Europe seems to have a real problem with referenda. First, the EU categorically rejected the referendum in Crimea, now they have tried to prevent the people of Greece of having a say in their future. And the EU has failed again – the Greeks will hold their referendum:
(please press ‘cc’ to see the English subtitles)
Leaving it to the voters…in a democracy.
Imagine that.
Exactly, that’s really dangerous and has to be smashed in its first rise before it becomes an example.
Leaving it up to the Crimeans to vote to be back with Russia? Whaaat??! We can’t have that!
^That’s the globalist overlords’ mind set and it always was.They’re terrified of True Democracy and people having a say on their own destiny.
-TL2Q
Who was saying he sold out?
Democracy was invented in Greece. Let them bring it back to the world.
“Sold out Cuba,” too.
Cuba was the first to leap to Venezuela’s side when the U.S. defined it as a threat to the security of the United States, and the rest of South/Central America followed.
Still, the boy’s up against it without a mandate. This is possibly the boldest minority government we’ve ever seen.
Strictly speaking, accusing Tsipras and Syriza of “selling out” is incorrect. The irrepressible desire to “belong to Europe” — in reality a claim to continued joint First World parasitic entitlement — is very strong in Greece. On this basis, Tsipras could actually be said to represent and serve the entire Greek nation very honestly as a sincere, truly concerned Social Democrat. It would be much more to the point accusing him — and his electorate — of being wilfully blind to the essence of “European values”. I just cannot help gloating over the total contempt elicited among the Eurocrats by this smarmy flattery. The proverbial 1% is way too class conscious and power greedy to ever become spellbound by it. EU serves their interests just marvellously.
Nussimen,
Yours is an excellent and insightful comment. Your depiction of the true nature of the EU establishment and their not-so-hidden contempt for those that buy into the “European-Values” empty rhetoric is eloquent.
You’re right that you could take the view that Tsipiras represents the Greek electorate (in the way you put it: to be part of the parasitical European culture of entitlement, “values” and other Brussels Fascistocrat nonsense), however, Syriza’s open statements were the opposite of the known values and position of the EU wannabees section of the Greek electorate. This is where their PM looks like a complete sham. But, yes I get your point and agree with your conclusions and the irony you point out.
Democracy comes from bharat
You actually believe that Kat kan? That democracy was born in Greece? Go examine what their fake form of democracy actually meant –> intolerance for views outside of the consensus of the elite (who were the one’s that actually voted). And no they did not invent democracy.
Again, I don’t believe for a minute that any of these corrupt self-serving politicians in Greece are sincere (including Syriza). Instead of showing leadership and taking the personal risk and sacrifice for the sake of their people; i.e. by defaulting; instead they punted the responsibility onto the population that are scared and panicked. Calling a referendum with a wishy-washy no recommendation is passing the buck. – Without even a clear understanding of what a “No” means, in the short term, med-term and long-term.
If these guys were really sincere (which they have proven not to be), they would have apprised the Greek people of the exact dirty conditions being imposed (on a day to day basis), shown the mathematics that re-payment is impossible to sustain, and made clear to the Greek people that the Banking thieves in the IMF and Brussels want to permanently own (pennies on the dollar) key Greek assets (as well as depopulation thru forced economic migration of the reproductive segment of the population and poverty). Syriza did not do this.
I seriously hope that Andrew Korybko is right when he postulates that the US will not permit European creditors to foreclose on Greek assets (due to the Wolfowitz doctrine) in order to make the EU pay the consequences of their own fraud (not for moral reasons but to keep the EU in check).
I think I see one of the EU/Empire moves to scare the Greek people into a “Yes” vote.They are restricting the Greek banks cash reserves ““The Eurogroup’s decision prompted the ECB to not increase liquidity to Greek banks and forced the Bank of Greece to recommend that banks remain closed, as well as restrictive measures on withdrawals,”.So Greece has had to limit withdrawals and close the banks for a short period.That may scare citizens,and could affect the vote.They will deny it of course.But I see that as a scare tactic against Greece.Hopefully the citizens will realize things won’t get better until after they get worse and steel themselves and vote “No”.
http://rt.com/business/270304-greece-capital-controls-banks/
So the eurogroup proved what filthy vampires they are; all the more reason to get out of the default and EU.
Yeah, I wish I could default on my debt…but its scary…you’re looking at your life….its a horrible fact that its hard to eat without money…that’s the temptation of Christ….turning stones into bread….money.
Let see if the Greek people still want to sit at the “cool kids’ table” even though the cool kids keep hitting them with spit balls.
