#Ethnicity
” The original population of the island of Taiwan and its associated islands, i.e. not including Kinmen and the Matsu Islands, consists of a variety of Taiwanese indigenous peoples, who speak several Formosan languages. They share languages with the Austronesian family and mitochondrial DNA contribution with many of the peoples of Southeast Asia and the Pacific Islands. Taiwan is also the linguistic homeland of the Austronesian peoples.[2]
Immigration of Han Chinese to the Penghu islands started as early as the 13th century, while settlement of the main island occurred from the 16th century during the Ming–Qing transition. “
I happen to have worked in and with Taiwan for 10 years off an on and talked …
several people when asked said there are many people in Taiwan who do not want independence from China… …. but of course western media does not publish that…
” several people when asked said there are many people in Taiwan who do not want independence from China ”
Not very scientific conclusion. A large percentage of Taiwan’s population is not ethnic Chinese. I’m sure most of them want nothing to do with China. Does their opinion not count ?
@Deplorable Commissar
Politics doesn’t depend entirely on ethnicity. No matter what argument you present, it’s undeniable that Taiwan’s economy is entirely dependent on China. Now that the US aims to move the semiconductor industry into their country and to Europe, Taiwan would be in a much difficult position because they’re going to lose their leverage.
Simple. For the time being the small island of Taiwan may have the luxury of wanting to display West-style democratic choice and individualistic independence…only because she is being reassured by Washington that she will receive energy needs and trades from the current dollar-based western channels. But, once she’s confronted with the reality that her best choice for getting oil/gas and global trades would be through the new global energy system led by China-Iran and Russia — without even thinking twice –Taiwan will quickly join where it belongs i.e. the mainland China.
Taiwan is getting that sinking feeling. The map shows it very close to Japan and to China. USer militants have been causing trouble for decades. Most Taiwanese people would like to rejoin Asia.
Quote: China now has the resources, close ties/alliances and power (military and economic) to claim its place in the World and this moment should have been its (more forceful) coming out party.”
See. That’s why this document and the alignment (more than alliance) between Russia and China is beyond western understanding.
The U$A has ?800? military and assorted bases like cancer cells embedded across the planet.
We (earthlings) don’t need ChinaRussia to go build 800 or 1000 of theirs in a dick swinging exercise.
Instead of bases they want to build railways, bridges, electricity, potable water, housing.
My guess is the people of Laos, who now have a modern and fast rail link through their country, prefer this to a Chinese military base to out yank the Yankees.
Who said anything about bases… and what is “beyond Western understanding” ? You misunderstood the mention of “military power” as a call for kinetic action/violence when it was in acknowledgement of the Chinese ability to now be able to back up their “economic power”, that which you very exactly identify, the BRI infrastructure. But to proceed with an important element in all that, the situation in the Middle East has to be stabilized and that means the US/NATO out. A joint show of force (no bases needed besides Tartus and no missiles need be fired) might be sufficient to force said departure. How easy this might be triggered was presaged with the recent (infamous) departure from Afghanistan, an “Empereror has no clothes”moment.
I agree how the friendship wording. I remember seeing a billboard near Kahovskaya Metro, for a Chinese cultural theatrical, exchanging national performances. I believe it was part of the Russian Chinese friendship treaty. It was very nice to see these efforts and now to see friendship, it is definitely meaningful. The benefits of having a trusting relationship with a neighbor that solidifies social, economic and security along an entire region is a huge deal.
It will be attacked, mocked, but in the end it will definitely be an alternative. I think the small nations always wait to see if it is truly a safe bet before changing the orientation one’s country.
The irony of this, the model Russia and China propose, I believe this was the old American world view and dream. That was to see all world cultures together in peace. At least the idealistic imagery from the past before internet. Times have changed.
I definitely agree that no one should have right to dictate what form of ‘democracy’ another country has. It should be by/for their own people and culture. So seeing the different cultures coming together is a good thing.
The children will continue to play games like accidentally, on purpose releasing pre written news of war. Dirty games and bad behavior will not reap long term benefits. You reap what you sow. And crops don’t grow over night.
Russia/China have thrown down the gauntlet.
The document is not aimed at the ordinary reader. It is aimed at those who take an interest in such matters and those who need to read it. Be sure that it will be read and scrutinised in detail by every foreign ministry, senior military officials, thinktankers, senior business people, academics, and readers of the Saker blog.
It is the manifesto of the New World Order as envisioned by Russia/China.
This manifesto will be the basis for interstate relations between Russia/China and the myriad countries. Not quite, If you are not with us you are against us, but more like this is what we have to offer, the choice is yours. As mentioned by The Saker, it will be an attractive alternative to most African and South American countries. Expect to see lots of persuasion attempts by both sides on this. Zone A will have its hands full in all areas- political, military, diplomatic, economic and financial and technological. The challenge is full spectrum and global.
Not mentioned was Iran but also Korea, Japan, Germany etc. which are occupied territories by the Empire, either post WW2 settlement countries or more recent occupations. They are conspicuous by their absense.
Keep an eye out for large countries which have not yet chosen sides or could veer either way- India, Brazil, Indonesia, others?? India is the big prize and will be fought over intensely.
In addition to laying out a broad vision it also lays out specific areas where Zone A will be directly challenged- NATO, biological weapons, Taiwan, Ukraine. Not mentioned are Syria, Venezuela, Iran, Iraq, Yemen, Mali and other contested areas. Wonder why.,
Is the SCO being built up as an alternative to the UN? CSTO as alternative to NATO?
Ned Price “We have an array of tools that we can deploy if we see foreign companies, including those in China, doing their best to backfill U.S. export control actions, to evade them, to get around them,” Price told a regular news briefing.” (04.02.2022)
I think the side sentence of this: “Friendship between the two States has no limits, there are no ”forbidden“ areas of cooperation” might be an answer for his threat.
From the article:
“The Russian side reaffirms its support for the One-China principle, confirms that Taiwan is an inalienable part of China, and opposes any forms of independence of Taiwan.”
So Russia declares that if the Taiwanese hold a national referendum vote that is internationally observed to decide the question, “Stay with China or secede,” such an act would be rejected by Russia even if the majority of the people overwhelmingly chose secession.
I ask this question, “How is that any different than what the Crimean people did when they voted to depart from Ukraine and then asked the Russian government to accept them as a new federal district?”
The Crimean people voted to leave Ukraine primarily due to the rejection of the Nazi’s in control of Kiev. The Crimean government could have chose to petition any other nation to join to it or declare themselves a fully autonomous country with no ties to any other nation. But obviously the secondary reason to join with Russia was the historical and cultural tie with it.
The topic of “democracy” is mentioned four times in the article but it appears that Taiwanese people are going to be denied that opportunity to decide for themselves how they shall be governed due foreign entanglements.
I guess Mexico should declare the State of Texas be returned to it since it was originally part of Mexico too.
Yes, that is correct.
When the US breaks up into its constituent pieces Texas and other states will return to Mexico.
You apply western logic to non-western thinking. Yes Russia considers Taiwan as part of China. BUT Russia also allows each nation to decide of its future by itself and under international law. Which means that Taiwan is a Chinese problem, not a Russian one. Now how the Chinese PEOPLE (mainland and Taiwan) go about solving that problem is their business.
From the Russian point of view, this is an internal Chinese issue.
Notice that China has NOT recognized Crimea as part of Russia simply because the argument can be made that the future of Crimea should have been decided by ALL the Ukrainian people, in Crimea and the rest of the Ukraine. Of course, the Russian reply would be that 1) the Ukrainian Constitutional order was fundamentally broken by a coup 2) that the Ukronazis were trying to extended their dominion over the Ukraine by violence 3) that Crimea illegally transferred to the Ukrainian SSR. But the point is that arguments, good or bad, can be made from both sides.
From the Chinese point of view, neither Russia nor Banderastan can claim a clear and unequivocal principle which would trump all others, so while they de jure have not declared that Crimea is part of Russia or what the future of the LDNR should be, they keep a nice “flou artistique” on the topic and just wait for Banderastan to implode.
The ugly way the Ukies screwed the Chinese over with their bid to purchase Motor Sich, however, will greatly motivate our Chinese friends to make the right choices at the right time :-)
Also,
Contrary to popular belief, there is no mechanism out there to recognize or not recognize a country, a border or a regime. Each country on the planet decides for itself. The UN can only accept members and decide which delegation to accredit under what exact heading (member, observer or other).
China has a veto power over the only legal body which matters: the UNSC.
Which means that no matter what, Taiwan will never become an independent nation legally speaking, or at least as long and until the PRC agrees to it.
Crimea and the LDNR (along with South Ossetia, Abkhazia and the Pridnestrovian Republic) are in a situation not unlike the one of Northern Cyprus, Kosovo, the Republika Srpska and even both Palestine and Israel: recognized by some (few or many makes zero difference) and stuck in a grey zone between de facto and de jure.
So the truth about “recognition” is this: the ones with firepower get to decide who is recognized or not. That’s the bad news. The good news is that the people of non-recognized nations can chose to ignore those with firepower if somebody else with enough firepower protects them.
For Taiwan it is either China or the USA
For Crimea, Ossetia, Abkhazia, and the Transnistria, Donetsk and Luganks Republics, it is either Russia or the USA.
How this will resolve is, a believe, beyond any reasonable doubt quite self evident.
Whether referendums will be involved or not (probably yes, by the way) is secondary.
Cheers
“For Taiwan it is either China or the USA”
Not quite.
The acceptance by the US of the One China principle means that the US recognises that China/Taiwan are one country. There is an ambiguity in this that the US plays on- that is, does Taiwan belong to China or China to Taiwan.
The US will never allow Taiwan independence since then it will have lost its card. The value of Taiwan to the US lies in the fact that it can use the Taiwan independance card to get at China. It can also sell it weapons at inflated prices.
As with Ukraine the US will not go to war for Taiwan.
I think that the US will lose Taiwan in 3 years or less.
By referendum, no less.
And under the protection of the Chinese navy, army and air force.
And
I also believe that there is not a thing the Anglos can do about that.
Time will tell.
The next 16th presidential election in the Republic of China is scheduled to take place in 2024.
I think that Comrade Xi cannot start the re-election process without fulfilling his promise to the Chinese people to take back Taiwan.
” The next 16th presidential election in the Republic of China is scheduled to take place in 2024.
I think that Comrade Xi cannot start the re-election process without ”
What election ? I guess you forgot about this news.
” China has approved the removal of the two-term limit on the presidency, effectively allowing Xi Jinping to remain in power for life.
The constitutional changes were passed by the annual sitting of parliament, the National People’s Congress.
The vote was widely regarded as a rubber-stamping exercise. Two delegates voted against the change and three abstained, out of 2,964 votes.
China had imposed a two-term limit on its president since the 1990s. “
@Deplorable Commissar
It is possible that both Xi AND Putin could step down in 2024. In China in particular, there is a very promising politician named Chen Min’er who was governor of the Guizhou province and Xi is very impressed with him, and would have no problems whatsoever handing the reigns over to him if he decided to call it quits. So yeah, assuming these two leaders will “rule for life” is quite the normie Western opinion.
If I remember correctly, Crimea held referenda in the 90’s on this same issue: Reunification with Russia. They voted overwhelmingly to secede from Ukraine and petition Russia for readmission, which Russia politely, politically, and tactfully ignored because it was not necessary at the time and would probably cause more trouble than triumph during the 90’s and 00’s political landscape, things being what they were. Things were OK the way they were, so let sleeping bears lie, etc. It was only when things changed drastically and Ukraine went over to the dark side that they used the ‘Crimea wants to be with us’ card. One wonders what would have happened if Crimea had been lukewarm about rejoining Russia?
