2016/12/05 10:00:02
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Despite the celebrations in advance by the far-right, the old Europe has said NO to populisms with obscure goals and xenophobic tendences which resemble other formations of infamous memory in other times. As I have already said before, I think Europe, if not by the price she was oblied to pay, is clearly immunized against fascism.
So, the far-right may be has won in the US since they payed no price at all for WWII, but has been defeated in Austria.
I think Europe, if not by the price she was obliged to pay, is clearly immunized against fascism.
By turning a blind eye
Even the term “populism” has been turn around or up side down. Populism means, the way to approach the larger part of the population in offering a program which is more close to their general desire, to be governed upon. In this sense, Putin is also a populist because he has the larger size of the population on his side. Hugo Chavez was a populist. It is much more appropriate the terms right and left, but here again, there is no way that the right is right and the left is left as they were some time ago. If the FPÖ (Hofer) wanted and declared openly that he will have better relation with Russia, is viewed as negative by electorate, that’s very sad, because in the TV shows and MSM media this “friendship” is something wrong. If that is wrong, does that mean that by having good relations with Russia is a fascist approach ? It is clear that someone has decided what is good and what is wrong for the EU states in regard to Russia.
Populism is not Fascism. Nice logical fallacy (straw man argument):
http://i2.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/995/415/b30.jpg
Congratulations, Anonymous. You have also succeeded in invoking Godwin’s Law in just one post!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_law
Women´s vote decisive in the defeat of the far-right:
http://www.publico.es/internacional/voto-mujeres-decisivo-derrota-ultraderecha.html
62% of women opted for ecologist Alexander Van der Bellen, while 38% did so by Norbert Hofer
A left wing intellectual, new president of Austria
http://www.publico.es/internacional/intelectual-izquierdas-nuevo-presidente-austria.html
Hijo de una estonia y de un ruso de origen holandés que escaparon de la revolución bolchevique en Rusia en 1917 para radicarse en el Tirol austríaco…
Does anyone else think that the increasing divide between the male and female vote arises out of sexual dimorphism? Men seeking the preservation of the tribe, women seeking the preservation of virtue. That’s a totally ad hoc hypothesis, of course, but I don’t buy that this is a totally arbitrary difference.
I think it is more that many women are afraid of change. And men are more the risk takers in history (good and bad depending on the case). Now that isn’t totally true for every woman or man. But only in a general way.Women have throughout history been the more stable,”stay the course” of the two sexes. Which is why its always so surprising when some women become revolutionaries.And they are extolled in history sometimes more than their male comrades.Who contributed equally to a movement.Women “seem” to more easily, in “most” societies (though not here on Saker I see) accept the MSM and neo-liberal propaganda they are fed through TV and movies. Which is a main reason why,even though Trump got far more women’s votes than expected.Clinton still carried the woman’s vote ,by a lot.
Uncle B,
Another couple of perspectives on female voting patterns.
There is a book about early Australia called Damned Whores and God’s Police. In it they say these were the only two roles open to women in the penal colony. It explains the traditional division of labour between the sexes; the male being able to operate in the world of violence, and deception (business), and the female role as moral guardian so the children are raised right. This might explain the female vote in Austria, that the Left/Ecological candidate represents the moral choice. Normally I would say Europe is a post-modern society, but these days I really don’t know.
The other pattern is the female tendency to vote for strong alpha males in times of danger. You could not have a candidate more vilified as a misogynist than Trump, and yet he scored a surprising number of female votes.
The result in Austria (unless of course the election has been rigged) suggests females did not feel in danger from migrants or economic disaster. They felt safe enough to vote morally, however misguided that trust may be.
Disagree that the female vote is more ‘moral’ than the male.
It’s survivalist and rational.
Women have less wealth relative to men in every society.
Where the clan-based system of Muslim countries affords welfare protection, if at the cost of some liberty, the state takes that role in Europe.
They tend therefore to vote ‘left’ to keep the welfare-state in operation.
Voting for neoliberalism of any stripe – the removal of the safety-net of welfare for the unemployed – is much more dangerous to women as a cohort, as it will open the gates to legalized prostitution (which women are the victims of) .
This is exactly why neoliberals push for its legalization: once you make selling of bodies a ‘job like any other’ there is no moral basis for welfare protection of the unemployed.
Ironically, it was the German Green Party that legalized prostitition in that country as a ‘solution’ to the wave of destitute East European women in the wake of the NATO destruction of Yugoslavia and the collapse of social
protection following the break-up of the Soviet Union.
Currently, Ukrainian women are the main source for Polish and German brothels – for reasons well-known on this site. Namely, the social and economic collapse of the Ukraine.
Capitalism always seeks a sexually-exploitable underclass, mostly women and children – the average age on entry globally into prostitution is fourteen. Disaster capitalism gets ‘bang for buck’ not just figuratively, but literally.
That’s why only wealthy women vote right – they are not the precariat.
Agreed Eimar,
My point about women as God’s Police is about 200 years out of date. I made the point because I don’t actually know what is happening in Europe these days. If there is a revival of Traditional values, you would expect that the gender division of labour will return. It was a weak point, but I threw it in the mix anyway. You have probably put it to bed.
Good morning. Looks like the cafe has gone up a notch; raised the bar so to speak–not a bower yet but getting there, to that peak experience of life.
It’s not light here yet but it’s getting there, at 5 am. In love’s language: it’s not a love world yet but it’s getting there.
The LOve Bower is about the fullness of life, all activities of life, especially the one that got us here: sexual activity; and in the good old, old days communal sex rightly understood, but always it seems misunderstood in our deviant sex cult of culture.
War comes from suppressed communal sex. Guess where we have to go, at least in thought, if we are to stop war?
Sex underlies everything. Our breath is sexual. Our heartbeat is sexual. Every nerve is sexual. The day and night are sexual. The seasons are sexual. There’s the same pattern: rest building up to a climax and then back to rest. Suppress this life and suppress all; and that neglect always comes to war.
The LOve Bower symbolizes this and summarizes all of life. The essence of the bower is the flower; think Georgia O’Keefe: a womam lover’s sexual center. Have this and have all; miss this and miss all–and create war forever.
The opposite of the bower flower is the tower of power; the big dick of patriarchy and its endless wares of war. The power tower that kills and kills until it runs out of things to kill. There is only one thing that can stop this machine of anti-love and that is love.
Love turned around backwards is Evol which sounds like evil. “Vol” means, among other things, the will, volition, voluntary and voluptuous. In Love, the e is a spiral, standing for energy, as in Einstein’s E=mc2. Lov-e, love energy. Love is Energy; sex energy which mass-turn-bates; mass is turned on and abated.
The Love Bower stands for the essence of life. The Love Army protects the Love Bower. The souls of the slaughtered are rising to fight the Empire of Evil which hates communal sex with such a passion that it will destroy all rather than surrender. Under its self-projected God it destroyed shrines, groves, bowers and all their inhabitants: womem, men, children, animals, trees, wells, plants, vineyards and their way of life.
It’s still going on under the cover of lies, bigger and more bitter than ever. But it will end if the Love Army has its way. The planet will once again be blessed with bowers and converted towers. I’m privileged to live in these challenging times. I fail more than I succeed but somehow by the grace of love, I keep getting up after each fall.
Love is in my breath. Each breath is an orgasm of life, a mini-bower of action enough to bring down empires. The Love Cafe records it all, every order and every tip, every hors d’oeuvres and every slip, every smorgasbord and every zakuski board.
Love, love and more love…
Well, we certainly agree on a few things, such a the phallus as dominator, symbolically, at least:
Here is its “erection” at ground zero:
https://youtu.be/NbA89YbWoL8
suitable for children, but they aren’t likely to “get” it yet.
A few things to notice:
1. The new address: ONE WORLD trade center. Cute, huh? NWO gang playing “The Grand Architect of the Universe” (God) themselves, declaring it is done.
2. What came before, now missing: The dual towers (or columns) of Freemasonry, Tarot and Kabbalah symbolizing the right hand path ( light religion, spirit, True Care, the Sacred Feminine) gone. The promoted idea, in symbolism of the exclusive dark reign of the Left Hand path (Patriarchy, Power, Dominance) of the Material World over Spirit, supposedly driven underneath the basements of all three major ritualistic towers (1,2 and 7) destroyed on 911.
3. It is all just too neat, symbolically. Which is why I hypothesize that the entire initial erection of the complex, its demolition on 911, and the current Boner standing supreme, were quite probably all planned from the get-go back in the 60s or 70s.
Previously, Dennis is no doubt familiar with smaller Phalli (the Obelisk in the center of St Peter’s Square, Rome)
https://archaeology-travel.com/street/vatican-obelisk-in-st-peters-square/
Where the high priest of the “Catholic” Franco-Roman Empire/Ancient Egypt tradition erect their power/domination boner to coopt the Love message of Christ.
And the Washington Monument: https://www.nps.gov/wamo/index.htm
with the 4 equilateral triangles at the tip (male, all pointing up). Then you can get into the whole DC masonic urban design where they do the same thing to Abraham Lincoln that the did to Jesus: Make him a fascist dominator gazing directly out at the Big One, with bundles of sticks (fascie) under both chair arms and hands of Lincoln:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abraham_Lincoln_(1920_statue)
An important detail is the left hand: It is clinched in a powerful fist: The Left Hand Path of Male Domination. Abraham Lincoln, seated like a King on a throne (after a Death of the King ritual at Forbes Theatre 4/14/1863….appears to be some numerology in the date, but that’s a tangent to get to later…..) turned into, literally, a fascist governor of the Federal State.
But is the Sacred Feminine making a comeback in Austria? I am sceptical. I would like a fuller evaluation from European Saker commentors that are not Anonymous. For there is also something afoot in this world called the Unholy Feminine, where you guys are the fall guys like Jesus and Abraham L and you are replaced by The State.
And (64 dollar question) is that state “socialist” or in fact NWO fascist?
I’d like to hear from seasoned commenters here from Europe who are not Anonymous, and have a recognizable record of clear thinking on many topics, before I even begin to conclude ANYTHING about the election results in Austria.
Sorry FORD’S not Forbes. Theater.
I love your style. Bear with me awhile. Bear in mind that the right brain controls the left hand. That’s why the “Unholy Femi-nine” doubles down on the unholy mascu-line. Double blowback. Btw, socialist + fascist = evilist. Carpe Diem, Bro 93. Love from Bro 39 (born 1939; died 2039 + 1).