Many years ago when I was in Highschool, I wanted to be part of the home-coming float building, parade, and whatever else went with it. I got on the “team” only because they couldn’t prevent me by the rules. Well, I found out an awful lot about the morals / ethics of the “cool kids”. Basically they had none, and if you weren’t in the “club” you were just fit enough to walk all over.
So, I got my wish, did all the crap work, worked around people that treated me like a cancerous growth, all the while being the subject / recipient of many teenage “jokes”. But I carried through to the end and was in the parade and then when it finished I just thought to myself “these cool kids are a bunch of assholes, why do I want to be associated with them?… I don’t.”
Hopefully, the Greek people have enough self pride to bale out of the EU, there is a better future for themselves looking eastward.
The EU will never let them build that Russian gas pipeline; that can only happen if Greece is independent of the EU.
The only other comment I have is, that staying in the EU was one of the election winning “mandates” and I wonder if this very long and tedious circus has just been done to bring about this referendum, so that the government isn’t breaking its mandate, the people are changing it.
If Greece does exit, I wonder who will be lined up next to get the spitballs, Portugal or Ireland?
They are not leaving the EU. Not yet anyway. They are only leaving the Eurozone, which is the use of EURO money, going back to drachma. Not every EU country uses the Euro, eg Poland and UK.
As excited as I am about Syriza deploying the ‘Nuke option’ on their EU, IMF and whoever else, creditors (…and I am! Believe me! I am! This is better than nothing, right?) I have to agree with you: they should go the full hog and leave the EU, not just dump the Euros.
Look at the UK; they have their own currency [hence: they are in EU but not in Euro-zone] yet, they’re still being ruled by Brussels…
OUT, out, out!
Full sovereignty is the only answer to this EU nightmare.
-TL2Q
“Look at the UK; they have their own currency [hence: they are in EU but not in Euro-zone] yet, they’re still being ruled by Brussels…”
That’s because British pounds are still borrowed from the banksters like euros. Even if Greece left the EU, switched to the drachma, yet had banksters control the money by borrowing it from them, the exact same thing would happen. “Let me issue and control a nation’s money and I care not who writes the laws,” remember?
[^Mayer Amschel Rothschild (1744-1812), founder of the House of Rothschild]
” [..] remember?”
…yeah, I do.
And?!
Hmm.. :/
And…
Greece can stay in the EU. All they have to do is issue the drachma debt-free and control it in the public interest.
Poppadop, Greece can’t issue debt-free money while belonging to the EU. EU belongs to the IMF/Fed system. Every unit of local currency is linked to the dollar or the euro and can be issued only in exchange for depositing dollars or euros into their central bank’s reserves.
http://borisanisimov.blogspot.com/2010/10/nationalization-of-ruble.html
In order for states to issue their own debt-free money the IMF/Fed system has to fall. When states issue their own interest-free money without paying bankers interest for it, it is called “public banking” or “state banking”. Under the new TTIP trade law it is illegal, so it’s really important to defeat TTIP, TPP, etc.
Good post Penelope. Cheers for that :) ….plus you also beat me to post the Delphi Declaration / Hudson’s new article on Greece (to be found further down the comment thread).
But, so long the word is out, I’m happy.
-TL2Q
Thanks for the heads-up, Penny. I didn’t know the EU and euro were an all-or-nothing deal.
A nation is either sovereign or it is not a nation. It is a colony, with no vote on anything important.
Servile.
Greece continues to surrender every aspect of honor.
It has a path back to sovereignty and sustainability.
Russia and China are there to help.
The hallucinatory drug of “Europe” has captured Greek mentality.
Solon,
Russia is not economically sovereign either. She does not set monetary policy. Her central bank is “independent of the govt”– which means it’s controlled by the international banking cabal through the IMF and the Fed.
http://borisanisimov.blogspot.com/2010/10/nationalization-of-ruble.html
To become economically sovereign she must nationalize the ruble or central bank. Twol attempts have been made, but they’ve failed so far.
They can’t. The arrangement with the Central Bank is set out in the agreements with IMF. They’d have to withdraw from that to be able to do it. Even if they have no loans from IMF, while they remain members (and Russia has a fair bit of money in the IMF lending pool) they have to keep the rules…. which are designed this way to keep world money balanced, never mind what happens in the individual country. That is one main way IMF controls the world and one big reason that system has to go.
The cost of removing this rule is possibly much bigger fluctuations of one currency against another (as a country can print as much of its own as it wants and this affects the relative value of the other currencies). Obviously this was designed to maintain the value of the dollar, more than anything else.