Russia already affirmed that Taiwan is an inalienable part of China back in 2001 in the Sino-Russian Treaty of Friendship, so this is nothing new, merely a reaffirmation. Just a reminder to those who are meddling in the South China Sea where they should not be.
@ Saker
Thanks!!!
Grateful to you for deconstructing this historical manifesto into a level where the true meaning and the nuances can be understood.
Several years ago, 2014/15, when I saw Russia surging from the neo-liberal destruction created after the fall of the Soviet Union, I remember myself praying, “Oh Allah, just give Russia five more years, just five more years.” How far has Russia walked on the path of recovery, from the drunken days of clown Yeltsin to a well-respected nation-state occupying its rightful place in the concert of nations.
Or as the Joint Statement reads loud and clear, for everyone to hear, “…The sides note that Russia and China as world powers…” Yes, World Powers, which I would like to write in Capital Letters, at the risk of pissing off the Mod., or the Saker. :-)
“…The Chinese year of the Black Water Tiger started with a big bang…,” says Pepe, in fact it started with the Bear growling and the Tiger roaring their calls for a new international system based on leveled ground. SCO and other institutions have the potential to grow and become alternatives to the US-dominated UN, as the Non-Aligned Movement was during the anti-colonial struggle for liberation.
A masterstroke of your write-up was the inclusion of Iran which, by the presence of its absence, was the white elephant in the room. Iran is now where Russia was a few decades ago but making giant leaps to occupy its rightful place in the new paradigm. A triangulation of that caliber, Russia, China, Iran, is what the decaying Great Western Wall will be facing in the decades ahead.
We can now see the light at the end of the tunnel of ignorance, depravity, corruption and annihilation of the soul the West has brought upon humanity, with their sickness of greed and possessiveness.
Now we need some fireworks to celebrate the new path open to humanity.
May Allah bless Mother Russia, China, and Iran.
Lone Wolf
Will Russia and China vis-à-vis the US make the same mistake that Germany – Bismarck did vs. France, Carthage vs. Rome, Japan vs. the US? This is ultimately a war for existence and not some 18th century war fought on a battlefield with professional soldiers. It is only a matter of time before the US recovers and is able to destroy the Russia and China and it will. Unless Russia and China are prepared to destroy the US the way the enemies of the Assyrian Empire destroyed that empire and its capital, Nineveh, so that a hundred years later people had forgotten that Nineveh had even existed and no longer remembered the Assyrian Empire – the first totalitarian empire in history!
The US will recover, but not in its current form.
Yes it will recover only as Constitutional Republic (pre-1871) and not as current Corporation belong to -District of Crime/City of London/Vatican……
I also see that as the way forward.
The need to destroy the USA Empire completely overrides everything. It overrides any criticisms one may have of China or Russia.
And the Americans have it well in hand.
We don’t live in ancient times. In the modern era, power seems to shift in century increments. Portuguese ruled the 17th Century, Spanish ruled the 18th century, British ruled the 19th century, Americans ruled the 20th century and each made breakways on the international stage and innovated new norms and customs. It’s looking like China will take center stage in century 21 with Russian assistance and establish new international norms and customs. The biggest obstacle here is racist Americans and Europeans jumping in bed with neo-fascists.
The US is a front – a façade of a nation-state, representing the interests of international ‘Das Kapital.’ (I’m sure VVP has referred to this in his speeches.) Once defeated, it will not re-emerge in the same form. But Das Kapital will look for the next host. (This is, by the way, at the heart of an effort to obliterate the principle of a nation state and what that represents.)
The message couldn’t have been more clear, Russia and China are united against a common enemy, Chinese/Russian alliance is the result of Uncle Shmuel provocations against China,the imbeciles republicans and democrats now are reaping the fruits of what they sowed,now let’s sit back and wait to see how the USA and his minions are going to deal with this,I hope WW3 won’t broke out.
I share the exact same feelings.
The defense and anchoring of the concept of the historically evolved nation-state in its universal competence is, in my view, the most important component.
This is a clear rejection of certain ideas of the “liberals”, the liberal West, from the “rule-based” so-called “global governance”.
Cue endless kvetching in the western Lugenpresse about the dangers of the Russian/ Chinese alliance – there was some of it today.
The leopard cannot change its spots and we have to expect an escalation of the multi layered campaigns of vilification and demonisation of both countries, targeting their leaders, political establishments, business, trade, sport, media, and individual private citizens.
We also have to expect a series of further false flags, provocations and hoaxes of the Skripal, MH17, White Helmet Cas Attack, “10 million Uighurs being turned into soap and lampshades in concentration camps” variety. This is all old hat and very tired now but has to be factored in.
Consider the potential of what has occurred. China, over 4 million square miles, 1.4 million people, rapidly expanding with what is probably already the world’s greatest and most dynamic manufacturing and trading nation. Russia, 6.5 million square miles, the world’s largest country, advanced technology, a treasure trove of energy, minerals and food supplying all the needs of the Chinese market, immune from US naval blockades. A natural energy partner for Russia, instead of the totally unreliable and treacherous EU, which can be left to its own devices to freeze to death. Both unconquerable nuclear powers. A huge self sufficient bloc with its own financial system, from which the rapidly declining west mired in debt has totally excluded itself.
Add to this Iran and Venezuela, both large and important countries and amongst the greatest energy producers on the planet. Both the targets of unremitting murderous western hostility for decades, which has caused their people tremendous suffering. They are natural partners of this bloc, which can offer them immunity from US economic terrorism. Other obvious members are Bolivia, a treasure trove of lithium and other materials. Smaller countries like Cuba, Nicaragua, Ecuador, Syria, Libya, Iraq, DPRK, Myanmar, not major economies or powers in themselves, but very significant in aggregate. Altogether a huge bloc from which western predatory finance capitalism has excluded itself.
The west can be left to stew in its own juice, to collapse through its own arrogance and ignorance. All the aggressions of the past 30 years have ended in utter failure. Cuba has survived 60 years of US terror, Iran 40. The endless invasions, regime changes, colour revolutions, US economic terror, has failed to achieve any of its objectives and imposed colossal costs on the aggressor states – trillions of dollars, blowback terrorism, destabilising mass refugee flows.
Official US national debt has just passed 30 trillion, 30 million million. It is hovering on the verge of economic, racial, social and spiritual collapse and civil war. It can be left to its own devices to self destruct at leisure.
The new bloc should gradually withdraw for any interaction with malignant western countries to insulate itself from contagion.
Western countries, which have rampaged across the planet like Nazi Germany on steroids for the past 7 decades, butchering, slaughtering, starving and immiserating hundreds of millions in the process, has no future. They are at a dead end. If they choose to mend their ways, show suitable contrition, get down on their knees and beg forgiveness for their endless crimes and atrocities, may be offered a place in the new world system. Maybe. But they shouldn’t take it for granted.
Muito bom. Texto claro e conciso. Em poucas o quadro completo. Não pare de escrever e postar.
Very good. Clear and concise text. In a nutshell the complete picture. Don’t stop writing and posting.
I agree totally with Andrei’s statement that this is an historical document – one thought as I finished reading the document was to compare it with Lincoln’s Gettysburg Address. Not to compare it in terms of content or purpose but rather in terms of how it came to be viewed by people at the time and in later times for its significance. The Russia-China joint statement of February 2022 will stand out in importance for future generations on the level of the address of Pericles or Lincoln. For those interested in the history of Russia, there is also the address of Lenin at the Finland Station – it marked a turning point in Russian history. This joint address of Russia and China marks another turning point.
I think that the statement is fundamentally a guiding moral document just like Lincoln’s address. But in terms of an American analog I would compare it to Martin Luther King’s “I had a dream” speech. It was a declaration of common humanity among all peoples. The model of behavior is not IMF which demands human suffering for the masses but Chinese programs of building infrastructure and maybe most importantly, its program to eliminate extreme poverty as a national priority. It is Russia donating free vaccines and openly sharing its vaccine technology in India and Argentina so companies there can make their own.
I found it revealing, and somebody may have mentioned this, but it seems the initial knee jerk response of the US was to threaten Chinese companies if they disobeyed sanctions on Russia.
It’s great to see they’re turning the ‘all inclusive’ language around on the USA. Brilliant!
Attn Andrei Martyanov and everyone, I don’t do disqus and wanted to get this msg to you all re’ videos in Russian – the English captions can be activated by doing the following:
If enabled click the CC button, then click the settings button
Click Subtitles/CC
Click Auto-Translate
Scroll down and select your language of choice
All the best
Andrei,
This is a very credible interpretation of the joint statement. It’s unfortunate that the symbolism and emotional context of word choice has been driven out of the western school system. It’s also unfortunate that cultural social studies and history have been so badly diminished in same schools.
Thank you for your analysis.
Cheers!
@ PokeTheTruth on February 05, 2022 · at 2:06 pm EST/EDT
“…I guess Mexico should declare the State of Texas be returned to it since it was originally part of Mexico too.”
Remember “The Alamo”?
That was just a bunch of whites whose “resistence” to the Mexican army has been lionized and turned into another Hollywood myth. But that is what moves the racists, white supremacists, and the KKK in TX. As of now, Texas has the dubious honor of hosting a white supremacist group, the “Patriot Front,” responsible for 80% of white supremacist propaganda nationwide. The KKK is alive and “kikicking,” and the anti-immigrant militias run the border.
And you want Mexico to claim back TX?
What kind of bloodbath for anyone of a dark color are you proposing?
Lone Wolf
There is no better proof that ‘history is written by victors’ than the myth of Alamo.
Mr. Wolf, your comment is disappointing as it is void of historical and contemporary facts regarding the (1) Battle of the Alamo (2) Patriot Front.
1. Battle of the Alamo
Just as Mexico won its independence from Spain in 1821, the Republic of Texas declared its independence from Mexico in 1835 due to changes made to the Mexican federal constitution. The following year, a group of about 200 Texans comprised of American colonists who settled in Texas and local Mexican nationals (Tejanos) who served in the Alamo garrison, fought against the army of Mexican President Santa Anna. It was a siege battle that lasted 13 days with the complete defeat of the colonists and the local Mexicans who were summarily executed by order of Santa Anna.
See: https://www.thealamo.org/remember/battle-and-revolution .
Despite your false claim the defenders of the Alamo were “a bunch of whites”, eleven of those brave men were of Mexican descent and two were African Americans.
See fact 06: https://www.thoughtco.com/facts-about-the-battle-of-the-alamo-2136256
2. Patriot Front
Patriot Front is a small fringe group (about 300 members) of Americans who see the country descending into a state of progressive liberalism that is destroying traditional family values and sense of national identity. They hold rallies and marches and to date, have never been convicted of a felony. They are relatively harmless to anyone except the ADL Zionist filth and any of the democratic propaganda outlets like SPLC that challenge American paleoconservative ideology.
Here are a couple of “news” articles that over sensationalize the group’s activities:
See: https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2020/8/4/1966538/-Founder-of-fascist-Patriot-Front-group-arrested-in-Texas-for-plastering-stickers-at-courthouse .
See: https://chicago.suntimes.com/2022/1/9/22875148/white-supremacist-group-patriot-front-crashes-anti-abortion-rally-in-the-loop .
If you mouse over the hyperlinks in the articles, they refer to the ADL or SPLC websites that libel the group as a, “fascist, white supremacist hate-group.”