Norbert Hofer from the FPÖ (Freiheitliche Partei Österreich) – the term Freiheiltliche translated means Libertarian, but I don’t know if it has to do with the Libertarian orientation within the USA. He was an astute environmentalist in his party (note, that the elected president Van der Bellen is from the Green party) and at some stage, they have common values. Hofer expressed clearly his disagreement with the welcome culture introduced by Germany’s Merkel and implemented by the Austrian government in 2014. Austria has some 1.8 million immigrants, most of them living in or around Vienna and in the bigger cities. Hofer disagreed with the US-EU trade agreement openly. Furthermore, he wanted to hold a referendum on its membership in the EU if the EU Parliament were to assume more powers or accept Turkey as a member. In Austria are living some 400.000 turks, mostly in Vienna. Guess who voted for him. Such as real left wing party, there is none, the only who resembles with the left is the German Wagenknecht in Berlin.
LazyBum
@Bro93
Hi, although I do not qualify at all (I have no status here, definitely not ‚seasoned‘, just enough to prefer to remain anonymous; my record is probably easily recognizable for those keeping track, so that it can be held against me in due time, not in my favour; my range of topics is painfully limited and my thinking not much better than its topics) I invented an ad hoc nick (HocNic?) just to please you, stemming from a work of literature I have forgotten except this self description of its author: „I was just a lazy bum waiting for a job…“, and the job is to explain the Austrian vote to you.
One possibility for you, o you knowledgeable of German, would be to wait for the night, slip into some anonymous outfit, and visit the otherwise strictly forbidden internet URL
http://vineyardsaker.de/2016/12/04/oesterreich-die-dritte-variante/#comment-4395
for a general overview over what happened (namely, according to its author, a game between the two „opposing” parties and candidates).
As a bonus for doing such a dirty thing you may also find there, at
http://vineyardsaker.de/2016/12/04/oesterreich-die-dritte-variante/#comment-4362
an explanation of why and how our murderous financial system is neither God given, nor eternal, nor necessary, nor irrevocable, since things were – without any effort, „naturally” – so much better before. Someone might be tempted to translate this quotation from
http://www.anderweltonline.com/kultur/kultur-2016/500-jahre-reformation-kein-grund-zum-feiern/
but since you do know German and the others are not interested, this would be a waste of time.
Lazy greetings from Europe
L. Bum
@ Lazy Bum:
No, I do not know enough German to read entire paragraphs or articles. Sorry.
So, I’m not sure of the point of your post. If you think I am an apologist for the present financial system, you are way, way off the mark.
So what was your point?
Sex is our reason to be.
“Sex underlies everything.”
https://www.stephenbentley.info/hands-off-cocks-put-socks/
Yep. Time to grab something else. Love only goes so far.
This week in the Love Calendar is the 50th week of the year, and has the theme of Joy, the 50th card in the love deck and in the Love Tarot deck: the Fool Joker wild card. Here’s a stream of consciousness poem, with the poles of Fool and Fuel, to provide cover for the logic of love. In the good old days, a common expression was “may Love give you joy,” meaning may your sex be blessed with joy. Here’s to Joy upon Joy:
———–
It’s fun to travel and roam
But the fuel of joy burns at home
Live under a thatched roof or golden dome
But make yourself a woven poem
Joy is an arrow like Cupid’s dart
Piercing with love to an inner heart
Singing her song like the morning lark
Making my life a work of art
Joy takes her place in a house of order
She sets her face to what’s before her
Dealing with those who are coming for her
Setting aside those who adore her
Perfect Joy is neither riches nor treasure
Surest Joy is neither feelings nor pleasure
Purest Joy is taken with leisure
Sweetest Joy has nothing to measure
Build her a house and she will come
To be a spouse for everyone
Of all the beauties she’s the sum
For comparison there is none
Behind the pain there’s the shining sun
After the rain comes the beloved one
Under the sadness the inner gladness
Beyond the sorrow her tomorrow
I turn my face to holy prayer
I ask for grace wholly rare
Raise the human race with joyful care
I’ve been fooled so many ways
Right down to my end of days
Fool’s gold never pays
Leave it where it lays
Tell it to me straight and true
I think and feel I know you
But then again I’m not sure
Are you the card where we concur
Or the part wherein I err
Or the heart and soul of my cure
You’re the wild card in everyone’s place
From the lowly deuce to the powerful ace
You walked on all the roads that lead to Rome
In every card of the house I call home
We come together and we break apart
It’s the art and game of your sacred heart
I’ve seldom been brave, rarely been bold
I’ve ever been saved when I did what you told
The letters of your name are the nature of your game
A sacred hymn and holy acronym
Joy is Journey Of Yourself
Just Open Yourself and Juice Of Yoni
You are the Fool and Fuel of Love
You are the top of the house, a consciousness spouse
My greater wife and true Love Life
———————
It’s now 6:30 am and a cool 40 F degrees outside. The dawn is heralding the sun come to warm this cold-hearted war-world. With the Love Army, I think love, eat love, free love, marry love, ex-change love and un-drug love. All this and more for the flower of the love bower, I become a tower of power and throw down the gauntlet to Count Khazar and his mistress, Countess Zioness. Meet me in the finest hour with your greatest power, on the field of life at high noon near the OK Corral. Make my day. May the best woman win. You can play your black-heart queen against my red-heart queen on Mean Street in this extreme dream of a war to end all wars.
Love, love and more love…ooo xxx +++ *** etc energy times constant light-speed=love-speed to the infinite degree all contained in the dot . com communal sex community.
One of your best, Denny.
Full of Love Nest Honey.
Actually, for my money, Denny, your very best was in drama, script Count Khazar. That would be great in at least three acts, the devilish darkness offset by some of these love rifts of yours. Kind of a competition between vulture funds and joyous skylarks, or hummers that are into flower honey, not fake money.
Hail to thee, blithe Spirit,
Bird thou never wert,
That from Heaven or near it
Pourest thy full heart
In profuse strains
Of unpremeditated art!
The counter-point by (was it kinterra??) was also magnificent.
A work in progress seed crystal.
This sort of creation inspires me more than the idea of everyone joyously coupling with no adverse consequences. Less sure about that utopian notion. Sorry, got to report honestly.
Really liked this poem.
Also echo Bro’s sentiments – I prefer your Count Khazar satire to your Love Army ramblings.
But then, like Helen, Isabella and our much-missed Elsi, I’ve never been one to march in lock-step.
And have the ‘scars’ to prove it ;-)
About ‘fake news’…
This is a long story which extends over fifteen years. NATO first attempted to silence those citizens who were trying to discover the truth about the attacks of 11 September 2001. Then it turned on those who contested the oficial version of the «Arab Springs» and the war against Syria. One thing leading to another, it then attacked those who denounced the coup d’état in Ukraine. Now NATO is behind the accusations by a pseudo-NGO that the people who campaigned for Donald Trump are Russian agents.
While Propaganda or Not? does not publish the names of its directors, it does indicate that it unites four organisations – Polygraph, The Interpreter, the Center for European Policy Analysis and the Digital Forensic Research Lab.
– Polygraph is one of the sites of Voice of America, the US public radio and television organisation controlled by the Broadcasting Board of Governors.
– The Interpreter is a magazine of the Institute of Modern Russia, now broadcast by Voice of America.
– The Center for European Policy Analysis is a pseudopod of the National Endowment for Democracy (NED) directed by Zbigniew Brzezi?ski and Madeleine Albright.
– And finally, the Digital Forensic Research Lab is a programme of the Atlantic Council.
In a document distributed by Propaganda or Not?, this pseudo-NGO, born of associations financed by the Obama administration, clearly names its enemy – Russia. It accuses Russia of having been the origin of the 9/11 Truth Movement and the Internet sites supporting Syria and Crimea.
On 2 December 2016, the United States Congress voted a law forbidding all military co-operation between Washington and Moscow. In the space of a few years, NATO has re-activated MacCarthyism.
http://www.voltairenet.org/article194344.html
There’s a caveat to that ‘law’ – that the Pentagon can cooperate with Russia if it is ‘in the national interest.’
So it’s up to the Executive – President-elect Trump – to establish a case.
Who also happens to be the Commander-in-Chief.
Pentagon has to follow his orders.
What better in the national ‘interest’ than the defeat of ISIS?
And all he needs to do is use the net to communicate Ukraine’s nazis – volunteer battalions in receipt of US military aid – demands to get ISIS on board to defeat the NAF….
Surely that’s been archived somewhere?
The History of a staged story: At first, the man walked in with a gun and that was it…now in the BBC story the Muslim man with his family has disappeared and BBC has the alleged gunman brandishing the gun ( a crime) and firing it (also a crime) .
Tacked onto the end of this Corporate media approved fake news is an attack on people who questioned the Podesta e mails with their weird preoccupation with pizza and, of all people, Alex Jones.
No mention is made of “spirit cooking” also in the Podesta emails and the black magician connected quite openly to Podesta and his brother and the three kids in the hot tub available for fun and games.
Little is said about the alleged gunman.
By not bringing Killery and her gang up on rightful charges, Trump has emboldened the forces of evil around them who are mounting all sorts of counter attacks. Trump, mistake #1. You might want to consider indicting someone as a proxy for Killery though.
My theory is this is a practice “staged story” run for something bigger which they are with “guilt by association” going to try to hang on “the alt right”. This was a dry run.
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-38205885
t13
That pizzagate material gave me “the creeps” big time. I’d heard of the story, but had not seen any details about it.
Try http://www.whatdoesitmean.com/index2180.htm
just found this piece on RI about Comet Pizza staged story:
http://russia-insider.com/en/politics/pizzagate-gunman-classic-media-cover/ri17991
Pizza served in a Love Cafe? Pretty sickening if not confusing. I’m not against it because Love goes into the heart of darkness to bring light there. Abuse of children has to be the worst of evil, and sexual abuse the worst of the worst. I’ve often said that sex is where it’s at–both for good and ill.
To stop this evil war machine, we’ve got to address the question of sex radically. If you watch Alex Jones, you know he wants to see the big picture and not get distracted by the psy-op minor side, distraction issues. Why aren’t we doing the same with the issues of war and child abuse?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Djc5G0SXSo
Zhirinovsky Gave an EXCELLENT, Prophetic Speech About Ukraine – in 1998! (Video)
Right now I feel like Alex Jones on election night. Except his voice is terrible, and mine is great.
No, this is not about singing or talking, though. It’s about the gut, and guts.
Nov 8 evening Alex kept repeating how “my gut” (his intuition, the right hemisphere of his brain, the Goddess, goddess fans……and poets) had never failed him in the runup to the election.
My gut (relieved of abdominal bloating, ioan, by an herbal tea….) tells me the results of thereferendum in Italy is far more positive than the election results in Austria.
Sorry, got to run, But at the end of the day I hope to test my gut against informed non-Anonymous Sakerites who are on the job. I have to finish one (job) I started weeks ago, though truth is, I’d rather be here!
Ciao!
Being practical rather than spiritual, I always try to discern if the gut feeling is caused by information that I have received that is tumbling around in my subconscious or due to my imagination. Occasionally (after too many beers) I comment before analysing if it is my imagination or information I have picked up along the way that causes the gut feeling.