Kat Kan, Never say “can’t” exit the IMF or nationalize the ruble. There are obstacles & certainly it’s better if a group of countries do it together. It MUST be done because the alternative is the continuation of the world’s finances being run by the international banking cabal. The continuation of the 1% funneling the wealth into their own pockets and through that wealth corrupting our govts & controlling our media.
More than anything what is required is that people understand that the world did fine without this system before WWII. The system greatly slows the development of most countries including Russia.
It’s not difficult to understand.
http://borisanisimov.blogspot.com/2010/10/nationalization-of-ruble.html
The EU has a problem with democracy of any kind, unless it returns neo-liberal parties in permanence.
With any luck, Greece will cause the EU to come to an overdue end and something better might replace it.
Bravo sir!
A clear and bold statement that challenges the phony narratives the media mind manipulators have been spinning. Put up or shut up time. Things just got real. Greek people, use your indomitability to carry yourselves over this temporary dislocation and the new positive energies will support your transition to the ‘win-win’ paradigm emerging globally.
“Greece against the men in gray” by Juan Carlos Monedero. (MUST READ)
http://www.comiendotierra.es/2015/06/29/grecia-contra-los-hombres-de-gris/
(…) What is that shit to ask the people? Do we want to return to the USSR or what? And kicked Varufakis out of the meeting room, who was representing an entire people. There are places where if you look at the jailer’s eyes you want a beating. Or a shot.
Troika bureaucrats are characterized by being ruthless with the weak and obsequious with the strong. In this It’s going to change in their tie and get their salary. The issue becomes worse if we consider that the salary is payed by us. Why you can compel any worker to fulfill its obligations except these minions of the international financial institutions? They insult the legitimate Greek government and media companies voice the “intolerable misbehavior” of Syriza government. Of course, if the banks has taken control of the media. Will they criticize their bosses?
We come, as always, from History. Germany gave his most prized possession, the Deutsche Mark, in 1990 in exchange of that France would grant sovereignty to unification. The single currency was born. World War II ended with the unconditional surrender of the Third Reich, so that the union of the FRG and the GDR after the fall of the Berlin Wall was only possible if the winning powers signed a peace treaty. That was the Two Plus Four Treaty (the two Germanies and the four victorious powers) signed in September 1990.
The first response of the unified Germany was forcing EU recognition of Slovenia and Croatia-and then began to return the concept of “backyard” – ahead to do so. What happened in Yugoslavia we already know. Germany now is trying to force the exit of Greece from the Eurozone. That solution will inevitably force the exit of Portugal, which would force the exit of Italy, which would result in the departure of Spain. In the end, again, when France was alone with Germany, Merkel could regain its currency, reinforced over the years by a single market to its service and free financing their investments by having paid the rest of Europe with the highest premium risk. And all the European dream that has brought us decades of internal peace after the terrible first half of the twentieth century, will return to the anguish of the thirties. It is not about making dark predictions. It is not doing wrong again.(…)
(…) The incomprehensible is that Europe now let Germany loose again. Something that can only be understood by the characteristics of the global financial economy, which turns our countries into protectorates of Germany led by a collaborator effort that benefits only the elites who are part of the 1% that is plundering the pantry of 99%.(…)
(…) It’s time for people.(…) Being today with Greece is to be with democracy. It is time to demand that democracy and human rights are above financial greed, not to return to nightfall on Europe.(…) What is happening in Greece is no joke. We’re playing the peace of the continent. Let’s help Greece against black men, in truth, the men dressed in brown and with harnesses from always.
Gracias, Elsi. El diga la verdad con fuerza.
Eso es lo que digo yo por todo un ano: que no podemos con el FMI. Rusia tiene que escapar; todo el mundo tiene que escapar del FMI.
Alemania perdio el Mark pero con la intencion de ponerse jefe de Europa. Pero sabes que? No creo que Alemania ahora intente forzar la salida de Grecia de la Eurozona. Quiere echar la culpa en el partido Syriza para terminarse con la gente– y asi quedarse con Grecia.
Se sorprendieron mucho cuando dijo Tsipras, “Vamos a votar.” Que deliciosos si votan que “No!”
So Portugal, which wasn’t even involved in world war 2, also wants to join the bandwagon by resorting to scapegoating Germany? That didn’t work out for Greece and may only help for a short while to control domestic unrest. But hey, outside villains are a tried method, aren’t they?
Though had to laugh at this one: “Germany now is trying to force the exit of Greece from the Eurozone.”
The Euro crisis was the exact opposite of this and Germany actually got accused of keeping back Greece in the “slavery” of the Euro zone. But whatever floats your boat, right?