Lastly, take a look at this short video about these guys doing “paramilitary drills.”
See: https://www.tallahassee.com/story/news/local/2022/02/03/leaked-videos-show-white-supremacists-paramilitary-drills-tallahassee-florida-patriot-front/9315855002/ .
They look pathetic don’t they, like a bunch of explorer scouts trying to earn their merit badges.
Something on the sidelines did happen. In the Serbian media there was an article (removed and errased) that said the Chineasse president demanded Serbia sign the free trade agreement immediately. The article later was rephrased into brotherly relationships and similar,but the tone was one of imperative. But the mere fact that the Serbian president did not use this oportunity to show himself as a world leader(he enojys the spotlight and attention), but instead his presence in China is shrouded in a veil of mystery with random generic statements might indicate a change…Is China going to play ball with Russia and use its economic muscle where logic and common sence do not apply?
I thought that Iran became an official member of the SCO a few months back. They changed from being an observer to a member. Is their status different than being a “full” member. Please clarify. Also I found the part about Bioweapons very interesting. Does this have anything to do with the start of something huge happening in a large central city in China in late 2019?
To my knowledge, Iran’s bid to become a full member of the Shanghai Cooperation Organisation was approved but in needs to be formalized, I may be mistaken here.
Can somebody in the know please correct me?
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2021/9/19/iran-shanghai-cooperation-organisation
What Iran’s membership of Shanghai Cooperation Organisation means
Iran’s membership in the organisation is a success, but its extent will likely be limited in the short term.
Tehran, Iran – “Iran’s bid to become a full member of the Shanghai Cooperation Organisation (SCO) was approved after almost 15 years by the bloc’s seven permanent members on Friday.
After the technical and legal process concludes – which could take up to two years – Iran will formally join a group that accounts for about one-third of the world’s land and exports trillions of dollars annually – as it counts China, Russia and India, in addition to several Central Asian states, among its members…”
Lone Wolf
Thank you Lone Wolf!
Cheers
https://en.irna.ir/news/84473948/SCO-officially-accepts-Iran-permanent-membership
There must be a waiting period because they are a full member as of Sept. 2021, but not on the website nor elsewhere as a ninth member.
Here’s an article that explains the delay.
“According to the published news, 8 permanent member countries are expected to comment on Iran’s full membership and start the process of Iran’s membership if all permanent members agree on it. The process may take some years. The process of accepting India and Pakistan started in 2014 and it took about three years for the two countries to become permanent members.”
“Therefore, it should be noted that the admission process in this organization is not a one-step process and a special procedure has been foreseen in the SCO documents in this regard. In fact, a yes vote by all members means the beginning of the negotiation process for an agreement on the documents according to which Iran will join the legal and contractual framework of the organization.”
https://www.tehrantimes.com/news/465116/Win-win-cooperation-between-Iran-SCO-and-obstacles-ahead
Thank you Larchmonter445!!!
That clarifies it.
Hugs
Quote:” Also I found the part about Bioweapons very interesting. Does this have anything to do with the start of something huge happening in a large central city in China in late 2019?”
Yes and….
The US has sekret bioweapon labs dotted around Russia and China in Central Asia and Balkans. The very large and very secret one in Kazakhstan was under scrutiny during the recent thwarted color revolution.
A plane was detected by those who monitor publicly available flight radars departing from this location. Question was who and what was repatriated.
China and Russia want the labs gone.
And, of course, MI6 were responsible for the Skripal pantomime, an exercise using Christopher Steele (MI6) to destabilize Trump.
The core of the Deep State is the British Foreign Office
Now, as for accountability, let’s not forget that in the H1N1 virus – it was not too long ago. This started from the United States and infected millions and billions of all patients worldwide. Now, no one was holding the United States accountable and also a comparable kind of thing that started at one country and affected the rest of the world was the global financial crisis that started in the United States and that affecting a lot of countries worldwide, including Russia, and then no one was holding the US accountable either. So I think that this kind of initiatives is all kind of tying it to China scares kind of tactics. Now, I don’t think that it would have any traction internationally.
Where are scripals?
Porta down is where corona virus was created after modification by germ warfare lab of english pirates in porta down near Salisbury.
Then it was passed on to the Americans who took it to Wuhan in military parade in September 2019.
Uk and usa must be sanctioned for germ warfare.
It has been proceeding step by step for decades. It was only spelled out in crayon yesterday.
Here are some thoughts on this article:
The American-led bloc is very much an empire. It considers itself qualified to speak for the whole world (as shown in the OP’s maps) and has no qualms about using whatever means are at hand to compel compliance with its values (some examples: the US occupations of Afghanistan and Iraq, the sanctions on Cuba and Iran, the coups in Venezuela, Bolivia,and Ukraine, the attempts by the people in Brussels to bully Poland and Hungary into towing the neoliberal line on immigration, LGBT, etc.)
So the Saker’s assessment of the western empire is basically correct. Now for the other side of the question: is the western empire the only game in town?
Well, Russia and China talk a long talk about how all countries should respect one another’s sovereignty, avoid interfering in their neighbors’ internal affairs, etc. And yet, it’s easy to see where those countries have imperialistic designs, because they will talk long and loud about how such-and-such a country, due to its history, political situation, etc., is not a real country, and not worthy of the same respect which they demand for themselves.
That is basically what Russia and China have been doing with Ukraine and Taiwan, respectively. (See, for instance, Vladimir Putin’s long essay last summer about the historical unity of Russia and Ukraine, or China’s 72 years of bullying the rest of the “international community” into turning Taiwan into a pariah state on the lines of Apartheid South Africa).
But guess what: once you’ve granted yourself the power to decide that certain other countries aren’t really sovereign, then your loud yelps in favor of the equality and autonomy of all sovereign countries don’t really mean that much, do they?
Yes, Russia/China’s mode of operation is different from America/Israel’s, but imperialism is still imperialism. And it’s especially rich to hear Russian nationalists talking about how everyone should respect the authority of the United Nations, even as the UN considers Russia’s occupation of the Crimea to be illegal.
So to sum things up: there is room for more than one empire in the world. And no, I am not defending the actions of the US and its toadies (who, one must remember, frequently act with UN support, because appeasement of empires – both Western and Eastern – seems to be a UN value). But Russia and China aren’t as different from the US as some people here like to think.
Now, as for this Russia/China friendship – I think it will last as long as the American empire is strong enough that Russia and China fear it more than they fear each other. Once it falls, then Russia and China will go back to being enemies. (This is how alliances of convenience – er, alliances of “true diversity” – always end. Nobody who’s read Thucydides and Xenophon can miss the pattern).
Once the common threat of the US no longer keeps Russia and China on the same side, China will start thinking about finally ending the Century of Humiliations once and for all. And no, I am not talking about Taiwan, I am talking about the territory that China ceded to Russia in 1860, including the future site of Vladivostok. Historically, that land has been a part of China for much longer than Taiwan has, and if the Chinese decide they want it back, then Russia (having supported Chinese irredentism in the case of Taiwan) will have no moral grounds on which to complain if China invades.
Twilight Patriot, you a definitely a patriot of the twilight of the USA. There is no logical reason for China to try and reclaim Vladivostok and risking war with Russia, and ending simple, easy commercial access to Russian resources. The Chinese provinces on Russia’s south-eastern border are depopulating. They aren’t the nicest places to live. Chinese companies are permitted to employ Chinese workers in the Russian Far East, few last more than the first winter.
Hi Twilight Patriot,
Could you confirm maybe with some links at least … your statement “they will talk long and loud about how such-and-such a country, due to its history, political situation, etc., is not a real country, and not worthy of the same respect which they demand for themselves”?
Any direct quote of Putin maybe?
If you mean this long historical esse by Putin on kremlin.ru http://www.kremlin.ru/events/president/news/66181 then nothing there can help you with your arguments. Putin even ends his esse with “Россия никогда не была и не будет «анти-Украиной». А какой быть Украине – решать её гражданам.” – “Russia has never been and never will be “anti-Ukraine”. And what Ukraine to be like is up to its citizens.”
Hi Twilight Patriot,
Could you enforce with some links at least your statement “they will talk long and loud about how such-and-such a country, due to its history, political situation, etc., is not a real country, and not worthy of the same respect which they demand for themselves”?
Any direct quote of Putin maybe?
If you mean this long historical esse by Putin on kremlin.ru http://www.kremlin.ru/events/president/news/66181 then nothing there can help you with your arguments. Putin even ends his esse with “Россия никогда не была и не будет «анти-Украиной». А какой быть Украине – решать её гражданам.” – “Russia has never been and never will be “anti-Ukraine”. And what Ukraine to be like is up to its citizens.”
I am not here to talk for/about Chine but for Russia it might work.
And do not to stand up twice … as you call Russia as empire then to be clear … Russia is not the same Empire as classical empires British, American etc. It is empire without colonies, the empire with human face kind of.
“A common vision of the future shared between Russia and China.” Please define that common vision.
China and Russia have shared interests, when it comes to the multipolar order. Those shared interests are multilateralism, multiple governance structures, partnership oriented development, security for all, respect for sovereignty and territorial integrity, prevent Empire’s aggressions,… It is great that they’re united to address the Financial Empire.
Russia is promoting Euros, an Empire’s Private Currency. Why? Who controls Euros? The same banking families that control the US$? Which factions of the Financial Empire is Russia working with? Is it trying to divide Europe from the Anglo-American world? This brings into question Russia’s goals. It isn’t for complete sovereignty and missing the monetary sovereignty element completely. This is disappointing and creates an impression that Russia wants to develop another Animal Farm or an Empire. Russia needs to be pushing for payment in rubles for its resources and over its payment networks. What happens when the EU puts sanctions on Russia? Russia needs to promote national currencies usage. One gets an impression that Russia is okay with an oligarchic system.
Please review the China-Iran deal for $400 Billion and compare it to $117.5 bln deal between China-Russia. China’s goals are improving its gdp per capita to that of the U$A and thereby becoming the largest economy in the world. What are Russia’s values, goals and key development themes?
These articles provide better insights into Russia’s intent. Please share that intent.
“Russia has the world’s 4th largest foreign currency reserves; China is 1st and United States 21st.”
https://www.reuters.com/world/putin-tells-xi-new-deal-that-could-sell-more-russian-gas-china-2022-02-04/
https://www.russia-briefing.com/news/russian-settles-majority-of-trade-debt-with-china-in-euros-for-first-time.html/
https://tass.com/economy/1393859
Checkout the trajectory of the dollar, euro and ruble usage…
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-04-26/russia-ditches-the-dollar-in-more-than-half-of-its-exports
@ Max I completely agree with you ,The euro is dead ,Sept 2019 over night loan melt down was partly because of the Euro , the bank’s will not lend them any money the euro is trapped zero and negative interested have destroyed
the euro and europe with covi and green econ. that is being push there, it will be the first major currency to go
down why would any one hold them,You wounder what Putin is thinking ? The banking system in Russia needs
an overhaul and change of personel and start working for the Russia people instead of the over three thousand
billionnairs that ripe off the Russian people during the (tradner) Yeilisen years and the beginning of Putin years.
Thank you
Tom 123
@Max
Maybe you should read note about Russia’s development Initiatives in the eastern part of the country. As some other commentators have also pointed out here, Russia’s plan is to become a fully Eurasian country with a capital in Siberia. It would significantly reduce the Europe’s cultural bonds with Russia.
You don’t make too many enemies at once. Russia’s current goal is to end the USD hegemony, which is the backbone of the Empire. Once it’s dismantled a major threat to the sovereign countries would be over. The Euro hasn’t been and will never be another USD. It’s not in a position to be used as a reserve currency.