Not picking on you bro, just a comment on gut feelings.
The results are probably not very positive for the Italian banking system which is predicted to collapse as a result and require the same kinds of bailouts that have destroyed Greece.
Reinstating the lira in place of the euro as currency and allowing it to find its natural level would help but the EU is unlikely to encourage that.
EU ministers are all saying that everything is fine and dandy, a sure sign of massive problems in the offing.
France, Germany and the Netherlands all have elections coming next year, this ain’t over yet.
The zionazis have taken their war on independent media to the next level.
US Lawmakers Move to Criminalize ‘Fake News, Propaganda’ on the Web
https://sputniknews.com/us/201612051048198226-us-lawmakers-fake-news-criminalization/
“It is easy to see how this law, if passed by the Senate and signed by the president, could be used to target, threaten, or eliminate so-called ‘fake news’ websites, a list which has been used to arbitrarily define any website, or blog, that does not share the mainstream media’s proclivity to serve as the Public Relations arm of a given administration,” Global Research reported.”
The GR original:
US Congress Quietly Passes Bill Targeting “Russian Propaganda” Websites
http://www.globalresearch.ca/house-quietly-passes-bill-targeting-russian-propaganda-websites/5560100
i just love the target list;
Establishment or funding of a front group.
Covert broadcasting.
Media manipulation.
Disinformation and forgeries.
Funding agents of influence.
Incitement and offensive counterintelligence.
Assassinations.
Terrorist acts.
Ach! check out the log in your own eye! This is the US playlist!
The Natoist media have flooded internet – Where is Bana Alabed 7 years old girl?
The 7 years girl who never slept, who was without parents supervision, who was independent minded, who fed herself, who cared about herself, where is?
The Natoist media ask the question and don’t provide any answer.
Why they do not ask Mr. Stoltenberg, the NATO boss or Merkel who imposed sanctions on Syria or Obama who finances the terrorists? They should know?
Perhaps they should ask the ruling classes of the US, the UK and other EU vassal states besides, where the fifty thousand missing refugee children have gone?
Too bad the US is too busy with Zionist mandated recounts and persecuting whistleblowers and too bad the UK loses all its files on pedophiles every decade.
Important video report on fake news by the global corporate media:
http://www.globalresearch.ca/who-is-behind-fake-news-mainstream-media-use-fake-videos-and-images/5557580
So in an attempt to decipher the events in the North Pacific Ocean recently, I did a little searching. Found this:
“Canada defenceless against missile attack but no ‘specific’ threats known: NORAD general”
https:/news.nationalpost.com/news/canada/canadian-politics/canada-defenceless-against-missile-attack-but-no-specific-threats-known-norad-general
This article from Apr 19, 2016 reports that:
“There have been a “proliferation” of such weapons [ballistic missiles] since-then Prime Minister Paul Martin opted not to join the U.S. missile defence program in 2005, St. Amand said, before referring to recent developments by North Korea and Iran.”
“The U.S. spent about 100 billion over the last decade to develop land- and sea-based systems that would stop a limited ballistic missile attack from rogue states like North Korea or Iran. (They would not protect against an all-out attack by Russia or China).”
Turns out Canada also added a little something in the last decade:
“Royal Canadian Navy fires first sea-to-shore precision Harpoon missile”
http://www.cbc.ca/1.3527532
http://news.gc.ca/web/article-en.do?nid=1048499
This took place for the first time in Canadian history during a joint exercise with the US Navy in the first week of April 2016. The Harpoon missile is manufactured by Boeing. Not Lockheed Martin – who I think is responsible for the anti-missile defense systems? And the F-35 is Lockheed Martin’s as opposed to the Super Hornet, which belongs to Boeing??
The article notes that “the 12 Halifax class frigates in the Royal Canadian Navy can carry up to 8 Harpoon missiles each. The frigates, commissioned between 1992 and 1997, are now receiving their so-called midlife updates.”
And wouldn’t you know it… On Nov. 29th, this upgrade to the Halifax frigates was announced as completed.
“On time and under budget: Government of Canada marks major milestone in a multi-billion dollar defence procurement.”
http://news.gc.ca/web/article-en.do?nid=1048499
The CF-18 plane crash was on Nov. 28.
Remember what happened after the “oops” at Deir Ez Zor?
http://theduran.com/did-the-us-led-coalition-give-the-exact-coordinates-of-russian-aleppo-hospital-to-al-qaeda-for-a-missile-attack/
My right brain tells the left, tat he’s committed to theft, while my left brain tells the right, that he’s a liar in his might :
Polarity
Don’t kid yourself with left and right,
The world is not just black and white
The world is wide in scope, in forms,
The world is rich in different colors.
The left and right in our mind
Is there for harmony to find.
The left and right of our brain
They differ, but the scope is same.
The left and right in policy
Are part of human legacy
Today the left is doing right
The right, taking what’s left aside
Left and right hand using monks
Make a difference for the folks
Is there any clarity, or this is polarity ?
Choose the one which suits you better
Take umbrella or change the wetter
For the world is round like ball
And this world is round for all.
Once the right hand on the rise
Then the left hand takes the prize
Then will be the vice-versa
Judgement comes as universal.
In the timeline of our life,
Nothing will be left behind
Nothing will be left untouched
Be it left or be it right.
Very true and beautifully composed.
Thanks Ioan :-)
Left and right
behind our backs
the circle meets
where right and left join
encircling the peasant
extremism….
making right and left as one
my skin is too thin
in this smell
with the grin
to analize the bin
the daily crap
to signalize asap
for daily prize
needs not to be wise
for my daily health
instead I behold
what will become
what’s still in the cold
but in using my brain
to escape the insane
daily crap and shatter
I share my matter
of invincible clout
just by talking about
the invisible ordering
fate-juggernaut
And to share … ready for you to print
prepared for Mundo’s German Tagebuch
The US-Election-Series
http://mundanestagebuch.blogspot.de/2016/12/mundanomaniacs-prognosen-die-serie-zur.html
Oh the café!
I’ve so long been away!
And long is the list
Of all I have missed.
The last café had special flavor
Much to ponder and to savor.
So at last, I hope not least
I offer something for this feast
At tables adorned by Advent rose.
Deepest questions of love were posed.
How blooms our heart as fragrant flower,
A chalice for Love’s sacred power?
Sophia’s name then did appear!
The Rose of the World gave presence here!
Finding here a place to linger,
Open hearts in which to enter.
Oh Holy Mother, Oh Queen of Love,
Of both Earth and Stars above.
All Nature wears your fine apparel,
All life your rare and precious jewel,
Of your womb, soul seeds are we,
When you dreamed we came to be.
We were once your child of grace,
Paradise with a human face.
But we were tempted and did stray,
And cast our glance from you away.
We looked too far with serpent’s sight,
And fell from star to matter’s night.
With serpent brain and spinal form,
We wander o’er the earth forlorn.
Serpent’s science now forces proof,
Holy Creation’s an outworn truth.
Heaven low to earth comes bending.
Light abundant to us sending.
We wrest ourselves from serpents gaze,
An advent of the Heart takes sway.
The soul finds Her as roots do water,
Drinking all She has to offer.
When with devoted hearts we pray,
To Her Creation raise our praise,
Let our words Her raiment be.
Salve Terra we pray to Thee!
Your Holy Earth, a sleeping Heaven
May we through you become the leaven.
k
@ Kinterra…awesome poem …you provoked from me a humble couplet:
The kingdom of heaven is found within
the whole is not the sum of the parts
the spark of the soul, neither angel nor Jinn,
In consciousness sits as light of the heart
Amazing ambidextrous display by ioan. His speed on the light bag, it’s just a blur!
Lefts and rights with blinding speed. I’m too slow for him, I must concede.
I don’t know whether I’m coming or going. No Dennis! I didn’t mean it that way.
It’s more like I’m so outmatched, I dare not even step in this Deadly Poets Ring, or I will surely get my bell rung!
The return of kinterra. The Count meets his match! That’s a show I plan to catch!
The ever humble teranam 13
Under estimates again his output
By double, shuffling in between
A quatrain, calls it a mere couplet.
When it’s actually, clearly two of those.
He’s twice as good as even he knows!
Double trouble, boil and bubble,
Quatrain, couplet, no toil to double.
And so I wander out of this Deadly Poets Gym,
Head home to ponder the terrible shape I’m in.
I can’t even walk a good straight line!
Mundo, beyond all space and time,
Then gives planets and stars a spin…
I can’t even tell you what Universe I’m in!
Austria, Italy, Brexit, Hillary and Trump
It’s some kind of mind continuum jump!
Khazarian Counts and election recounts
Wall Street needs another dead cat bounce,
Hollande is done, Jill Stein’s an opportunist,
Bernie’s burnt toast, Merkel, be the soonest
To disappear, like Adolf Hitler and Eva Braun,
Neue Welt Ordnung, Achtung! Coming down!
The rats are running scared, to escape their fate,
False flag “investigators” to cover up Pizza-gate.
I guess I better get in shape, Cossacks of the Mind,
And try to catch up with you. I’m so very far behind!
Buenas noches! Guten nacht! Spakoine noche,
Peace for Aleppo, Danke Russland, Arrivederci!
I thought I was done, a drained empty cup.
Mind frozen, weary, no energy left to fight.
But the Poet Pugilists are just warming up!
Oh, give me that Love, that Will, that Light!
Spending the time to read all through the cafe, you poem made me laugh Bro. Ambidextrous ioan and .. um Dennis the um.. menace. Reminded me of satires on Bill Clinton I heard years ago where secretaries were fair game, no matter the sex. Perhaps not your intention but… :)
I salute you. This is worthy of Shakes-her-spear. I saw this bumper sticker today: “Love is your soul purpose.” Don’t you love this cafe; it was not the same when you stayed away; now that you’re back it’s a cafe buffet.
Dennis bows to kinterra’s nobler verse,
Not new visitors, my day laborer worse.
The Count (the actor) is down for the ten count.
Leary, the never weary Lover, will ever surmount.
Now, I ask mods to move my longer worser verse out of the way and put it at the end, if they can, to not pollute the nobler air of kinterra, kind, and fair.
Merci beaucoup!
Earth Sister,
Nice to walk back into the Cafe after a short break to a rockstar welcome. And with such a rich offering, no wonder you were missed.
Of stardust we’re made
By maths and gravity formed
But what animates?
Fabulous poem kinterra!
That’s the third one from cafe regulars that is really outstanding.
Thank you!
Welcome back kinterra, and what a comeback ! nice to have you here again.
Whilst I have been down my local pub to see an extraordinary good jam night ..my computer has been invaded by American parasites.
I left it wide open..
I am tracking you.
I am British, and I ain’t thick.
It was my job – you Americans are Morons
I do know how to do computer security..what exactly were you looking for..???
photos of my wife??