“Greece 2015-Poland 1939”
http://www.comiendotierra.es/2015/06/23/grecia-2015-polonia-1939/
Monedero compares the Greek situation with the Nazi invasion of Poland
Warns that “before Hitler invaded Poland were clear signs of their behavior and Europe was not up to par” PAMPLONA, June 22 (EUROPA PRESS) -. The former Program secretary of Podemos, Juan Carlos Monedero, said that we are living in Greece “what Europe experienced in 1939 with the German invasion of Poland” and added that “we knew it was going to cost us pain stop fascism, but if we had done before we would have saved a lot of suffering”
“One thing remains certain: The refusal of an extension of a few short days and the attempt to cancel a purely democratic process is an insult and a great disgrace to Europe’s democratic traditions”
Utterly laughable. On the contrary, Tsipras’s country has been most spectacularly honoured by “Europe’s democratic traditions”: Military coups, fascist invasions including Anglo-American napalm and carpet bombing campaigns, mass exodus, and now Frau Merkel und seine liebenswerte Troika. Sehr hübsch.
Seriously, if Tsipras had any stature to speak of, he would simply repeat Victoria Nuland’s beautiful pronunciamento and then turn to BRICS without any apologies whatsoever. The only forces in Greek politics that seem to understand the obvious, or at least not pretending ignorance, are the Communists (KKE) and the Nazis (Golden Dawn).
Most likely, Tsipras and his government will behave just like the despicable Bulgarian government did with regard to SouthStream: If anything would benefit Greece along with benefiting BRICS, suck up to your Western overlords at the expense of the population by trashing the opportunity deliberately.
Who is against Egypt now? chief prosecutor killed in car bombing
http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2015/06/egypt-state-prosecutor-motorcade-hit-bomb-attack-cairo-150629083650272.html
KatKan, I think it’s still the Muslim Brotherhood– cuz of all those death sentences.
lets be honest, the EU know nothing of democracy, they’re allergic to it, they aren’t even democratically elected themselves. They are an economic dictatorship working for the IMF who are owned by the US. all roads lead to the beast.
That sounds like a scientifically accurate outline of good ol’ Western democracy to me. Banderastan comes even closer.
As it happened – Yanis Varoufakis’ intervention during the 27th June 2015 Eurogroup Meeting
http://yanisvaroufakis.eu/2015/06/28/as-it-happened-yanis-varoufakis-intervention-during-the-27th-june-2015-eurogroup-meeting/
“The Eurogroup Meeting of 27th June 2015 will not go down as a proud moment in Europe’s history. Ministers turned down the Greek government’s request that the Greek people should be granted a single week during which to deliver a Yes or No answer to the institutions’ proposals – proposals crucial for Greece’s future in the Eurozone. The very idea that a government would consult its people on a problematic proposal put to it by the institutions was treated with incomprehension and often with disdain bordering on contempt. I was even asked: “How do you expect common people to understand such complex issues?” Indeed, democracy did not have a good day in yesterday’s Eurogroup meeting! But nor did European institutions. After our request was rejected, the Eurogroup President broke with the convention of unanimity (issuing a statement without my consent) and even took the dubious decision to convene a follow up meeting without the Greek minister, ostensibly to discuss the “next steps”.
Can democracy and a monetary union coexist? Or must one give way? This is the pivotal question that the Eurogroup has decided to answer by placing democracy in the too-hard basket. So far, one hopes.”
This video was posted 6/!8/15. It certainly shows what a plan Greece had (has).
Varoufakis Eurogroup Press Conference
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2CqogKA-_XA
I just by passed the Greek part and listened to the English.
JANA,
A resignation by Tsipras could be such a big event. On Monday night in Athens, Tsipras dropped heavy hints that he may indeed quit if the referendum he called for July 5 goes against him.
He was elected on a platform of reducing austerity. If the vote forces him to accept it, clearly they don’t want him as leader. Only then EU would have to wait for a new election and then start this whole negotiation rubbish with the new guy. So far it looks like people don’t want the austerity, and he has a week to explain it to them in fine detail. So has the other side a whole week to tell stories, make promises, and cause various interferences with the vote itself. Greece needs some prayers this week, I think.
The best part of it is this:
T
Pablo Iglesias ha retwitteado
PODEMOS @ahorapodemos 5 hHace 5 horas
“Cuando un gobierno defiende a la gente, el pueblo responde. La plaza Syntagma de Atenas ahora mismo”.