Thank you for the study notes Andrei – for those of us with truncated attention spans. They are immensely helpful. I read the entire English translation and think I got the gist of it. I would be tempted to send a link to the Department of Foreign Affairs in Canberra, except I suspect that anyone in that department caught reading it would immediately be fired (if not worse) for being a Chussian agent.
Truly, there are none so blind as will not see.
Dear Andrei, another excellent analysis from you. At one point you describe Russia as a democratic and social state, with a strange and shifting mix of capitalism and traditional Russian collectivism.
China as a unique blend of capitalism and communist state control.
Iran as an Islamic Republic. I, however, understand that the three countries have much more in common, such as: 1-anti-imperialism and 2-monopolies, mainly banks – finance capital, owned by the state, as well as competitive sectors – small industry, agriculture, commerce, etc., with the private initiative. Therefore, although not overtly, Russia and Iran are also market socialist countries in the modern sense of the term, just like China and the NEP of Lenin and Bukharin. This is their common denominator and main cause of Western imperialism’s hatred of these three countries. A point of view to be considered. Kind regards.
Hi Victor Giglio Ferreira,
Please describe how the Russian Central Bank and its monetary system are different from that of China and Iran.
Why do Russia (8.5%) and Iran (15%) practice usury? Who does the usury benefits? What happens to the nations that practice usury?
The Financial Empire doesn’t like China because it got its act together and is growing phenomenally and will become the largest economy. The same Empire craves for Russia’s resources so it can control them, price in its currency and dominate nations’ energy supplies. To build its Middle East Union and control the region’s resources it wants to capture Iran, like it captured Texas.
Dear Max, China has more than 90% of bank deposits in state banks, Russia has almost 80% and Iran almost all. Therefore, socialist financial sector. Putin’s Russia has returned to socialism, it just hasn’t announced it. All these resources held by the state have been used to finance development, including the private sector of the economy. This is the Market Socialism of today’s China, Russia, Iran, Vietnam and even India today. Unlike the capitalist countries of the West.
Victor, thanks for your response.
In China, the central bank chairperson reports to the president and the interest rate is 3.85%. Many funds are invested in companies at zero interest rate as investments. Does the central bank chairperson reports to the president in Russia? Isn’t the Russian central bank autonomous? China has a mixed economy more along the German model. Russia seems to be creating monopolies whereas China is dismantling monopolies.
Why do Russian and Iranian state banks charge such high interest rate? They want to generate more profits than the private banks on loans? Who pays for those high interest rates? Citizens? So they want to loot their populace? Is that socialism? They’re creating public debt for generating profits?
Why do Russian state banks list on the London and Wall Street markets? Aren’t they then private banks? So they want funds from “the capitalist countries of the West”? Why does Russia want to be paid in euros? They don’t trust their rubles.
Dear Max, I also do not agree with the high interest monetary policy practiced by some central banks, including the Russian one, which causes a reduction in private investment and, therefore, in the pace of economic growth. However, as in Russia they are state-owned banks, it is, in practice, a transfer of income from the private to the state sector, which the state has been using in its own investments. In practice, without declaring it, Putin applied a clearly left-wing policy, returning Russia to market socialism, as applied by Lenin and Bukharin during the NEP of the 1920s and as modern China. The western capitalist powers abhor such a Russian and Chinese regime and the western capitalist oligarchies cannot allow the example of this socialism for their own peoples. The West wants, at all costs, to destroy the example of socialism that is working in Russia and China. This current Russian and Chinese socialism is proving to work well, unlike the ultra-state socialism of the Stalinist regimes of the past, which never worked well. Stalin’s biggest mistake was closing down the NEP.
Dear Saker,
Throughout my youth, I can always remember one old saying; “East is east and west is west and never the twain shall meet’. The rest of the poem by Rudyard Kipling has been ignored. That is the manner in which a land that is to be raped and pillaged is portrayed. Except that Kipling’s poem was not about China, but rather Afghanistan, and the fourth line is never mentioned; “When two strong men stand face to face, though they come from the ends of the earth!”
Guess what! Two strong men, Putin and Xi. Kipling’s words may be prophetic.
But to me, this statement has a contradiction within it and that contradiction is Taiwan. China stands unrelenting is regard to Taiwan, and its brief 70 year history, but when I consider that history and the similar history of those two Ukrainian breakaway soon to be republics, I would hope that China could consider Taiwan in a similar mode, more of a prodigal son than an outpost of American arrogance. In other words, leave them to make their own decisions in what they want, and not to impose ‘China’s will’ as what their opposition stands accused of doing to other sovereign states.
Not a chance. Not after the Hong Kong fiasco. China will tolerate no more games on its borders.
You have to understand that the so called one China principle was not invented by the prc. This is a deeply held cultural value throughout millennia. And it is one of the main criteria for legitimacy of any Chinese government. If the CPC ignore that, they will be regime changed by 1.4 billion people. The Chinese people simply do not believe in the right of secession by any individual parts of China.
I think the last map needs to be amended, the international community consists of only one country, USA
All the other countries in red are not sovereign, they are vassals.
What the Americans don’t know is that they are hosting a parasite that is evil and destructive, to themselves and the rest of the world. This parasite makes all the decisions, and all the “democracy” is just for show!
Agreed. It is obvious from those maps that Australia, where I live, rightly belongs in Zone B, with its future firmly linked to South East Asia. One Prime Minister, Paul Keating, sensed this, but for the last thirty years our vassal state has been firmly entrenched and our culture (to use the term loosely) saturated with American rubbish. At this stage there is no sign that any of our pathetic leaders are at risk of waking up to reality.
Dear Phil,
You are right. It is and always has been quite obvious. And if I remember correctly Australia back in the old days was the country that pushed the ASEAN ALLIANCE.
Advise to Macron: after this, don’t lose your time monday, go to Kiev directly…no need to come to Moscow.
“The Prime Minister and President Macron stressed that NATO must be united in the face of Russian aggression. They agreed to continue to work together to develop a package of sanctions which would come into force immediately should Russia further invade Ukraine,” the press release reads.
“The leaders discussed their work to strengthen NATO’s Eastern flank, ensuring that allies are fully defended against malicious Russian activity, wherever and however it might occur,” it added.
https://tass.com/world/1398525
Everybody knows NSA/CIA/MI6 (even dgsi) have ‘dossiers”(sex, corruption, drugs) on Manu.
He has zero power
Think of all those bought & paid for western (public) trough fed fat ass turkeys plucking & clucking their way through this Agreement, their easy corn days coming to an end. Careful though, same goes for the US MIC, salivating on one last big payday, hurrah.
I think respective countries/states, including Germany & Japan, should turn those US military bases & compounds into shrines, to remind ourselves of the genocidal appetites of the Old Empire, a lesson, a reminder.
America, 5 Eyes & Vassals will pay vast amounts of compensation to rebuild, Syria, Iraq, Libya, Afghanistan, Lebanon, Yemen, Venezuela, Iran, many Others . . . . . our Debt Slaves until 2122.
Another last thing, when the War Criminals are rounded up they should be sent to the countries of their worst crimes for trial; Hillary to Libya, Bubba Bush to Iraq, Nuland to Crimea as she might get a fair trial in Ukraine . . . . . . . some will have to be quartered and sent to several countries.
Thank you very much ! What a great article and you tell how it is
Thank you for this (lengthy) analysis,,,
Its very interesting whats happening here… and now… In view of China’s more than 5.000 years of history (that is 5000 years only on written record) the actual history goes much further back… and for what we call Russia today… its history goes much much for further back than Rurik a 1000 years ago as infact the steppes of Western Siberia are the craddle of the indo-europeans and many other people. These nomads went West, East, North and South… to use a modern terms they have the same DNA.. biologically and culturally. Most people in the ”West* and for sure the politicians have absolutely no idea… if they haven’t dug down in the history of the last 5.000 to 10.000 years … at least… … and so really do not understand the enormity of whats happening today…
“Some actors representing but the minority on the international scale continue to advocate unilateral approaches to addressing international issues and resort to force”
And what those actors plan to do, project it on others…
https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/world/russian-forces-at-70-of-level-needed-for-full-ukraine-invasion-u-s-officials/ar-AATvPjP?ocid=msedgdhp&pc=U531
Some years ago I had the honor to lecture in a Jesuit University in Mexico City called the Iberoamericana. In that ocasion I dared to say that mr. Obama was the worst catastrophe that befell the USA. That caused an uproar and was treated as an anathema. My reasoning was as follows: I ventured the idea that the downfall of the Soviet Union began with the visit Mr. Kissinger paid to chairman Mao, and became official with the meeting mr. Nixon had with the chinese leader. In fact, what mr. kissinger did was to divide China from the Soviet nation. What mr. Obama did was the exact opposite, wwith his contention of Russia and the “pivot” against China what he was actually doing was the exact opposite; he was speeding the forseeable cooperation beween those two gigantic nations. And I ventured that it could be the kickstart of the American empires downfall.
This ludus philosophicum cost me not being invited by that school to lecture again. I had committed a sacrilege to the neo-liberal “end of history”. A true thoughtcrime.
Now, so many years later, it causes me ceirtain freudenshade to read this important document. I see I was not so mistaken at the time. There are still a lot of things to come, I guess. But I wish I could see the faces of the faculty today… If they were actually able to understand the significance of the Beiging declaration.
Very warm greetings, and a heartfelt thank you to Andrei for his dedication and generosity.
“There is no one-size-fits-all template to guide countries in establishing democracy. A nation can choose such forms and methods of implementing democracy that would best suit its particular state, based on its social and political system, its historical background, traditions, and unique cultural characteristics. It is only up to the people of the country to decide whether their State is a democratic one. Translation into plain English: there is no one way to establish real people power, and outsiders are, by definition, disqualified from judging the degree of “democracy” of any nation. Each nation has the right to decide how it wants to live, how it wants to formally structure its people power and only the people of that nation can decide whether their country’s organization faithfully expresses and upholds their national values. Outsiders cannot think of themselves as “teachers of democracy”.”
—-
I do not dispute the sentiment expressed, however, it is clearly a weak and ambiguous statement. The Germans had the right to select Hitler & apparently some 20+million Russians/Soviets died. The Japanese in WW2 had the right to believe the sun rose with their sun-god emperor’s morning-glory and then millions died in Asia — including hideous medical experiments in China that only the USA’s Abu Ghraib prison (& probably Gitmo Bay and many other black-sites) compete with.
The various European colonial ‘states’ created in Africa and the ME are mostly constructed with post-colonial schismogenesis in mind. The despotic fiefdoms (oil plantations) of Arabia are hardly democratic (except perhaps among the ruling hereditary elite) but that is of zero concern to so called democracies like the USA (& petro-dollar systems) where public opinion polls and a thin “theatre of democracy” in the final analysis only influence the formal electoral college selection process etc.
On the contrary to this statement, it is entirely right and correct to judge carefully another for being a possible untrustworthy self-serving thief and tyrant — in fact it is very pragmatically prudent to do so. In the end, the absence of a common reference point, like zero in maths, simply engenders a postmodern descent into confusion and ultimately meaningless babble etc. Is this the Russian-Chinese intent? I doubt it.
The issue here is the use of the word “democracy” as if it was some sacred political symbol. It is essentially nothing more than a process of determining (and accepting) a common collective policy direction etc. However, like “science” it is being raised up and used by all as a hallowed goal when in fact it is just a methodology and process. In my view, “democracy” should not be used without a qualifier — e.g., “American democracy” or “Russian democracy” or “Chinese democracy” indeed which in the latter there is within the 80+million communist party system in sorting out policy and directions for 1.2billion people.