Jesus. What is Wrong With You Americans???
You have gone really weird – and you used to be so nice.
I used to really Respect You – I thought you American Guys were Brilliant..
Who did THAT to You?
It wasn’t us British..We really Love You..but Oh Dear..
You guys are not doing too well
You are not making any sense.
You are coming out with all this Bullshit from Washington DC and The Press…
and no one believes you.
That seriously is not good..
You are coming over as Blithering Neocon Idiots.
Can’t you give Dick Cheney and injection or something???
You are seriously not good..
And We in England have noticed.
You are Shiit – You ain’t got any Class
Must Try Harder.
(I know I’m rubbish too – but look at the state of you)
Not good.
“Motorhead – no class”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ubLGdNzvS8Q
Tony
Can’t you give Dick Cheney and injection or something???
This made me laugh – Thanks Tony.
I could add quite a few more candidates for that simple solution.
It would certainly put them all out of our
misery…..:/)
Website Labeled ‘Fake News’ Demands Retraction From WaPo, Threatens Lawsuit
https://sputniknews.com/us/201612061048205420-website-labeled-fake-news-lawsuit/
“In an ironically fake news article about “fake news,” the Washington Post cited a website called PropOrNot, which lists over 200 websites that they accuse of peddling what they term Russian propaganda and other false narratives. The list includes popular news websites on all sides of the political spectrum, such as The Drudge Report, Zero Hedge, TruthOut, Sputnik News, and WikiLeaks.
One of the websites listed was Naked Capitalism, named one of the 25 Best Financial Blogs in 2011 by Time, and listed by Wired as a crucial site to follow for finance.
Naked Capitalism is a left-wing website that tends to be highly critical of Wall Street.
Now, the founder of the site, Yves Smith, is striking back and has published a letter to the Washington Post from their lawyer.
The letter to the Post, written by Moody, was addressed to publisher Frederick J. Ryan, Jr., executive editor Martin Baron, and Craig Timberg, who authored the piece. The letter demands that the article be immediately removed from the Washington Post website and all web-accessible archives, that the newspaper make a “prominent public apology,” and provide for Naked Capitalism to make an equally prominent response in their paper.”
The first site doing what I hope the majority will do. Imagine the zio-gays at the wp getting hit by over a 100 lawsuits at the same time over this smear. :D
You beat me to it Vot Tak, I was going to post on this very topic last night.
As well as the law-suit, Smith has set up a satirical site mimicking PropOrNot.org
– in the interests of ‘truth’ :-)
The first comment on Naked Capitalism to greet this news completely cracked me up:
Make American Propaganda Great Again!
I am sick and tired of this cheap knock-off propaganda that wears out after a couple news cycles. There are plenty of hard-working American propagandists forced to drive for Uber or sell Nutrilife because their jobs have been offshored and outsourced, or as in this case, given to unpaid interns fresh out of high school. Ever since the Dubya-era yellowcake debacle it has been clear that the Military Infotainment Complex is just phoning it in. What happened to craftsmanship and pride in one’s work? The Assad chemical weapons attack story that was supposed to cross the red line was so slipshod that even Obama didn’t fall for it. This is a president who destroyed an African country because he believed Hillary Clinton ferchrissakes.
I’ve had enough and I’m not gonna take it anymore, WaPo, NYT, CNN you’re dead to me, its 100% ESPN2 for me until you guys get your heads out of your recta and back in the game!
E
LOL, that was a class take down. :D
Iran Welcomes Erdogan’s Initiative to Use National Currencies in Trade
https://sputniknews.com/middleeast/201612051048192552-iran-turkey-trade/
“On December 3, Erdogan offered Russia, China and Iran to resort to national currencies in the trade. He pointed out that the proposals were given to the central banks of these countries and had already been discussed with Moscow, Beijing and Tehran.”
The israeli-americans really don’t like it when a country uses currency other than dollars in foreign trade. Such announcements are usually met with invasion or “color revolution” soon after.
Good morning and I mean early morning. It’s now 2:45 am. I woke at midnight after going to sleep shortly after 9 pm. I couldn’t sleep so got up and came over here at 12:30 am. Reminds me of Dylan’s Soon After Midnight:
———–
I’m searching for phrases
To sing your praises
I need to tell someone
It’s soon after midnight
And my day has just begun
———–
Now, mind me, coming over here is not like going from one room to another in a house. I sleep outside about fifty feet from here under a tarp. In this 40 degree temp (currently 45 and going down), I put on three more layers of clothing over my T shirt, and come over here to the motorhome moveable beast and sit down before this typing beast.
This is the second time tonight. I got up at 12:30 am and went back to bed at 1:30 am but could not sleep, so I got up again at 2:30 am and here I am again.
There’s something on my mind other than the advanced lovers, as I call them. For the first time, I fear that my stuff has not passed muster with the mods and/or the Saker. I posted what I thought was an inspired piece on Count Khazar last evening which has not yet appeared. It may be a tech glitch but my paranoid part thinks otherwise. I used very graphic language in the piece which I surmise is the reason for the delay or outright rejection.
My feelings are hurt which is not a bad thing for an inflated ego. I’ve had to do some soul searching. I find the usual police line-up of narcissism, paranoia, inferiority-superiority complex, approval suck, compensation mechanism, self-defeating depression, pride, poor-me victimhood and on and on down the rabbit hole of shadow-land.
In other words, a cry-baby childishness that I decry in the current tantrums of defeated Hillary demoncrats. How karma turns and burns my butt. I wonder what I’ll be when I grow a pair. Oops, in my renewed fear state, that may get me censored.
Which brings me to Bro 93. You protest too much. Kinterra, whoever he or she may be, may have greater sensitivity to the English idiom, and may have honed her or his piece over time. But nobody can best you for “on the run, on the spot” spot-on linguistics and fireworks, fine-works interwoven with politics, video-media savy, history and analytics from the twilight zone; while carrying on a family and business life; not to mention baseball and other sundry topics.
On the other hand, I have lived a rather sheltered life in religion. I may know that area pretty well but my acquaintance with politics, business, finance, military and other non-religious, psychological and personal matters is near absolute zero until very recently, thanks to the internet and this vineyard in particular.
I’m catching up fast but my background is skewed, if not screwed, to say the least. That being said, there are some areas in my curriculum vitae that are strong; in fact, too strong to be appreciated in this depreciated world. Oh, say, like the Love Army or the Love Bower with its communal sex meme.
That’s why I’m disappointed with the censorship of my piece on Count Khazar, if it indeed turns out to be censored for rough language; it may just have been shipped over to the already busy Saker who is too busy to take it under consideration, or it simply got lost. I’m spoiled, thinking I may have missed an opportunity to add to my cache in this cafe.
If I may be blunt, I think Bro 93 runs interference for the silent majority here, who dodge the bullet that the Love Army and communal sex fires, not to mention the God question. It may be a different educational background or it may be something else but it appears that none of my arguments are addressed directly but if even noticed, are delicately shunted aside into some circular file somewhere, like my imagined Count Khazar piece.
This reaction of denial fits perfectly with our culture’s general drift into somnolence when discomfited with unfamiliar versions of truth. I’m placed into the bin with UFOlogists and post-truth minions a la the OED (Oxford English Dictionary) new lexicon listing of “post-truth.”
My defense is from the caption at the top: “stop the war on Russia.” This is the back-prop to all my antics. Millions and billions if we include the dead, living souls, rise from their graves to enlist in the Love Army because nothing else is stopping the war or soothing their suffering souls to allow them to “rest in peace/requiem in pace.” And I don’t forget the slaughtered animals for eating or the slavery pets for human neuroses keeping. See what I mean? Mean ol’ me and my Love Army is “fake news” while Count Khazar is real news, except when he uses incorrect raw language.
But I digress from the IMHO guideline that “only you can see.” So may I disclose and disclaim yet again that what I say is IMHO. I would apologize for hurting feelings, including my own, if it did any good but it’s only a set-up for more of the same.
————
We fight with words now to avoid the fight with guns later. -Stefan Molyneux.
————
Now that I think of it, it doesn’t much matter if I’ve been censored or not. It’s happened to me before; in fact, it happens all the time. So what? I censor others too. Seems to be part of the human condition. I’ve learned from this lesson, or non-lesson, as the case may be; as ioan perhaps learned from his perceived censoring, which turned out to be a misunderstanding, if I recall accurately.
Well, enough panting and ranting. I’d better post this, or I’ll end up accusing myself of censoring myself; and then I’ll really get to hear my underworld shadows come forth to curse and cuss the lovers for their stupidity in blocking my brilliance–Lucifer-like and so God unlike, despite the G-damn human automatic semantics.
PS pre-Post: I think Bro 93 and Bro 39 differ on religion and sex but dovetail pretty well on politics. As always, I stand to be corrected in this cafe community of competent peer-reviewers; and make bold to say yet again: love, love and more love…
–Ojai, California, 4 am PST, in Vulva Valley, Ventura River-bottom, extreme North end of Rice Road–just to situate this meta-story in time, space and herstory; as Saint Ambrose did with Jesus, Christianity and history, a political ploy, it is true or rather tried and true red and blue.
I know Dennis is serious about sex
When he rises at midnight, protects
Its primeval and eternal reputation.
My serious side too, suffers irritation,
At all these jokes I just can’t suppress.
I’ll just have to work them out, I guess!
It’s true. You’re just way ahead of me, beyond the Fool.
I’m just tripping along and chuckling, as a general rule,
One liners and wry reminders in non-stop Fool’s play,
But my serious self wants to assure you: Sleep! It’s OK!
In college one thing that helped me endure was a book of famous quotes. The majority of them were translated from French existentialists, Epicureans, Stoics, Cynics, etc.
Things like: “Nothing is more pleasing than to be considered an idiot by an imbecile.”
But the English quotes were competitively entertaining:
I do not know the Country Gentleman’s name, but here is how he summed up sex, in pragmatic accounting terms, of economically administering his landed estate:
“The pleasure is momentary, the position is ridiculous, and the cost? Damnable!!”
Now, if he were around this Vineyard, the Bro 39 handle would fit him well, having fallen from (3) the Holy Trinity where Love reigns supreme, to (9) the base or beast consciousness which always returns to worship itself, like the number nine, that can’t escape itself, without a great deal of effort, outside Love intervention, OR expense! And for him, That expense of sperm and specie kills the Deal, and extinguishes the zeal, for what is really Real.
Spanish Harlem Incident B. Dylan
“Spanish Harlem Incident”
Gypsy gal, the hands of Harlem
Cannot hold you to its heat
Your temperature’s too hot for taming
Your flaming feet are burnin’ up the street
I am homeless, come and take me
To the reach of your rattling drums
Let me know, babe, all about my fortune
Down along my restless palms.