( When a government defends the people, the people respond. Athens Syntagma Square right now)
Enlace permanente de imagen incrustada
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CIsD4RCWgAANQ8W.jpg
I was in Syntagma Square, live this my morning, Greece’s evening, thanks to rt.com. Wonderful, beautiful, joyful! I do hope it is a new beginning for Greece. Michael Hudson has a post about the banks at counterpunch.org this evening, Monday. Very important what he has to say, as also can be found in his earlier article there. My prayers are with you, good, brave people of Greece!
Juliana,
Here’s Michael’s video at the Delphi Initiative.
http://michael-hudson.com/2015/06/greek-asset-stripping-similarities/
His group has also put out the Delphi Proclamation, which includes an appeal to the German people. Excerpt:
“We call upon you, the German people, to stop such a Faustian alliance between German political elites and international finance. We call upon the German people not to permit to their government to continue doing to the Greeks exactly what the Allies did to Germans after their victory in the First World War. Do not let your elites and leaders to transform the entire continent, ultimately including Germany, into a dominion of Finance.”
Read entire at http://www.globalresearch.ca/on-greece-and-europe-what-is-called-negotiation-is-a-demand-for-total-surrender/5458853
PS the “public option” that he refers to is the nation-state issuing its own interest-free money, instead of paying interest to the banking cabal.
Democracy or barbarism,
“Not more asphyxiation” by Jorge Moruno:
http://blogs.publico.es/jorge-moruno/2015/06/29/no-asfixia/
That is the most beautiful speech I’ve ever heard. He’s wonderful…I love him.
SAKER / MODERATOR
You might want to consider putting up the Delphi Declaration as is own entry on your site.
Michael Hudson & a lot of eminent people have signed it.
It’s within this article
http://www.globalresearch.ca/on-greece-and-europe-what-is-called-negotiation-is-a-demand-for-total-surrender/5458853
Includes an appeal to the German people.
The Greek situation is very interesting and has some hope. I’ve been watching Greece with gradually increasing dismay since Syriza’s election, as the Syriza government seemed to concede more and more ground. But I always had a niggling feeling that just maybe they were hiding some cards. I now wonder if they may have been crazy like foxes.
I followed Syriza since well before they formed government. One thing that activists and leaders and thinkers in Syriza seemed to agree on was the expectation that, if they gained power, they would be under determined attack both from within Greece and from Europe. They seemed clear that the task would be not only to govern, and to improve life for the Greek people by doing X,Y,Z policy or even by mobilizing Greeks to improve their own lives; rather it would be to do all this while fighting off the assault of the oligarchs and imperialists. And it seemed there were plans to do just that. It seemed odd that they would have forgotten all that once they were in negotiations. Not impossible, because so many left-ish governments do fold under pressure, but odd.
Consider this scenario, which I won’t swear to but which is one possibility. The leaders of Syriza always considered Grexit a strong possibility–not their first option, but what they would go for if the Troika behaved roughly as expected rather than being reasonable. But they couldn’t say so because quite simply the Greek people were very scared of Grexit and also felt it would represent defeat, loss of “European” status. If they’d campaigned on Grexit they would quite simply have lost. Further, they couldn’t then turn around and go for it as soon as they were elected even if they wanted to, because their government was weak and their movement strongly dependent on an image, and even a reality, of insistence on strong democracy and popular mandate. For similar reasons, negotiating so hard as to instantly create a break would look like default and Grexit was their fault, their aim, and the government would probably go down, or at best have its legitimacy and ability to get things done mortally weakened.
So they pursued a strategy of apparent weakness. They hung tough enough to show that they were pushing for what the Greek people wanted, but not so tough as to definitively end negotiations. They proposed lots of policies that were popular with the Greek people, largely just so that the Troika would be forced to shoot them down publicly. Note that some of the policies the Troika rejected actually generate revenue–for instance the Troika refused to agree to increases on corporate taxes, even though the money would have been used to pay them. And they very publicly pointed out everything that the Troika was insisting on doing to the Greek people, and they watched the polls. Functionally, the short term results were only moderately different from previous governments, but the political difference was crucial: Previous governments tried desperately to justify what they were agreeing to, whereas Syriza made it abundantly clear that these were terrible unjustifiable policies that the Troika were ramming down Greeks’ throats with blackmail.
And as the Troika whittled away at Syriza policies, pushing the apparent weakness further and further, it became more and more obvious to the Greek people who the enemy was, who was victimizing them, who was humiliating them, and just how bent they were on harming ordinary Greeks even at the expense of any stated goals they might have, such as repayment of money. When the polls looked right, Syriza sprang their trap: The referendum, which will if successful give them the democratic mandate to default and/or Grexit.