What is important is “good governance” and this is heavily aligned with the core cultural values and accepted traditional social systems. Seemingly, the Russians need and prosper under a Czar orientated model — at least so far. The British still need their little queens. If we judge by outcomes and process then it becomes easier to understand. Take Singapore as an example. An ex-British Chinese-run island off the tip of Malaysia. The government has never changed in the whole period since its 1950’s post-colonial (post-WW2) inception. Everything is controlled by the government — including large state-owned enterprises and communication/media systems. The opposition is regularly jailed around “election” time. And citizens and residents are encapsulated within its deadly punitive drug laws anywhere on the planet — there is no escape (except non-discovery). And yet, it is entirely accepted as a ‘democracy’ and a desirable futures model for much of South East Asia. How so?
No, it is entirely appropriate for the Russian-Chinese statement to say “f-off” with your so-called international opinion(s) and go mind your own business. I agree 100% — but it is an entirely different matter — and part of this postmodern cultural malaise — to throw around various ‘cancel-culture’ gags on the opinions of others. Let the debates rage, and the audiences find new and relevant meaning (global & local) emerging within the synthesis therein, based in part, in the observed differences between the talk and the walk.
Simplistic platitudes to naïve “democracy” in documents (which are interested to be aimed at domestic audiences) raise my suspicion levels basically. If they are promoting a form of domestic audience self-deception then they should be viewed with some sceptical sentiment.
My 2-cent’s worth.
“How so?”
About 70 years ago I saw a poster by Lee’s party in a Singapore election: an empty rice bowl. The implied promise: vote for Lee and your bowl will be full and running over.
Promise fulfilled.
“Promise fulfilled.”
And understood as a function of catalysing connotations by image – a useful tool which the opponents mistakenly conflate with the present activities/facilities/purpose of “Hollywood”, thereby consistently illustrating the opponents’ ineptitude in communication, including but not limited to shit is a hard sell.
To paraphrase Mr. Porter
How strange
the change
from
Peskov to Psaki.
Everytime we say goodbye
I die a little.
Everytime we say goodbye
I wonder why a little.
Good reading. Thanks. One thing though; the “plain English translations” contain sentences composed of more than three words. Though simplified from the original excerpts, I doubt the majority those in the U.S. will understand these translations. I assume that is the audiance the translations are directed at. For U.S. comprehension, language should best be in “Terminator vocabulary.” For example, the first translation in plain English, “the USA and a few of its vassal states want to maintain a world hegemony and ignore international law. This is a threat to the peace and security of our entire planet. We oppose this.”
For U.S. comprehension the translation may better read “U.S.A. screws everybody. We oppose this.” (The last sentence of the original translation was good.)
I was partly disappointed with the statement. I was hoping for more concrete measures being shown in the trade and investment areas. The “plan” is to increase Russian/Chinese trade to $200 billion. The Chinese/US trade totaled an estimated $615.2 billion in 2020. US exports were $164.9 billion; imports were $450.4 billion. The U.S. goods and services trade deficit with China was $285.5 billion in 2020. The surplus alone for China in that trade is not that much less than China’s entire trade with Germany both imports and exports.And the US/China trade alone is more than all of Russia’s imports and exports worldwide. Which is why China is so reluctant to take a stand like Russia has. Until China is able or willing to build their internal market and not be so dependent on foreign exports I don’t see much changing. They have talked about doing that for years now,but haven’t done it. That export money is so good that they haven’t been willing to make the needed changes to secure their economy from the danger of a sudden Western cutoff. China is the largest importer to the US,and the US is the 3rd largest exporter to China.
https://ustr.gov/countries-regions/china-mongolia-taiwan/peoples-republic-china#:~:text=China%20is%20currently%20the%20United%20States%E2%80%99%203rd%20largest,deficit%20with%20China%20was%20%24345.2%20billion%20in%202019.
Russia has much of the same problem with not investing in stimulating their internal market.And relying much too much on energy exports.Looking at Russia’s exports of $337 Billion in 2020 and imports of $231 Billion in 2020 we can see the problems clearer in the breakdown:
Russia’s exports 2020 by country
Top export destinations of commodities from Russia in 2020:
China with a share of 14.5% (49 billion US$)
Netherlands with a share of 7.36% (24 billion US$)
United Kingdom with a share of 6.86% (23 billion US$)
Germany with a share of 5.52% (18.6 billion US$)
Belarus with a share of 4.73% (15.9 billion US$)
Turkey with a share of 4.72% (15.9 billion US$)
Kazakhstan with a share of 4.16% (14 billion US$)
Korea with a share of 3.69% (12.4 billion US$)
USA with a share of 3.25% (10.9 billion US$)
Italy with a share of 2.98% (10 billion US$)
Exports structure from Russia in 2020 represented by the following main commodity groups:
42% (141 billion US$): 27 – Mineral fuels, mineral oils and products of their distillation; bituminous substances; mineral waxes
11.6% (39 billion US$): 99 – Commodities not specified according to kind
9% (30 billion US$): 71 – Natural or cultured pearls, precious or semi-precious stones, precious metals, metals clad with precious metal and articles thereof; imitation jewelry; coin
4.74% (16 billion US$): 72 – Iron and steel
2.77% (9.34 billion US$): 10 – Cereals
2.47% (8.32 billion US$): 84 – Nuclear reactors, boilers, machinery and mechanical appliances; parts thereof
2.43% (8.19 billion US$): 44 – Wood and articles of wood; wood charcoal
2.07% (6.99 billion US$): 31 – Fertilizers
1.67% (5.64 billion US$): 74 – Copper and articles thereof
1.62% (5.46 billion US$): 76 – Aluminum and articles thereof
What did Russia export in 2020?
Russia’s Top Exports in 2020:
21% ($72 billion): 2709 – Petroleum oils and oils obtained from bituminous minerals, crude.
13.4% ($45 billion): 2710 – Petroleum oils and oils obtained from bituminous minerals, other than crude; preparations not elsewhere specified or included, containing by weight 70 % or more of petroleum oils or of oils obtained from bituminous minerals, these oils being the basic constituents of the preparations; waste oils.
5.49% ($18.5 billion): 7108 – Gold (including gold plated with platinum) unwrought or in semi-manufactured forms, or in powder form.
3.67% ($12.3 billion): 2701 – Coal; briquettes, ovoids and similar solid fuels manufactured from coal.
2.34% ($7.91 billion): 1001 – Wheat and meslin.
2.32% ($7.84 billion): 7110 – Platinum, unwrought or in semi-manufactured forms, or in powder form.
2.32% ($7.84 billion): 2711 – Petroleum gases and other gaseous hydrocarbons.
1.44% ($4.85 billion): 7207 – Semi-finished products of iron or non-alloy steel.
1.37% ($4.64 billion): 7403 – Refined copper and copper alloys, unwrought.
Russia’s imports 2020 by country
Top trading partners (import sources) of Russia in 2020:
China with a share of 23% (54 billion US$)
Germany with a share of 10% (23 billion US$)
USA with a share of 5.7% (13.2 billion US$)
Belarus with a share of 5.44% (12.6 billion US$)
Italy with a share of 4.4% (10.1 billion US$)
France with a share of 3.48% (8.08 billion US$)
Korea with a share of 3.09% (7.15 billion US$)
Japan with a share of 3.06% (7.11 billion US$)
Turkey with a share of 2.2% (5.11 billion US$)
Kazakhstan with a share of 2.18% (5.05 billion US$)
Imports structure to Russia in 2020 represented by the following main commodity groups:
18.8% (43 billion US$): 84 – Nuclear reactors, boilers, machinery and mechanical appliances; parts thereof
12.8% (29 billion US$): 85 – Electrical machinery and equipment and parts thereof; sound recorders and reproducers, television image and sound recorders and reproducers, and parts and accessories of such articles
7.94% (18.4 billion US$): 87 – Vehicles other than railway or tramway rolling stock, and parts and accessories thereof
4.65% (10.7 billion US$): 30 – Pharmaceutical products
4.04% (9.37 billion US$): 39 – Plastics and articles thereof
3.91% (9.07 billion US$): 99 – Commodities not specified according to kind
3.52% (8.16 billion US$): 90 – Optical, photographic, cinematographic, measuring, checking, precision, medical or surgical instruments and apparatus; parts and accessories thereof
2.42% (5.62 billion US$): 73 – Articles of iron or steel
2.23% (5.18 billion US$): 08 – Edible fruit and nuts; peel of citrus fruit or melons
1.97% (4.57 billion US$): 29 – Organic chemicals
What did Russia import in 2020?
Russia’s Top Imports in 2020:
3.89% ($9.01 billion): 8525 – Transmission apparatus for radio-telephony, radio-telegraphy, radio-broadcasting or television, whether or not incorporating reception apparatus or sound recording or reproducing apparatus; television cameras; still image video cameras and other video camera recorders; digital cameras.
3.3% ($7.65 billion): 8708 – Parts and accessories of the motor vehicles of headings 87.01 to 87.05.
3.11% ($7.21 billion): 3004 – Medicaments (excluding goods of heading 30.02, 30.05 or 30.06) consisting of mixed or unmixed products for therapeutic or prophylactic uses, put up in measured doses (including those in the form of transdermal administration systems) or in forms or packings for retail sale.
3.03% ($7.02 billion): 8471 – Automatic data processing machines and units thereof; magnetic or optical readers, machines for transcribing data onto data media in coded form and machines for processing such data, not elsewhere specified or included.
2.34% ($5.42 billion): 8703 – Motor cars and other motor vehicles principally designed for the transport of persons (other than those of heading 87.02), including station wagons and racing cars.
1.23% ($2.87 billion): 8419 – Machinery, plant or laboratory equipment, whether or not electrically heated (excluding furnaces, ovens and other equipment of heading 85.14), for the treatment of materials by a process involving a change of temperature such as heating, cooking, roasting, distilling, rectifying, sterilising, pasteurising, steaming, drying, evaporating, vaporising, condensing or cooling, other than machinery or plant of a kind used for domestic purposes; instantaneous or storage water heaters, non-electri
1.22% ($2.83 billion): 3002 – Human blood; animal blood prepared for therapeutic, prophylactic or diagnostic uses; antisera and other blood fractions and modified immunological products, whether or not obtained by means of biotechnological processes; vaccines, toxins, cultures of micro-organisms (excluding yeasts) and similar products.
1.01% ($2.35 billion): 9018 – Instruments and appliances used in medical, surgical, dental or veterinary sciences, including scintigraphic apparatus, other electro-medical apparatus and sight-testing instruments.
0.978% ($2.26 billion): 8481 – Taps, cocks, valves and similar appliances for pipes, boiler shells, tanks, vats or the like, including pressure-reducing valves and thermostatically controlled valves.
https://trendeconomy.com/data/h2/Russia/TOTAL
What we can see from these sets of export/import statistics is that in China’s case her reliance on her exports to her main enemy and her main enemy’s stooges is a real problem for her ability to strike back at that enemies anti-Chinese policies.The fact that she has in this last year, somewhat, is more the result of that enemy’s more and more crossing China’s Red Lines,than it is something that China wanted to do.If China fails in her plans a lot of the cause will be those entanglements and not relying more on domestic trade.And also not stimulating trade with allied nations .