Gypsy gal, you got me swallowed
I have fallen far beneath
Your pearly eyes, so fast an’ slashing
An’ your flashing diamond teeth
The night is pitch black, come an’ make my
Pale face fit into place, ah, please!
Let me know, babe, I am nearly drowning
If it’s you my lifelines trace.
I been wond’rin’ all about me
Ever since I seen you there
On the cliffs of your wildcat charms I’m riding
I know I’m ’round you but I don’t know where
You have slayed me, you have made me
I got to laugh halfways off my heels
I got to know, babe, will you surround me
So I can know if I am really real.
“If I may be blunt, I think Bro 93 runs interference for the silent majority here, who dodge the bullet that the Love Army and communal sex fires,..(..) It may be a different educational background or it may be something else but it appears that none of my arguments are addressed directly”
I object very very vehemently to this statement – that non of your arguments are addressed directly. It’s a cheap cop out not to mention an out and out lie.
What did I do but address your “communal sex as love” theme? Did I not address it directly? Did I not, in fact, address it with an overly long piece, in order to make sure I got all the relevant points across? And what answer did I get from you?
“My experience has been different to yours”. That was it. Period.
I told you I could not envisage what you meant by “communal sex in the Love Bower”. I asked you to answer me – twice I asked, if my proposed suggestions were correct? Is it, I asked a case of Joe hops into bed with Mary Monday and Sheila Tues night? Does Mary share her favours with a different bloke every night? Or do the entire lot gather together and just take a share in whoever is closest?
Answer came there none. Not a peep.
You, Dennis, are the one who “dodges a bullet”.
You are the one who is in denial, because you wont – or cant’ – elucidate precisely what you mean.
Well, you want feedback, here is mine.
I don’t care about your meaningless meanderings in your imagination, your “Love Bower”. They dont’ mean anything to me, so I just scan over them.
But your correlation of “Love”, the highest, purest emotion and force, the embodiment of all we admire and seek in another, such that we wish to share our inner selves with that other – aligned with the animistic, hedonistic “group sex” you keep going on about frankly just makes me feel sick.
It’s the only reason I entered into discussion with you before. The rest of your stuff I just leave alone. But that was such a travesty of Love to me, that I had to try and understand, to get some understanding from you that you grasped my perception of love, maybe some meeting of minds.
There was none. None to be had, I suspect now.
I read of your multiple gropings and eroticisms and frankly, you make me feel nauseated. I feel as though I need to go take a shower.
To me it seems you are merely trying to spin a philosophy out of erotic fantasies. Well fine, have erotic fantasies, it’s not unusual. But please, keep them to yourself.
That is my frank, honest, thought out opinion and reaction to this aspect of what you write.
And frankly, I think a society which indulged in thoughtless group copulation as you advocate would be much more likely to “go to war” since it would be a mess of people who react to the physical with the physical, with never a moment to consider the ways in which the abstract of Love and other abstracts can be understood, defined and dealt with mentally, not physically.
That’s pretty much my response – and it’s not one of denial but wholesale worship of the sacred thing I call Love.
I’m obviously closer to Isabella in Philosophy of Love, from what I remember of her deep and well-written paper.
I need to go back and read Plato or Socrates. Their School of Athens, whether it was the lone teacher/student Socrates or the Platonic Academy Incorporated seriously took up the topic of Love, and what did they do?
They went and asked a woman! And a very old one, at that, with more wisdom, and less fluttering egoic butterflies.
Now, I favor a kinder, gentler reproach, being an old softie (Hell hath no fury like a woman’s essay spurned!). A link to that essay would be great! Worth going back and reading, or even saving in the Best of The Cafe folder.
Also, I don’t get sick easily. Strong stomach. It’ll take nearly everything.
Plus, Love is not very funny, but sex is!
And ladies can get lusty too: https://youtu.be/TdXKxwKIspc
Thelma and Louise pick up Brad Pitt.
And true to say, I really Love it!
Especially those “Russian Thistles” tumblin’ by. Tumble Weeds, that is. Man that Cold War Mind Control runs deep! http://ipm.ucanr.edu/PMG/WEEDS/russian_thistle.html
But the best line of the movie, IMHO comes after the gals pull a few too many holdups and Brad is held up for interrogation:
Isabella’s Defense of Higher Love Rant has the same line in it as one of Brad’s answers.
Brad, after getting to know the lustiest, as a hitch hiker, and either Thelma or Louise jumped in the sack and screwed like bunny rabbits.
Brad, interrogated later as to whether he got along with the relevant fugitive criminal gal answers:
“You might say we had a ‘meeting of the minds’!
Makes me laugh to this day. https://youtu.be/rJAyBepHdvU
Firstly Bro, thank you for your kind words re my essay. I appreciate them, believe me.
I would like to add re your “Now, I favor a kinder, gentler reproach, being an old softie (Hell hath no fury like a woman’s essay spurned!)” that if my approach in this latter has been hard, and painful, to anyone including Dennis – in fact especially Dennis, then I apologise. It was not my intent I can assure.
It also wasn’t a case of “an essay spurned” evoking anger. :-)
Dennis – indeed everyone – is free to ignore me as they choose.
But not, when I made every effort to communicate and respond to Dennis, for him to ignore my efforts and THEN claim that we are “in denial” and refusing to respond to his words.
My very essay was an attempt to make such a response, and one which, given my very different response to love than Dennis has, was made in a gentle manner. It seemed not to have been clearly understood.
I was, I guess, responding in a “well, here is the response in letters of one syllable ten foot high” as the saying goes. Unambiguous and to the point.
However, it is always possible when being so, to be brutally frank to the point of inflicting pain also.
If I have, I apologise. I have never had, nor have now, any desire to do that to anyone.
I would like to add something to my previous comment above.
Re-reading it, it seems to be that my viewpoint may be taken as that of a sexually repressed or indifferent woman, who cannot share in or understand the desire for sex.
I just want to add that nothing could be further from the truth.
However I am a woman whose understanding of true deep Romantic love is preclusive. Whilst my passion runs as normally as most other peoples, perhaps even more so than most, it is reserved for just one other – the beloved. That is my understanding of Love, you see.
My “love bower” would consist of the favourite place of both of us, a place giving us privacy, beauty, peace to enjoy each other, rest and refresh and reaffirm each other, make our own, private haven / heaven.
With a huge “Keep Out” sign at the entrance :-)
“Your passionate, yet self-restrained comment was in no danger of seeming like that of a “sexually repressed or indifferent woman, who cannot share in or understand the desire for sex”. On the contrary, it is an example of the kind of dignified and elevated discussion this site encourages and strives for. fk mod”
Thank you mod fk for your very kind and re-assuring words. Very much appreciated.
Dennis was a Roman Catholic priest/monk (sworn to celibacy, even if not a particularly diligent practitioner of it) as a young man when most of that age would be working out the overwhelming hormonal drives and eventually coming to some sort of personal accommodation with their sexual selves and their particular place in the wider scope of life.
I am not surprised that Dennis is somewhat obsessed, but I am surprised that he doesn’t get that this is deeply personal stuff, definitely from the realm of erotic fantasy, and not in any way a reliable answer to the many, many woes of the current human condition.
@Dennis, the rest of us either have worked through or are currently working through this one to our own individual satisfaction. No amount of copulation will stop war, we are not bonobos. Activating and using our god-given brains and learning to employ reason, restraint and judicious action has a much better chance of stopping war.
Helen,
I am not getting in the middle of this one :) But I feel a better way of saying what we are saying is we need more of the feminine to avert war, and the masculine to fight it. Civilisation itself is Feminine (cooperation, collaboration, empathy, compromise). But the feminine is a risk in the face of danger (some evils must be faced and not appeased). We each carry the feminine and the masculine inside us, socialisation plays a role in supporting one and suppressing the other depending on gender roles. I have said before, my feminine side is my best quality.
Damn, I forgot to put my name to that one.
@ Earthrise,
Yes, I am thinking that I should have stayed out of this one too, but I know from experience what a struggle it is to make liveable, workable sense of the early indoctrination I share with Dennis. It was an agony for me for many years and I was never even a believer!
I feel sympathy for Dennis but get annoyed at the implied suggestion that we are not and should never aspire to be more than hairless bonobos. That makes a mockery of the truly great things that some humans have achieved through using their minds to the benefit of others.
Life as a bonobo sounds like a paradise to most adolescents but even they will eventually get bored of the momentary pleasures and look for other experiences to occupy themselves with.
Bonobos, BTW, are an endangered species:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bonobo#Sociosexual_behaviour
Helen,
I do like the image of the Congo river dividing Chimpanzees on one side and Bonobos on the other. On the chimp side they form roving gangs which war on each other, and on the other a matriachy forms where the females have multiple partners. It seems the river is a living metaphor for the division of feminine and masculine. Disturbingly, the River is the only thing preventing the chimps from destroying this feminine oasis.
I meant to send this one before. Sadly, I am probably a bit late to catch many readers now.
But this lovely [to me] haunting song from WW2 Russia captures for me something of the meaning of the love between a man and woman. That totally exclusive devotion that captures the soul of man required to be a soldier, as he sits waiting for the next battle. His belief that their love is so strong, it protects him from bullets.
My only problem with this lovely song, and how brilliantly evocative it is with just a few simple chords and words, is that, having once listened, I wont get it out of my head for days. :-)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uj7E5W8g0VM
Thanks Isabella,
This song is powerful in the context of a soldier fighting the greatest war of all time. But for those of us who live in times of peace, I see another truth. This song speaks to me of the power of love to save people.
“Still I believe,
Trusting you, dear spouse of mine.
In these dark nights, only this faith,
Kept me safe from a bullet.”
Yours is the correct interpretation in the original context. But in mine, the bullet could come from a gun in his own hand. Love can save people from the depths of depression and hopelessness. It gives us a future to look forward to, a cornerstone to build everything on; without which can lead to the darkest depths of despair.
“Feeling of joy,
Makes me calm in the deadliest battle,
Knowing, you always meet me with love,
No matter what happened.
No fear of death.”
This stanza speaks directly to my idealistic teenage self. I very strongly felt that nothing could go wrong in my life, my parents could die, I could become crippled, nothing mattered as long as I had her. It is a wonderful feeling, not to be worried about anything. No wonder soldiers hang on tightly to their loves back home, it is armour that won’t stop bullets, but will stop fear and despair.
I’ll exit stage right to a little Huey Lewis and the News:
“Don’t need money, don’t take fame
Don’t need no credit card to ride this train
It’s strong and it’s sudden and it’s cruel sometimes
But it might just save your life
That’s the power of love”
My favourite reconciliation song is the story of a German conscript in the French Grande Armée on the retreat from Moscow. Lovely lyrics, always makes me weep:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l-ClOcxsDDY
Hi there Isabella
“And what answer did I get from you?
“My experience has been different to yours”. That was it. Period.”