Russia’s entanglements with trading with her enemies while neglecting her internal trade and allied trade is also the cause of much of her problems. As we saw many of her exports are energy products,while way too many imports are for goods that should be produced internally. The USSR was much more self-sufficient than Russia is,and those heavy imports from Western enemies make the US sanction threats more sharp.
As long as China and Russia allow the US dollar (and the Euro) to dominate their financial dealing,not just with their mutual trade,but all their trade worldwide. They are at the mercy of their enemies threats. There are two main poles to being really independent, the military,and the economy. I think we can be mostly confident on the military issue. But I’m not as confident about the economic issue.
very touchy issue for USA ..obscene trade deficit with China…..PDJT did try deal with this issue..only I guess only NESARA/GESARA..will resolve it…if we ever come to it…
History repeats itself…here is Mao returning from a long trip to the Soviet Union in 1950, where he signed a Sino-Soviet Treaty of Friendship and other treaties. Then he meets Zhou EnLai, China Foreign Minister, and their conclusions re: the treaty are a real historical treat.
See for yourselves. It starts at 1:35 through 6:35
Going Across the Yalu River （Epic of the Korean War）Ep. 1
https://youtu.be/WjihZPxNTGU
Lone Wolf
Andrei I smirked reading this specific item. The sides emphasize that domestic and foreign bioweapons activities by the United States and its allies raise serious concerns and questions for the international community regarding their compliance with the BWC. The sides share the view that such activities pose a serious threat to the national security of the Russian Federation and China and are detrimental to the security of the respective regions.
Translation into plain English:the USA clearly has an active biowarfare program. Russia and China feel threatened by this and they will act together to stop the USA from developing illegal and dangerous bioweapons.
China and the USA have been collaborating-at US taxpayer expense-in biological warfare. Arguably China is a nation that has benefitted rather handsomely from the CDC, NIH and CIA run Eco-Health. https://thenationalpulse.com/2021/09/14/nih-still-sending-millions-to-fund-ccp-research/
Thanks Saker for everything that you do…
Dear Andrei,
You wrote a very helpful article, with the primary take-aways stated succinctly. It would save the US neo-con elite so much confusion if they would read your work! I bet some of them read your writings on the side. In a few years some of them may acknowledge (at least in private) “The Saker was right”. Please keep up the excellent work…
BD
It is good that many are considering the monetary aspects, behind the military factions. There are more than two million species upon our planet, and humanity is the only species, operating debt-based monetary systems, the monetary supply for slaves! And yet somehow we consider ourselves to be the superior species!
In a sovereign, profit-free banking system, we could hold the Title to the customers’ collateral, in trust for the bank customers, during the loan period, and create bank loans as interest-free customer assets. Our nation’s monetary supply then arises as an asset lake, our nation’s greatest treasure, and we erase the psychopathy, surrounding the centralisation of banking, politics, and the military.
History has proved that the human mind is incapable of defeating the psychic darkness, and greed, which surrounds the imposition of usury. This is why the debt bankers, at times, were executed for treason, and excommunicated from God, for Eternity!
Saker, tell me I am not crazy or senile(or both).
Didn’t Obama tell the Russians that missiles were placed in Poland to protect Europe from(get this) Iranian Nuclear weapons?
It actually started with Bush, but expanded with Obama. And the entire time, they indeed said it was for protection of Europe against Iran. Russia even offered a joint station to operate down in the Caucus mountains (can’t remember exact republic). It was rejected outright by the Americans. Anyone out of zone A’s bullshit meter flew past the red and began ticking on the limiter pin.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-bush-shield/bush-missile-shield-is-meant-to-deter-iran-idUSWAT00833920071023
Then the news goes on Obama actually scrapped it. Yeah Right!
https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/obama-scraps-bush-missile-defense-plan/story?id=8604357
So just like the original plan all along, there is infrastructure in Poland and Romania that violated the INF. How? Well the same containers that hold missile defense, also hold tomahawk missiles. This ambiguity and lack of oversight shows intent. The placement shows intent. It proves all the good talk is political maneuvering and the show goes on.
Putin chastised journalists already saying why don’t you report this? The stupidity of US/EU/NATO leadership knows no bounds.
I can tell you that Russia loved America. Internally, you would be greeted warmly by anyone as an American. Moscow was quickly resembling the US with Russian flavor as Dominoes, Papa Johns, Burger King, KFC, MacDonald’s dots the landscape. US route to victory was to do nothing militarily, but just sit back and sell things and buy up business space. Americans will never know to the full extent of their leadership’s stupidity. They’re fed the Russian aggression narrative as daily breakfast.
If you look at a global map rather than a flat projection you will see that Poland is close to the shortest path from Iran to Northern Europe – and right on the path towards North America.
That doesn’t mean that I believe the claim, which seems absurd. But only because there is no reason for Iran to fire missiles at Europe or North America, not because it isn’t the right direction.
They are similar being near both Geodesic routes of Iran and Russia, but
https://yandex.ru/maps/?l=sat%2Cstv%2Csta&ll=24.425042%2C44.076951&z=16
The orientation of station is to the Northeast with wide coverage. Of course they need ambiguity and against Iran is an absurdity.
https://yandex.ru/maps/?l=sat%2Cstv%2Csta&ll=17.110918%2C54.479189&mode=search&ol=geo&ouri=ymapsbm1%3A%2F%2Fgeo%3Fll%3D17.115%252C54.475%26spn%3D0.085%252C0.036%26text%3DPolska%252C%2520Wojew%25C3%25B3dztwo%2520pomorskie%252C%2520Powiat%2520S%25C5%2582upski%252C%2520S%25C5%2582upsk%252C%2520Redzikowo&z=16
This is the site in Redzikovo.. It is also pointed to the Northeast. It’s placement and orientation show who it is really against. There is no need to point to trivialize things with Iran when US actions point to whom they view as an enemy, clearly. Yes, US and Iran have butted heads, but the Iranians have no capacity nor desire to bring conflict to Europe. As for Russia, they have no desire for conflict with Europe what so ever. Though the US definitely has behavior and shows antagonism against Russia. They are laying groundwork for offensive/defensive structures along Russia’s periphery while increasing their push towards Russia’s borders and bad rhetoric.
I know you understand all that, but this is for the benefit of anyone reading. That this is Exactly what Russia means when they say building defense at the expense of another.
“Yet Iran is crucial, not only as a gateway for Russia and China into the Middle-East, but also as a crucial member of the supra-ideological system”
As it always has been: a gateway for goods, armies and not only ideologies but **ideas**. Read “The Shape of Ancient Thought” by McGallivray.
Thank you for these precious maps… showing instantly how apparently more than 85 % of humanity is commonly excluded from the international community by Western mainstream imperial media! That so-called “Rest of humanity” is indeed back on the world map and thriving. Tomorrow’s world now promises to be one essentially of ALL, by ALL, and for ALL.
Did you know in the summer of 2000 that Saddam Hussein announced Iraq was going to quit accepting the US Dollar for all transactions? We invaded Iraq (again) in 2003.
Did you know Muammar Gaddafi announced in 2009 Libya would create its own currency called the African Gold Dinar which would replace using the US dollar? In 2011 Gaddafi was killed by NATO backed rebels.
Did you know in 1938 Germany arrested the Rothschilds and seized their Central Bank? The following year WW2 started. Germany was destroyed.
Did you know last year in 2021 Russia announced it is removing all US Dollar assets from its wealth fund?
Do you see a pattern yet?
I read the joint statement and, from start to finish, the thought wouldn’t leave my mind that Che should be here, it is his moment. This is what he gave his life to. It brought tears to my eyes. So I disagree with Andrei. I think the audience is, as Frantz Fanon described them, “the wretched of the Earth”, or, as we politely and euphemistically say these days, the “global South”.
Thank you Andrei. Anyway, I hope whatever visions Russia and China have for the future of the globe, they better do it soon, or should we say, consider the limited time there’s before Zio-Western mercenary crackpots from Bandaristan, Navalni, Pussy Riot and similar entities active in China become so mainstream that it would become almost impossible to counter. who knows? Putin and Xi may enjoy the popularity and global support today, but that could change fast. The western alliance deploying massive financial/psychological warfare and a monopoly over the popularity of the English language/use amongst various cultures throughout the world, could thwart Russia-China’s plans, altogether. For US, Euro, Russia and China to continue this post WW2 status-quo game i.e. the structural agreement among the big global players with Iran being at its very center, is clearly no longer working as it’s suppose to.
I again checked Mickey Mouse News (Disney-ABC) and Bugs Bunny News (Warner-CNN). Neither offers the full text of the statement. Neither does as much as offer a written article analyzing the summit. Mickey has a comic-book style headline on a video that says “China backs Putin”. I saw that Bugs has a propaganda piece promoted high on the page that appeared to claim in the title that China won’t rescue Putin, but I didn’t even slow down my scroll to look at that title since it was obvious nonsense.
The American media can not write seriously about a serious topic. I laugh when I try to read a science article on a corporate site, because they literally can not discuss a scientific development without referencing a science fiction movie. They can’t tell you about a real world science development without mentioning Star Trek or Star Wars. Usually a significant portion of the article is talking about the science fiction and not the science. I think the target education level that they expect from their audience is about that of a 12 year old, but I’m usually over-optimistic.
If an American wants to read the full statement, they’d have to leave corporate media behind. But they’ll hear the “2 Minute Hate”, comic-book version that says “China backs Putin.” Then if they want to know more, they’ll hear an ‘expert’ who tells them that the USA is mighty and the best country on earth and so it doesn’t matter if China backs Putin because we are invincible and God’s Chosen Nation and the most exceptional people on earth.”
Then again, under Bidenomics, they are probably working two jobs trying to get by in rising inflation partially caused by Trump’s tariffs which Biden endorses and won’t remove so they won’t have time to read or watch the news anyway because the whip is cracked and all of their bosses say work, work, work.
“If an American wants to read the full statement,…”
He/she should access the original source not an interpretation.
If an American wants to understand the full statement
He/she requires a similar facility in the language/register in which the author(s) of the full statement wrote the full statement.
Consequently it is very improbable that an American can ever understand the full statement, or even an interpretation/pre-mastication of the full statement, and hence an American tends to resort to “learned behaviours” in response to doubt, including but not limited to, bridge doubt by belief to attain “comfort”, or like scientists accept doubt and proceed in her/his activities so informed.
Thank you my dear brother Andrei, for the critically important and time-consuming work which you have done in offering both an explanation and an initial analysis of this truly important document. I have benefitted from it to such an extent that I am now provoked to prepare a lecture on the topic: “The Russian Chinese alliance, Pax Islamica, and the Contours of a new International Order”.
with love,
Imran N. Hosein
Dear Skheik, salaam
Thank you for your kind words. Please do send me your lecture when it is finished.
With love and gratitude
Andrei
As an American, I laugh at the idea that America is a democracy.
There is no people power in America. It is banned. It is forbidden. Verbotten.
Protest is largely outlawed, especially in states run by Republicans. They passed all sorts of laws to criminalize protest, especially in the last couple of years. But its been going downhill in America for decades. Even back as far as the Clinton regime, protesters were pushed far away into a ‘free speech zone’ miles away from the people you want to protest. You could protest, but over there were you can’t be seen and can’t be heard.
It is pretty much impossible for a citizen to see a Representative or Senator. That takes checkbook power. Better have at least 5 figures on that check.
And now we get to the root of things. The American system is dominated by money where the money is unlimitted and can come from pretty much everywhere. They supposedly represent a district, but the money comes from everywhere. Its very common to see a congresscritter having fundraisers out of state in CA, NY, TX or other places. You even see fundraisers in Israel. The notion of my representative representing me is a joke.