Well he could at least responded with something like this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PPiFIejACyg
Or not?
For me. Lot’s of scrolling on the Cafe’ that’s for sure.
Take Care
Kent
Hi Isa; going back a couple of days: are you living in Cuenca? ( my dream if I can ever afford toget there.
And, your patience is probably wasted re above. p.drifter
Hi Plainsman
Yes, I’m still living in Cuenca.
It’s a fascinating spot to spend a couple of years if you can get here. Actually, compared to many countries, it’s not hard if you have a reliable documented income of U$$800 a month minimum. My experience is you need at least U$1000 a month. This is the one that suits anyone who can “retire” as business and work visa’s are a different matter.
The things I have found best are the regular climate, the easy going people, the lovely “Old Quarter” known as el Centro, which is World Heritage listed and currently undergoing a great upgrade, and the mountains and rivers.
The down side for me has been not fully adapting to the altitude, the constant noise and feeling that you are taking your life in your hands whenever you cross the road :-)
It’s probably better for an American here. There are many, but I find them to be very “cliquey”. They only want to know you if you are an American, and preferably from their home state !
I am planning to leave in February, if it all comes off – as I think it will.
I’ll remember the nice things -especially having coffee or lunch sitting outside of a centuries old Spanish house [hand built] which combines some aboriginal aspects, beside the tumbling, sparkling Rio Tomebamba in the Ecuadorean sun.
It’s well worth making the effort to get here if you can.
Good Luck.
I know Cuenca. Pretty place. A half century or so ago there was a German man there that had greenhouses full of orchids.
The air was thin, but pure. The cobblestone streets quaint and picturesque. As were the bridges over the rushing mountain river.
I had the same thought as Helen about the years of denial of sexual nature over-compensating, somewhat wildly. I withheld it.
But I wouldn’t apologize if I were Isabella. It is annoying to have one’s direct offer of serious dialogue ignored. I chide Dennis a bit and take chiding in stride, myself. It’s just that, having invested a bit in defense of Dennis and some of his really great riffs (not “rifts”) I’m not really the one to get much rougher with him.
That defense was of his right brain flourishes, which I contrasted to his left brain logic detractors, with that poem about the Prince of Bores. The problem is, that ANYTHING repeated endlessly as a mantra can become a real bore! Unless you are the one meditating, for yourself, in the privacy of your own thoughts,.
And Dennis, like his Timex watch, can take a licking and keep on ticking. so don’t feel you were too mean Isabella. I agree with mod. You were measured in your displeasure.
Lastly, I know it’s a vapid new age nostrum, but as far as I am concerned why should anyone in the thread have regrets???: “It’s all good!”
Thanks Isa! Oh, I get the Quencahighlife daily for years, all about the expat scene, the wondrous climate, etc. I would have been there already and run into you in the bookstore, but for extenuating events. I’ll make it yet. In this context, as you know I don’t think it appropriate to carry on extensive personal conversations here at the expense of the other readers. I don’t suppose there is any harm in a private contact. Any tootin’ my horn is done at
cutombarbuilder.com at which I can be contacted if inclined; later, P. Drifter(ha!)
misspelled: custombarbuilder.com
Thanks Isabella. I just skip those nonsense guys. Flaming (removed MOD), unless he´s a 12 year old boy. There is supposedly a stage they go through called polymorphous perverse. Basically, they want to screw anything or one. I don´t know, being firmly female. Still, its jejune, and offensive.
a poem: She Fell Down
And Lost Her Crown
Jill, the Shill, laid down with Hill
Our approval thereby blowing
When she did arise
She did apprise
Her reputation no more glowing.
Nice parody!
And Where Is Jack?
Analysis paralysis is left brain poison
For righteous right brain bardly passion.
But please allow me a few points to raise,
Of humble critic’s poetic workshop praise.
The rhythm is truly tripping, falling down,
The choice of Hill, a most ingenius noun,
That covers both topographic inclination
And politically, downhill sexual orientation.
Hillary and Jillary are all Trumped up
In a messy, revealing political pileup,
Which is the six and which is the nine?
Losers’ Love Loop of Clinton and Stein!
laughter…bro 93. Jack hit the road on a 911 call after the “incident” with his crown and all.
Karma call for Hil-Bill
Evil can not reign with impunity forever
riding high with absolute power so heady
using schemes and lies so very clever
On to you now, we united stand steady
your 1000 year Reich lies heavily battered
electronic technocrats apply quick fix patches
The salt of the earth your minions scattered
rides the flood of Truth and opens the hatches.
Cheering your sinking schemes shattered
Most interesting article as RT makes use of Debka file ( Mossad site) information.
https://www.rt.com/usa/369346-mosul-folds-pentagon-ground/
I appreciate the talented responses, and generous good words for my yesterday poem! I really can’t take credit- just some words I overheard when Moon stopped by at Venus. The planetary café speaks reams of rhymes sounding through the starry skies. Oh there I go again. Perhaps the cafe needs a regular support group for chronic rhymers. Hello my name is k, I rhyme in everything I say. It’s been three days now since I spoke a silly rhyme. (Maybe a sex addiction group as well.)
K
Really missed you in the last cafes, interesting questions were discussed, even you Anonymous questioner was there and brought in some exciting issues which, I hope one day will be discussed here. He reminded me two times and gave me even some links to see. I know the subject, but as you know, the cafe goes on it’s own ways according to the actual situations in the reality world. The subject is : Life after death.
What about life before birth?
Came across this fascinating comment by a Canadian, on the topic of infant memories (which, according to neuroscience don’t exist ):
I have very early memories including thoughts before birth. Although, no clue as to how long before my birth, as I had no time reference. Looking back it seems not very long before birth. Those thoughts were like an unspoken conversation with another, higher entity. I had this sensation of being loved and sense of belonging with this entity. The urge to remain where I was at this moment was my only desire. However, I was made to understand that I had to be separated and go elsewhere first. A most saddening realization. I remember trying to somehow make a case for my staying in this all-embracing love. My attempt failed and I accepted begrudgingly. Please, reader be assured these were complete non-verbal thoughts and emotions. None of this is made up or embellished. After this event there seemed to be a period of sleep-like calm. Until the moment of birth. Rather than remembering a series of contractions I felt only, what seemed like, one massive event. This was my calm environment collapsing in on me. Terror and helplessness hardly describes what I felt at this moment. At some point I remember seeing light but nothing was clear. I was being moved upside down towards a left direction. Eventually, I was near my mother and this is where my birth memories shroud over. Other early event memories include nursing on my mother’s breast and falling asleep. Or another time being taken off her left breast before I’d finished drinking, quite upsetting. A hernia operation at six months. The doctor doing something to my belly-button. I looked down and watched calmly until I felt the sensation of pain (turned out to be an incising scalpel) and started crying. I have numerous other early memories. But I conclude with the aforementioned. All of this sounds odd to people that hear my story. To me, these are memories that have always been part of me. I don’t know why I remember while many don’t. Nor do I understand the significance of it. Unless this means that the event of death might be similar in scope and that there is a greater LOVE waiting for us. AND that LOVE is really all we want from the beginning of our existence.
Perhaps existence really is a ‘circle’, spiritually-speaking :-)
@ Eimar
I have researched early childhood memories and found a dearth of studies in that field: basically nothing apart from the widespread assumption that children can only recall events after 3 years of age or thereabouts.
The reason for my curiosity was my own experiences, which I could locate to particular events outside my experience as proof of my age. For instance, I remember my baptism (28 days old) because I remember being in a car and looking at the inside door handle. We did not have a car (1948) and once, forty years later, I mentioned my recollection to my godfather and he confirmed he had driven us to the church. He lived in another city and I had never seen that car again.
I also remember falling down the stairs when I broke one leg at 10 months, and other early episodes. Yet, there is very little research into this aspect of early childhood recall.
I also have pre-linguistic memories from infancy (post-birth, not prior, like the quote from the Canadian).
It’s a fascinating area, as it raises questions -not for the first time – on the nature of memory. It also creates problems for the academic funding of neuroscience, which denies they exist: how to account for their widespread recall then?
My most vivid one is surviving a likely cot-death.
I woke up gasping for air, my face buried in the pillow. It took a Herculean effort to move my face to the side – I could not use my whole body.
So this must have happened before babies ‘turn’ – a well- documented developmental stage in bodily coordination – in the first year after birth.
Also remember the frustration of my constantly kicking legs, and not being able to control them.
If you haven’t read it, there is a good Guardian link where many readers recall infant memories ( back in the days when the Guardian wasn’t entirely trash) – the above quote comes from it.
Here’s the link if you’re interested:
https://www.theguardian.com/notesandqueries/query/0,5753,-2899,00.html
@ Eimar
Thank you for the link. Read quite a lot of those accounts of birth and pre-birth recollections which, by the way, seem more like collective hysteria or groupthink responses. In my understanding, early childhood memories can only be recalled if they relate to a strong emotional reaction to a physical stimulus, such as being spanked by doctor/midwife at birth or similar trauma, yet only one mentioned that. Many of those reports can easily be explained by conscious or unconscious narratives of typical childhood imaginings and fantasies related to pregnancy and childbirth accounts by their mothers of their own or their younger siblings’ birth. And the ones describing images for which a highly developed visual acuity is necessary are obvious mental fabrications. The mind is capable of many games and tricks and reality takes a back seat.
Hi anon.
I only read about fifteen of the posts, as I am not researching the phenomenon in-depth.
I had no impression of ‘ hysteria’, at least not in that sample. ( Collective hysteria is a term used to describe group behaviour that appears irrational – like screaming fans at a rock concert, or ‘moral panics’, ‘witch-hunts’ (Salem) etc.)
These recollections do not depend on any communal situation, ‘hysterical’ or not, or whether the memory can be independently corroborated or not, anymore than any other kind of biographical memory. ( Although their veracity/credibility equally depends on corroboration, in the case of infant recollections, historical context.)
For the same reason, I don’t see how group-think applies – such recollections / are a largely private affair, as with any other kind of memories, especially autobiographical. In fact most are silent on the topic, unless it is brought up: I’ve only mentioned mine about three times in my life. It’s only through the net I’ve discovered how surprisingly widespread the experience is.
Agree that early infant memory is likely related to strong physical stimulus – most of mine are, though not all.
Neuroscience uses a model of memory that is dependent on physical data – ie what is measurable. So it obviously focuses on the brain – there is a long history of this in psychology, somewhat notoriously in some cases like phrenology – the assumption that personality, including criminal could be determined by skull-bumps.
It has increased in sophistication, but is still constrained to use models of cognition that can be measured with current technology/software (even though far from foolproof – a recent meta-analysis found the software yielding a statistically-skewing number of false positives, for example.)
So my original point stands – we are far from having banished the ‘ghost’ – mind – from the ‘machine’ – brain.
@ Eimar
I was aware of “abusing” the terms of art, collective hysteria and groupthink, to describe the tendency of holding a point of view and having it reinforced or encouraged by other participants in a public discussion such as this.
I worked with young children (social worker) and learned from experience their capacity for make-believe. It is very easy in some circumstances and given the right context for adults to recall not only real events but also their interpretations of life experiences as children (including filling in the gaps) and subject them to further adaptations to fit in with their understanding as adults. And we know how witnesses are notoriously unreliable even in straightforward situations.
My opinion is that most of those narratives would not pass a simple objective test, let alone expert scrutiny, especially the pre-birth ones. Anyway they are not passive to any formal truth-testing therefore of no value whatsoever to our understanding of infant memories.
What you guys are talking about are childhood memories – in this case, very early ones. But if I take Eimar’s sentence “how about life before birth” , that can be further “excavated” to the period of before the birth of the soul in the physical body, I mean, we surely come from somewhere and we’re not just chemical parts in a physical body, than later on to die, or return to nothing. If I were to believe that, I would be more than a pessimist, because life would be a nonsense, an accident, without any logic. However, the science is based on logic, therefore, there are many things which even the science cannot explain, yet.
Hi Ioan.
Yes, though the reason for the original post was these lines:
Those thoughts were like an unspoken conversation with another, higher entity. I had this sensation of being loved and sense of belonging with this entity
So the poster’s recall does not seem to be of the womb, which may transmit the subconscious love of his expectant mother.
It seems to be closer to a spiritual ‘recall’, where he is being communicated to in a different dimension: if it was womb-memory alone, I believe it would contain a sensate aspect, which it doesn’t.
Big believer in excluding empirical explanations before accepting spiritual ones: this is what logic is for.
Agree about the scientific method. It is ill-equipped to explain non-physical phenomena. It’s approach to understanding consciousness (mainly through neuroscience) is like a bull in a China-shop – clumsy and fatally addicted to measurement, without ever really addressing the basic question of validity – what exactly are we measuring?
So there is no reason to be pessimistic really – it increasingly looks like the soul pre-exists the body.
Maybe we are all Ideas of a vast Consciousness, and the purpose of life is to strive to be one of the better Ideas?
Just a ‘thought’ :-)
@ Eimar
“…it increasingly looks like the soul pre-exists the body.”
Vary daring statement! Are we going back to Cartesian metaphysics, “Cogito ergo sum”? Perception, awareness, consciousness, feeling and any other psychological phenomena requires a mind and body in which to function. Blessed the ones who think otherwise, especially the crackpots who see the light – the wider the crack the more light they get!
Slightly off topic, it is remarkable that the masters of the universe (capitalists, politicians and supporting intelligentzia) are not worried about the afterlife consequences of their vile actions on earth. Do they know something the plebes don’t?
Maybe I’m just subconsciously Platonic – ‘eternal forms’ and all that….
:-)
Yeah, I guess the MotU have no concern with consequence in the ‘after-life’, or alternate planes/dimensions of consciousness/existence.
But that’s not because they ‘know something’ those of us who are either believers or searchers don’t: hubris seems the likely ‘Occam’s razor’.
In terms of influence on human thought and behaviour, JC, Buddha and Plato far exceed the MotU. Not to mention all those poets, writers, scientists and mathematicians, many of whom had no difficulty accepting spiritual dimensions to existence. Who do we rate more highly, the Medicis or Da Vinci? Rothschild or Newton?
So I don’t exactly rate them: they are materially successful simply because they are unscrupulous. So are the lowest grade criminals, drugged, brain- damaged or otherwise psychopathic whose crimes they parallel, albeit at the opposite end of the consequence spectrum.
The truly psychopathic are already in the Void anyway – death will simply clarify their permanent consignment to the Abyss.
Perhaps that awareness underlies their nihilism..
I’ll add some thoughts here to consider.
Both Ancient religious texts and contemporary esoteric teachings offer images of the soul’s journey out of incarnation as well as the journey back into incarnation. Dante – guided by his Beatrice- provided his experience of reintegrating into the living spiritual cosmos after death. He named 9 regions of hell, purgatory and heaven. There are also the Buddistic teachings of the bardo. I could recomend some other sources as I immersed myself deeply in this subject after a tragic death in my family.
A simple version of the story as I have grasped it, is that our after death experience relates to the quality of consciousness we developed on earth. When we no longer have our physical body we still have a soul vehicle- a body of energy, or a field, that is the result of our earthly consciousness, and the culmination of our deeds when we lived in the physical body. This soul body has a resonance and which then resonates with the one of the various spheres or layers of the spiritual cosmos. We find ourselves after death in a place (non-physical- maybe a dimension so to speak)- that is similar to our resonant level of consciousness. (As you can imagine there are some pretty nasty places- well described by the above mentioned sources.)
Initially after death we pretty much experience exactly what others experienced through us. This can be most grievous, and worse if we were torturerers etc. But, there are angelic and other ranks of beings who help us depending on how permeable we are to their influences of love and light. For some the light is very dim, nearly out, and it takes a long time to resonate with it. For others it is easily felt, and a blessed experience, and the soul is able to progress more quickly. Our life on the other side is very alchemical and great work is done in the presence of the spiritual hierarchies, and the planetary logos- Jesus Christ and Holy Sophia who are sublime beings dedicated to the evolution of the earth and humanity, As the long range plan is to assist them as to raise the vibration of the earth to The New Paradise, we choose to return and cycle through again to work on our evolution and the evolution of the earth according to the Divine Plan .e. The Fathers Will. We long to return and rectify our errors as well as serve the great mission of the earth. On the path of return, assisted by the wisdom beings of the cosmos we choose our parents, our geographical location and weave our destiny in accordance with our karma.
k
I see a major problem in the assumptions most people make about what is physical and what is non-physical, and the nature of reality as being the limited slice we ordinarily perceive or can imagine or detect through our limited instruments. Think of our ideas of ‘reality’ as being the image that shows up on a video camera while the greater reality is everything else in the universe, including many things that don’t even have an image which could be recorded, such as such energy and subatomic particles.
We are like an ant crawling across a computer screen expecting it could understand the source code of a program. Ants may be smart in their own way, for their own reality system, but they are not equipped to either perceive or understand a computer program — and we are not equipped to detect or process the chemical trails and odors that ants interact with.
If we assume that our lives are a small slice of a much larger reality, then we could expect that the boundaries are fuzzy rather than rigidly demarcated, and there will be overlap in perception, and information from unexpected regions we do not consider ‘real’, and also that accessing such information will result in misinterpretation of of it, and problems processing it in the limited biological systems we are engaged in (which would include all kinds of distorted religious and metaphysical concepts and systems).
One stab at explaining this is the old Jane Roberts books, such as ‘Seth Speaks” which text can be found on the web, and, of course, all sorts of religious, mystical, and philosophical writings. My own current thinking as the uiverse can be asid to be made of consciousness, which is the interrelationships of various ‘energies’ and elements of existence — some of which we have some awareness of, and others not. There is no afterlife (or before life) since time, as well as space and matter, are just ways we perceive and conceptualize existence, according to our personal context of beliefs, experience, and self-identities with memory streams, at various bodily and cerebral levels and systems.
We dream, but the dreams, usually forgotten, are just a small slice of our conscious and unconscious lives.We hear noises in the night and incorporate them in dreams, in strangely shaped ways, and don’t wake up. The dreaming self does not understand what the sound is and means until we begin to wake from the dream.
@ Ioan,
Here’s my life after death story:
I spent several weeks in a coma on life-support with total organ failure two years ago and remember some very vivid dreams, an alternative existence or hyper-reality, occurring while I was out of it.
Most of the time I was firmly convinced that I was in the cargo hold of a ship in the North Sea, along with the doctors, nurses, and paramedics attending me. I knew the regulars by name although my mental pictures of them while unconscious didn’t tally with what I saw of them when I finally woke up. It was really the ICU of a top London heart hospital which explains the constant medical presence woven into the dreams.
What I do remember most is the intense anger I felt when I started to come out of it and an equally intense resentment of the medics bringing me back to reality. I was on all kinds of drugs along with morphine and fentanyl so reality didn’t have much appeal at the time.
I did have lots of visits in the following weeks from mainly (catholic) Philippine nurses from all over the hospital wanting to know what I had experienced while I was ‘dead.’ I consider myself agnostic so was not able to tell them what they obviously wanted to hear but I did feel a complete and peaceful acceptance of my odd situation prior to the anger I felt at coming out of it.
I also had a moment of pure, heavenly bliss when I was finally allowed a 10ml sip of water to drink. Nothing before or since has ever tasted finer to me.
Good that you have been in good hands and now you are here to share your experiences. By the way, the so called near-death experience is not too frequent, but they exist and they have nothing to do with the faith or religion. Everyone’s experience is personal, there is no common death, nevertheless, there are many similarities in the perception of that “other world”.
Hi ioan I responded to this thread on life and death, but do not see my post. Too esoteric maybe? i tried not to be. Any hints about it mod?
k
Dear kinterra, your answer is here and is exactly what I expected to her from you. You know, I am 65 but these things interested me since my early young years. I had the luck to be born in a family and a region where these things were openly discussed, beside going to church on Sunday with my grand pa. Later, I had a good old friend who was an Orthodox priest, and he also accepted the idea of reincarnation as natural. I’m not gonna enter in details, but my life experience and observations have proved the existence of what is being said as “karma”. I don’t know why people are afraid to talk or even think about the immortality of the soul. What do they gain or what do they lose ?
It sounds like you grew up in the kind of environment I romanticize about. Romania I remember? I chose a Romanian blouse and skirt for my wedding (always a little out of sync with my American (lack of) culture.
No one ever taught me about reincarnation and karma. It was purely intuitive. I meet many children who speak about reincarnation, angels, and even karma. At a recent funeral a 7 year old child said to me. “It makes me mad that people say he is dead? He’s not dead! He is in a different land and he will come back some day.”
Not sure why it doesn’t resonate with others. Not wanting to see the whole picture? Unconscious avoidance?
k
An article I read mentioned the GOELRO plan the other day. Which was the Soviet plan to bring electric power to the entire USSR. As Lenin said “Communism is Soviet power plus the electrification of the whole country”. I thought it would be interesting to see how that plan turned out. In 1913 the entire Russian Empire (which at the time included Finland,the Baltic States,Moldova,and much of Poland) produced 1.9 billion KWh of power. Under the GOELRO plan the USSR in 1940 (without those other areas at the time) produced 48.0 billion KWh. Only part of the enormous industrial progress accomplished at that time. I strongly doubt the World had ever seen the like of that before.
And, all that just in time (1940) for in the year that followed, the operation “Barbarossa” begun. That industrial potential had been crucial in the defeat of fascism.
Very true.