At best, America gives citizens a vote once every four years, then tells them to get lost. They take no citizen input between elections, and damn little during elections. What the candidates say in the elections are almost all lies. So, the vote is really more about which hair style you like.
And the clincher ….
If America was a democracy, we’d have a vote before starting World War III. A national referendum on war.
“ By definition, the target audience of such a document is the entire planet, but by its language I would argue that it is pretty clear that this is not a document addressed to anybody in the West (for one thing, it is too long for the average western reader and it is too long to be reprinted or read in full in the general press). There is a saying which all Russians know: “the East is a delicate/refined matter” (it comes from a famous Soviet movie). The style and contents of this joint statement shows that it is primarily aimed at the Russian and Chinese public, especially those in position of power: to a typical western reader the text itself looks long-winded and full of well-meaning platitudes. “
As some understand, the temptation of others to believe that they understand the purposes of others facilitate lands of opportunities through reliance on assumption/interpretation and hence understanding becomes a function of facility; the audience being self-selected, including anybody in the “West”, some of whom are reliant on interpreters/pre-masticators, which encourages other datastreams which can be interpreted.
I don’t feel that there will be a war, or at least not one which goes global, unless missiles strikes in the US are considered global. The odds of it encompassing S. America, Africa or even all of Europe are pretty minimum I would think. That’s my hope anyway because I live in Spain.
In his article Scott Ritter wrote, “If the US was to be drawn into a conventional ground war with Russia, it would find itself facing defeat on a scale unprecedented in American military history. In short, it would be a rout.” After reading what analysts here have said, I’m inclined to agree. I visualize Russia chasing NATO westwards with tails tucked between their legs, wishing the idea of fighting Russia had never entered their minds. However, I believe that having reached the goal of getting NATO off their doorstep would satisfy Russia and the pursuit would cease, leaving most of Europe intact.
My question is not so much about the results of a war as to how and why the US military was permitted to become so “ineffective” for lack of a better word. Surely, there must be someone who is responsible for analyzing the military needs of the US military and ensuring those needs are met.
A coach keeps a football team ready to play, but who should have kept the US military ready to fight with the weapons (hypersonic missiles and such) that would be needed. Apparently even N. Korea now has hypersonic weapons, or so the reports make it seem to be. So, who should be fired on the US side for failing to do their job? And why did they fail? Complacency? Arrogance? Corruption?
“I don’t feel that there will be a war,”
How do you define “war”?
“Surely, there must be someone who is responsible for analyzing the military needs of the US military and ensuring those needs are met.”
Thank you for your illustration of level of immersion in “exceptionalism”, sometimes known as “individuality”, which if vigorously researched may offer a portal in “unpacking the Russian-Chinese joint statement” in its interpretation/pre-mastication.
Please be more specific. I don’t understand your reply. Thanks.
“Please be more specific”
I was specific, but not a pre-masticator, and hence offered you an opportunity of “unpacking”, which you requested I make on your behalf “which if vigorously researched may offer a portal in “unpacking the Russian-Chinese joint statement” in its interpretation/pre-mastication.
I have a university education and have been teaching English for 17 years, but I don’t have a clue what you’re trying to tell me. Sorry.
That desire to stop once the enemy is (temporarily) off the doorstep has always worried me. The only way to be secure is to liberate the EU states as well. Get them to leave NATO and drive the US totally out. Without that Russia is just living constantly threatened,and NATO only has to get lucky once,Russia has to be lucky everytime. History tells us over and over that enemies left to fester not truly defeated return later to the fight. When Napoleon was driven out of Russia,Alexander didn’t say,”ok he’s driven out,let’s all relax now”.No,his armies followed the French and defeated them.And Alexander paraded in Paris. When the Red Army drove the nazis out of the Soviet Union,they didn’t stop at the borders,just happy the nazis were gone.No,they fought the nazis all the way to Berlin and took Berlin.They even washed their boots in the Elbe.Had their allies not joined them there from the other side,they would have drove the nazis totally out of Europe and sealed the peace by themselves.
Okay. I understand this message. My worry about continuing the war is that, pressed into a corner, the US and NATO may think the only solution is nuclear. I have always felt a problem should be solved at the lowest possible level, that is, without the complications that might develop.
And you miss the goals here:
The goal of the US is to fight the Russians to the last European.
The goal of the EU is … Well, there is none. They are just insulted for no longer being taken seriously and do not know what to do with that. Their issue is psychological, not physical as they are all well off.
The goal of Russian is to AVOID a conflict, if not possible, PREVENT it going “too hot” with melting glas and all that.
Russia KNOWS the Europeans do not want a warr but it also KNOWS their societies are totally confused, lost and/or brainwashed to not realize they are being led to the slaughter by their US friends.
In case of a conflict in Europe, should happen, the tactical goal of Russia will be to remove any immediate thread – this is where the initial physical action will go. De-fanging basically.
The strategic goal of Russia will however be totally different – it will be to scare the West militarily so it will not want to mess with Russia again for another generation or so. The thinking being that with the cultural and industrial suicide in active progress, after another 20 years of falling behind the reality will seep in and humiliate the West Europeans to realize their foolishness. Russia will just need to wait it out.
As such there may be, even numerous, surgical strikes against specific military targets in Central Europe as part of the tactical objectives. There will likely be massive destruction of any major combat formations russians can identify moving to the front. But I would not expect any Russian soldier to set foot in Germany, Czech Republic, Slovakia, Hungary or Bulgaria as part of this.
Even if **** hits the fan, North Romania is possibly, Poland likely, Baltics guaranteed if they serve as a launchpad for air attacks (they may not). But that is worst case.
Most likely physical conflict – if any – will be limited to total destruction of the Ukrainian units responsible for the attacks and any assets actively supporting them. As it is very likely NATO would NOT support Ukraine in any real way besides supplies, so there will not be a need for a counter-attack. And Russia does not do a pre-emptive unless nuclear war attack was what they sought to pre-empt.
If US forces a physical confrontation on the ukies, the most likely outcome would be a brutal shock&awe response. Anything beyond would require an intentional escalation by NATO forces.
If an American read the text, and thought it was only well-meaning platitudes, they’d feel right at home. That is essentially every American political speech in the last 25 years. It is a particularly accurate description of Obama’s speeches.
Bush and Obama were all well meaning platitudes. The speeches were nothing but a concatenation of applause lines. Trump was a professional and prolific liar, with none of it to be believed. It wasn’t platitudes, but it wasn’t worth listening to either since he lied so much and so often. With Biden the main interest is whether he can successfully stand up for the full speech, or if you can spot the rigging that is holding him up.
With the Warsaw Pact gone, why is there even a NATO?
I can’t believe I am quoting this French woman, but:
Marine Le Pen, who is currently running for President of France
“We will withdraw from the integrated NATO command so that we are no longer dragged into extraneous conflicts. Only the French army should protect France and its interests.”
“In the current conditions of the new cold war, France must make its voice heard in the international arena, including using its position in the UN Security Council. This is a diplomatic privilege inherited from General Charles de Gaulle, and we do not intend to share it with anyone.
“We are reforming the European Union to become a true European alliance of nations. It will be based on the sovereignty of peoples.”
“Glory to the Hungarians and Poles who defend their interests. And a huge shame to Brussels!”
> With the Warsaw Pact gone, why is there even a NATO?
You are aware that NATO was created first, are you?
Knowing that bit of history (conveniently hidden in the West) makes all very clear.
NATO was, from the start, a tool of aggression against Russia (to achieve what Germany failed to).
The Warsaw Pact was a powerful tool to keep NATO in check, but once the Warsaw Pact was gon, NATO was again in free ride. It’s first moves have been to include former Warsaw pact members, in order to deprive Russia of the ability to build again a defensive coalition.
But while deprived of most of Europe, Russia found friends with a shared objective elsewhere in the world.
And also, something quite unexpected, some even see in it the “planing of God” : the US started to commit suicide on all levels, destroying all the basics of what makes a nation strong.
As an American who opposes US hegemony and imperialism, I read into the document a direct address and challenge to Western elites, especially the ‘Anglozionist’/NATO configuration.
These Russian and Chinese countries are two cultures with long histories and, more importantly, the maturity gained from numerous invasions over centuries.
Mother Russia and Papa Beijing are the new ‘Global Parents’, telling their Western “Juvenile Delinquent” counterparts that their drunken wild party is over, and either shape up or be ‘grounded’. Literally through EW and other superior technologies.
Notably, the issue of biowarfare is addressed directly. Gee, I wonder what that has to do with anything? Maybe the various epidemics that killed much of China’s livestock products, chickens and pork, as well as some other illnesses, that have occurred against Cuba, and going back even to the Korean War.
The fact that the document demands transparency about all those world wide biowarfare labs that have been totally unaccountable is saying directly,
“We know what you are doing, and you’d better stop it…or else!” This is a demand similar in spirit to the recent Russian dual document demands re NATO.
So, while of course it’s addressed to the Chinese and Russian peoples, Westerners like myself who did read it, and no doubt, some of the mentally challenged brains at the US State Department, Department of Defense, and their British equivalents will be reading it as well. Hopefully the document as a whole will give the warmongers and troublemakers some pause.
“We know what you are doing, and you’d better stop it…or else!” This is a demand similar in spirit to the recent Russian dual document demands re NATO.”
The framing in “demands”/”ultimata” by others is in significant part a function of cultural projection which the authors likely understood/understand.
There are lateral connections/interactions between “the recent Russian dual document demands re NATO.” and “The Russian-Chinese joint statement” and recognising the absolutes can never exist in interactions, all of the documents cited above are/were in significant increasing assay notices of intent.
In the history of the East, the West has been an accident.
“ but by its language I would argue that it is pretty clear that this is not a document addressed to anybody in the West (for one thing “
“ I do, however, recommend that you take the time and read it here: http://thesaker.is/joint-statement-of-the-russian-federation-and-the-peoples-republic-of-china-on-the-international-relations-entering-a-new-era-and-the-global-sustainable-development/ “
http://en.kremlin.ru/supplement/5770
Joint Statement of the Russian Federation and the People’s Republic of China on the International Relations Entering a New Era and the Global Sustainable Development
Two questions to pose based upon the above.
Since the Kremlin posted an English version in 5363 words on their website on 04/02/22, why do you contend that it was not a document addressed to anybody in the West ?
Since you copied the document of English version in 5363 words that the Kremlin posted on their website on 04/02/22, why your statement –
“ I do, however, recommend that you take the time and read it here: http://thesaker.is/joint-statement-of-the-russian-federation-and-the-peoples-republic-of-china-on-the-international-relations-entering-a-new-era-and-the-global-sustainable-development/ “
It is a message aimed primarily internally, secondarily for the wider world.
When Russia wants to publish something for the Chinese they write it in English. English being the Latin of today, not the “language of the US” in this context.
Pretty much any serious document Russia produces is being (officially) translated into English these days. That is the easiest way to both provide it to the non-Russian world and to avoid (intentional or not) mis-translations going wild.
Given this was such a critical one, I would also assume the translation was mutually agreed with the Chinese before being published.
So, your point? … or are you a Singapore government rep?
I guess, on your/Lee logic, then all the rest of South & Southeast Asia are starving with empty rice bowls because they did not follow Mr Lee (& his ‘democratic’ gang) …?
All hail Singapore and the future of ‘democracy’ … it’s one big shopping maul with an airport, … Lol.
My comment was not a criticism of the way the Malaysian Chinese rebels implemented their organic Confusian values on a little off-shore island with even enough fresh water without being piped in from the mainland.
Only that (in this context) it would not in practice rate as a working democracy. General election statistics would would not likely find a 100% – 0% government success rate to normal distribution. Go figure.
Ooops, … a slight technical hitch in posting.
This was a response to “A.Deplorable on February 06, 2022 · at 1:23 am EST/EDT”
@Pavlo on February 06, 2022 · at 6:21 am EST/EDT
> With the Warsaw Pact gone, why is there even a NATO?
You are aware that NATO was created first, are you?
NATO is open to all European countries who wish to join, no questions asked!
Unless of course, you are Russia! No applications accepted.
In other words, NATO is designed to be a war machine against Russia! It is not a shield, it is a sword!
In the excerpts of the original text the word “oppose” is used 5 times. This is very strong. It is explicitly said the expression of a new clear global affirmation.
We know that zone A is very weakened, but in spite of that it remains very aggressive. There are red lines that are constantly being tested, even exceeded. As this document is intended more for Russian and Chinese decision makers, it seems to me that the leaders of Zone B are gathering their forces. It is also perhaps a warning to the 5th column to accept losses or ….
Zone B’s opposition, as suggested by the vocabulary, will in my view take the following forms :
– Use their superiority in a war of positioning forces to always put the opponent in a position of unstoppable strategic weakness = Avoid war as much as possible.
– Reciprocate every aggressive opposing move.
– Progressive commercial, financial and monetary disconnection that will lead to the desired rebalancing.
Many thanks to this blog which allows us to follow live this titanic struggle without precedent in the history of humanity.
Hello Saker
Thanks for this. I would respectfully disagree that the west was not a target audience on the grounds of not understanding the eastern concepts – anyone reading the document for work purposes (such as a foreign ministry) would also doubtless have access to ex-pat analysts from China and Russia. Or they might even have had a classical education!
And assuming that they did understand it then this document clearly states that Russia and China are very deep friends and if you attack one expect the other to help. To what extent is left deliberately vague as a matter of strategic ambiguity but the inference is clear – just don’t.
So if the USA wants a small war in Ukraine for the express purpose of being able to sanction Russia then the USA has to consider what effect would any Chinese action have and also Russia might feel emboldened to cut off the gas knowing it can rely on the might of the Chinese economy.
The real problem is not about understanding. The west understands very well. The problem is that they do not respect Russia or China and thus believe they can behave as they wish.
You also stated with respect to the Crimea/Taiwan issue: “From the Chinese point of view, neither Russia nor Banderastan can claim a clear and unequivocal principle which would trump all others,” I think that the principle would be state security. I cannot agree with the view that either Russia or China has imperialistic views and is trying to grab territory or extend influence over vassals in their view of either Crimea or Taiwan – they simply cannot allow the threats to national security that enemy occupation of these areas impose. If Taiwan bought its weapons from Russia then I doubt China would worry so much – and the Taiwanese would have better weapons at a lower cost to boot.
Crimea went back to Russia without a shot fired (which really got up the collective nose of the West who had to enact quite a bloody coup to grab the rest of Ukraine, bar Donbas) and I am sure there will be equally skillful work by Xi to reunite Taiwan.
“would also doubtless have access to ex-pat analysts from China and Russia. “
Perhaps focus on the specific is more illuminating than focus on the aggregate?
Lets consider the case of The State Department of “The United States of America” and their policy from at least 1933 onwards of “integrating” ex-pat “analysts”” into their organisational networks, and choose one Polish ex-patriot Mr. Brzezinski, and a Ukrainian ex-patriot presently described as Victoria Nuland.
In both instances Mr. Brzezinski’s and Victoria Nuland’s “interpretations/pre-mastications” were subject to various biases, and in part The State Department of The United States of America’s recruitment policies and practices were predicated on similar biases.
What then was/is/would be the utility of “doubtless having access to those “analysts” from Poland and Ukraine, except in increasing/sustaining bias, given that 2The Soviet Union” is in ongoing process of transcendence by the Russian Federation, and in 2014 The United States of America” gained an albatross, whilst the Russian Federation gained a new member ?.
To some this is known as – The curved balls syndrome – best left to opponents..
Thank you, Andrei. But while I applaud the unity and objectives of Putin and Xi, I wonder does it apply to the Russian and Chinese people in totality? In other words: will such intentions persist when Russia and China are no longer led by Putin and Xi? Will those countries then adopt Imperialist practices if it is in their respective interests to do so?
Nothing applies to an entire population in its entirety. I think it would trend towards friendship in both spheres. There were deals to pump water from Russia to China. There are cities in China like Manzhouli that are heavily influenced by Russia. Some have negative perceptions like sneaky shop owners and mistrust. I think educated people understand the vast opportunities and wealth a friendship provides. Also, China despite the 1950s crisis, has never displayed openly racist attitudes towards Russia like US/EU has.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YBKyftyt8bs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zSBKR8fQDFs
МИР НАИЗНАНКУ
This show is amazing. He is a Ukrainian who is broadcasted throughout Russia. He speaks Russian and he visits Asia and has fantastic cultural exchanges. This shows a few things. How close Russians and Ukrainians really are and why its possible for radical nationalists to hate Russia so much. The Second is how well interactions can be when someone respects and is interested in another’s culture. So lets hope these positive connections trump the negativity.
Bravo Saker. Something important caught my eyes;
This “limitless friendship” working towards a “community of common destiny for mankind” is the absolute worst nightmare of western imperialism…
Were China and Russia to actually implement their stated policy it would be the biggest crisis in the life the Anglo Zionist. For example, the small nations who are reeling under the bloody boots of colonialism would be eager to reach out for freedom and liberty. I am thinking Haiti and Bolivia as examples.
And were Russia, China and allies to assist in creating a successful model for this new liberty the world would experience a domino effect unmatched in history.
RE: Ali on February 06, 2022 · at 9:21 am EST/EDT
That has been the purpose for many years including during the 1990’s – transcendence of opponents – and part of why:
The People’s Republic of China and the Russian Federation pose an existential threat to the coercive social relation self-misrepresented as “The United States of America” with their continuing complicity,
including their continuing complicity in aiding the ongoing transcendence of “The Soviet Union” – who never posed an existential threat to the coercive social relations self-misrepresented as “The United States of America”, merely varying degrees of emulation – by the Russian Federation,
with facilitating a type of “primitive accumulation” to aid a reducing phase of the development of The People’s Republic of China.
whilst encouraging the ire and motivation of many to join in on-going cooperative endeavours to facilitate the transcendence of the coercive social relations self-misrepresented as “The United States of America” world-wide, including but not limited to “assist in creating a successful model for this new liberty the world would experience a domino effect unmatched in history.”
Hegemon ?
Try to remember the cautions of some strategists – Do you think your opponent is as stupid as you are?
Russian revival is not digested by the US. That is the reason, why the US has launched a cold war against Russia.
We’ll see who will turn the paindial up and who will suffer of it.
Shakespearian choice for me as a French.
If it’s west who is tougher and Russia suffers, I will be sorry and sad.
If it’s Russia who is tougher, then, as west citizen, I will suffer.
Cruel prospect .
Not really, the US is led by competent folks. That is what all that deep state thing is. Tactically, the faces can be incompetent, but the strategic decisions are well thought-out. Those are the decisions which do not change between administrations as they are not the (elected) administration decisions.
The powers that be are just too self-centered in their belief in superiority to BELIEVE they will prevail long term and that this is a zero-sum. Their believe it is a zero-sum is their central failing for it is not. Every major mistake they make sources from these two: Superiority and a a belief that a zero-sum game is being played.
Russia is just an obstacle and its demonisation is a tool used when seen fit. There is nothing emotional in the decision making of these folks. That is both their strength and a weakness. They cannot comprehend concepts as friendship or even trust between societies as an international politics thing. There is no raw logic in that so nothing they can “grab on”.
Though Europe, the post-colonial one, is different beast. It is (still) largely democratic and the elites there do indeed have real issues to digest what you describe. The whole societies there have that post-imperial syndrome permeating their psyche. The fact that US was systematically eliminating any true leaders in European countries for decades is also partly to blame. Poodles rarely have the temerity to transcend thought paradigms. Something absolutely essential to notice, and accept one’s failings. The first step to get over them …
spengler seems to have an answer…
https://asiatimes.com/2022/02/richelieus-ghost-almost-solves-americas-problems/
“Furthermore, “no limits” is also nonsensical in western geopolitics. Again, to a Russian or Chinese audience the paragraph above means and expresses much MORE than any “alliance”, “treaty” or “agreement”. Western political leaders simply cannot fathom or imagine what Russia and China are saying here – their minds simply cannot comprehend what is being said here.”
I am a US citizen but I think I can comprehend what is being said here on a personal level. There are different classes of relationships. I have associations based on work or sports and recreation. I have friends which are usually an extension of the other kind of associations but these people come to my house and break bread and I know them on a more intimate level. Then there is a small group that are my boys. They could show up at my house at 3am with a body in the trunk and I would be obligated to help and keep my mouth shut. (I hope this never happens btw). You start a fight with one of the boys and you’ll get yourself a fight with all of us.
Great success comes from true comradery and the willingness to give everything for one another. This sort of alliance is very rare. All that is missing is something like the Yassa of Genghis Khan but since this was a secret oral arrangement perhaps the Russians and Chinese have worked this out as well.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yassa
Funny news in UE
Conservative german leader of CDU juste Saïd that: ” USA remain our first and best ally…” 😂
As for Macron and all the rabid europeist morons who lead France. They all swear about a socalled French-german couple and that France is the best german ally.
Since 30 years we have given everything to Germany, our industry, our monney, our independance and now the nerves give out, the masks fall and the seams crack
This Traveling Wilburys song is perfect for the Anthem of the Russia-China-Iran Geopolitical/Geostrategic Block.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=nvlTJrNJ5lA&feature=emb_logo
It says the new pipeline wil be paid in euro’s.
Why not in Russian or China valuta?
Removed. Mod.
Give a link to the official source, where it is written that the contract for the construction of the Power of Siberia 3 gas pipeline or the gas transported through it is paid in Euros! And not in the national currencies of Russia and China?!
Removed – only Saker can ban commenters. Mod.
It’s on the official statement. You just have to read it before breaking everything. :)
But both can be true.
A contract can be denominated in EUR while the actual settlements can use equivalent RMB transfers for example.
That said, CN has an over-supply of EUR, so it makes sense to actually transact in EUR here as long as EU does not sanction this (which they will not).
However, should there be any reason of why not to transact in EUR, I am sure they can quickly agree on then-equivalent RMB or RUB settlements while keeping the prices denominated in EUR.
Key here is the denomination of the contract in EUR as it ties the EUR value to the value of the commodity being sold. In turn stabilising/anchoring the currency used. What currency (or goods) is the actual tranfer of is of a secondary importance here.
Right! Calculation in national currencies.
But it is customary to refer to the source, especially since the Euro fan repeats this mantra through the post.
In what “official statement”? the Kremlin? Gazprom? CNPC?
Psaki?
Where is the link to the official verified source, moron!
I ask this because that is what the artical is saying.
I don’t made this up. Why should i provide a link?
Russia en China wants to trade in national valuta but as far as i unsterstand they pay in Euro’s for the future pipeline. That seems odd to me.
I’m the new sheriff in town. There’s nothing you can do about it. Mind your own business within your boundaries. Don’t bother anyone No one will bother you. We will get along just fine. Cheers