Western supremacists have to face the unpleasant fact that the Soviets and the Chinese accomplished in a few decades’ time what took the bloody West 500+ years of global enslavement, looting, and mass murder to achieve for its home constituencies. Stop the West’s immiseration and destruction of the planet and we shall see what remains of the West afterwards.
@ Nussiminen
“the Soviets … accomplished in a few decades”
When people are united and bound in an ideology of co-operation for the common good they are capable of unimaginable feats. In the SU people worked overtime and on Saturdays unpaid to cut 5-year Economic Plans to 4 years and even less. Without their selflessness and generosity the country could not achieve the industrial potential to defeat the fascist aggression unleashed by the “Allies” through their manipulation of Nazi Germany.
But it was not decades. The New Economic Policy (NEP), which basically was getting the country on its feet after the civil war without significant economic change, ended in 1928 when the Politburo realized that a drastic departure from the capitalist mode of production was necessary to speed up industrialization. Under the NEP the kulaks (landowners), industrialists and traders became the hated nouveau riche Nepmen.
So, it took only 12 years for the SU to build its huge industrial capacity almost from scratch (they liberally infringed copyright and patent laws though) just in time to defeat the – let’s be candid – Western menace. Putin is taking much longer already!
I read (in translation in his autobiography) Marshall Zhukov’s account of the total revamp and mechanisation of the Red Army after the onset of Barbarossa and culminating in the battle of Kursk.
It was an incredible achievement in two short, beleaguered years, going from largely horse-drawn transport to the kind of air-power and armour superiority that turned the tide.
The group ‘ Gefira’ monitored ships sailing between Libya and Italy for two months. They were linked to a range of NGOs, human traffickers, smugglers etc.
More than thirty thousand migrants were brought illegally into Italy at that time, proving that the ‘ crisis’ is not only manufactured, but is organized on an international scale:
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-12-04/something-strange-taking-place-mediterranean
As you know, we’ve been told that a NATO naval task force has been sent in the Mediterranean to stop the human-traffickers and smugglers. These kind of things cannot happen without their approval or even help. Somebody has some responsibility up there at NATO Headquarters, or else… What else ? ..the orders are given from other places to achieve their plan.
I don’t know about your post. Please try sending again. Mod
@ to whom it may concern:
I still haven’t slept since midnight. I just returned from Ventura by three different buses (six if counting coming back) to see the dentist for an adjustment on my denture. I agree that this has no interest for anyone other than myself, so consider it talking to myself. I read down to ioan’s post at 9:17 pm.
I appreciate everyone’s discussion of love and the generous feedback given to me personally. I take it all under careful consideration and am grateful for the time spent. I want to read it over again after I eat and get some rest.
My preliminary honest evaluation of most of the comments on love and myself is that the education of their originators has been sadly neglected. Like I said, this is an initial judgment which may be modified upon a second reading.
Again, I thank you most sincerely for your honest thoughts and feelings. You further my own education which also has been sadly neglected. This cafe is awesome, and if I get a response to what happened to my missing Count Khazar short, short story, I will consider it even more awesome.
Love, love and more love…
“what happened to my missing Count Khazar…”
Before being of any help in this investigation, perhaps you may consider a detailed description of the man to see if we have met him by casuality?
I am seeing you talking about these Count Khazar an Countess Zioness and, honestly I am lost… having no clue who you could be talking about.
Dennis, I sent your post about Count Khazar to Saker for his opinion. You must be aware that the language you used was excessive. This is a site that purports to be one of serious consideration and discussion regarding the politics and military aggression of the American West on Russia. There are a variety of people who read at and write here. Many would find your less than appropriate for mixed company language very offensive. I am not altogether certain of how Saker feels about such things and this is why we have this system. Mods who are not sure of how acceptable or “OK” a post is sends it to Saker, and he has the last word. I felt that way regarding your post, so I sent it to Saker. If it doesn’t appear, it means Saker decided against it and deleted it. There is no further discussion at this point. mod PS
Thanks for sayin’, Mod PS. By now a likely lot would be pleased if the self appointed poets society would get their own amateur hour website and stop wearing out this one. I know I am not alone.
@ plainsmen
Yep, I agree.
http://www.love-&-compulsive-poets-without-real-audience-at-the-Saker.com??? :)
Sorry guys, I’m coming here for info & intelligent discussion. My brain is creating enough poetic buzz & noise each & every day…
Peace
I’ve done a scrolling of all the actual threads on this blog, and found no comments by you plainsman and by you Phil. I don’t know what satisfies your curiosity. Well, probably you are mostly readers for a while and nothing to say, for a while. It may change of course. Maybe many readers feel the same, but there are many very captivating threads and they are changing constantly, thanks to the Saker and contributors. If you may write a poem I will welcome it, you see, I’m interested in many “intriguing” questions of our days we live in. The ball is round and the garden is big enough. Please take that in consideration.
Well if you found no comments how do you know my name? Why do you need to know what satisfies my curiosity? Am I required to write poems to avoid opprobrium from you masters? I have been here for years to learn about events and crimes of the scummy empire, certainly not to bore a public forum with a lot of egotistical autobiography or rambling I hope to be entertaining.
I found your name just above. No, in fact I’m not curious, you’re free to choose the subject for comment on it. Again, no, I’m not a master, neither in poetry nor in prose, just “master” of my own life. I am here to learn too, and to share my past experiences and my views on recent events, as I see them. I think no one read an autobiography from myself, it would’n be entertaining.
I have said before, this space is for us to make what we will (under moderation). If there is a lack of intelligent conversation, start one. If the more metaphysical stuff annoys, scroll past. They have studied birds that swarm, and there is no leader. The group decides second to second where they are going, reading and interacting with each other to decide a common course. Democracy in motion, a little like this place.
Ironically, some commentors seem to kind of hope that the scummy Empire will continue, so they can continue to peep in on its evil doings, for a long, long, time.
The problem with that is that it becomes a sort of political pornography too ooh and aaah and tut tut over, as a continuing habit or even addiction.
The issue of poetry and culture more broadly can actually be much more strategically effective than just following the nitty gritty dirty fight. So, IMHO, properly viewed this (like many , many dichotomies and dialectics) is not a matter of Either A OR B, make your choice.
No thanks, I’ll take BOTH. And I’ll explain why that is a more serious choice, strategically, down at the bottom, where this text will widen out with a new comment, instead of a reply.
Realpolitik by definition is devoid of morality and humanity. But this is where it falls down, as we discussed at the top, the pen is mightier than the sword. The Empire has been self-hobbled by Western morality (thankfully); I find it delicious that all their propaganda about “spreading democracy” and “Responsibility to Protect” in the end only highlights their own crimes. Fake news, my god I still laugh at this one, there hasn’t been real news in the West for 200 years! By using this propaganda line, they only expose themselves.
Part of what brings us here to The Vineyard is that we have seen in the Russian response the call to return to a legal and moral world order. Now the world has never been either, but as I was saying above, your own propaganda in the end brings about what you are trying to prevent. The Café has a Feminine flavour for a reason, because it is sadly lacking in our international discourse. I suggest the people finding the tone of the Café to be jarring are trying to resist the call of their own Goddess. There are multiple forums above to deal with dry geopolitics, here it has developed that the conversation centres around moral issues, which I say is the correct reading of the world today. The moral vacuum is what has turned everybody from the West. As I wrote in my first post here a few weeks ago, we are sitting at the Chestnut Tree Café at the end of 1984, derelicts from an old order trying to keep the flame alive.
Or to borrow from the Black Eye Peas, “Where is the Love?”
On the Love kerfuffle–some wisdom from the Sufi poets….
Who Can Hear the Buddha Sing? ( Hafiz)
“Hafiz, tonight as you sit with your young students
Who have eyes burning like coals for the Truth,
Raise your glass in honor
Of The Old Great One from Asia,
Speak in the beautiful style
and precision wit of a Japanese verse.
Say a profound truth about this path
With the edge of your Sailor’s tongue
that has been honed on the finest sake.
Okay, dear ones, are you ready?
Are you braced?
Well then:
Who can hear the Buddha sing
If that dog between your legs is barking?
Who can hear the Buddha sing
if that canine between your Thighs
Still wants to do circus Tricks?”
Check this out, the peso ring busted in Canada was international; it was called azovfilms. Does´t that ring a bell? Azov? This stuff is too creepy. What has the world come to?
Peso ring? Really had question-marks flying all around my head with that one. Pedo ring… got it.
Oh yeah, here´s the link; http://tapnewswire.com/2016/11/nearly-400-children-rescued-348-adults-arrested-canadian-child-pornography/
Thanks for this information.
I suspect it’s just the tip of the iceberg.
I wonder how many of these children were of Ukrainian provence?
And if the perps are connected to the Norway ring?
@ Moderator PS and Saker
Thanks for responding by words and silence to my query about the missing Count Khazar piece. The mystery is solved and I feel satisfied.
@ To whom it may concern
Relax. My gentle chiding and turn of phrase: “education has been sadly neglected” was a test to see who has a sense of humor and who does not. So was my Count Khazar piece.
I felt very joyful when I wrote both, a good sign of a sense of humor and an adequate education. The two go together. If I don’t have one or the other, I will not understand what is going on, and will resort to hurt feelings and some kind of a temper tantrum.
I fell into both traps myself when I received the feedback I did. I’m not immune to empire’s emotional tricks. But after a visit by my son, eating a meal and sleeping three hours, I have recovered. I can appreciate the joy, humor and educational process of love.
Please do not misunderstand. The Empire of Evil is extremely cruel. Its education has been sadly neglected regarding genuine love and it has no sense of true joy expressed as humor. It rules by suppression of free speech and enjoys sick humor.
There is a tradition, now suppressed for the most part, that Jesus laughed on the cross because his love protected him from suffering, while those who lacked that kind of love saw only the suffering, which was actually in themselves.
The Love Army and the Love Bower is about stopping war, a very serious business. It operates from a deep education and a joyful sense of humor. Those who are lacking in those qualities will miss the whole point and react in various defensive ways.
If we miss the information, then love must give us the lesson, which can be quite traumatic. Love is not just Joy; she is also Justice. This happens to be the week of joy in love’s natural calendar. Synchronicity and serendipity is part of joy, as well as emotional intelligence.
I stand by my judgment that we (please note that I include myself) are brainwashed by patriarchy, and therefore lack education and joyful sex-love. I think this Count Khazar episode and the associated misunderstandings and non-conversations prove the point.
Jesus could only speak directly to those who were intelligent enough to understand what he was saying and had joyful love in their hearts. To the rest he used parables, well, like Count Khazar ones.
We either get it or we don’t. He is a “sign of contradiction.” He knew that sex is where it’s at; it divides the men from the boys and the jokes from the joys, as well as the pearls from the girls.
The Love Army and Love Bower can go on and on but what’s the point if it’s “throwing pearls before swine.” The bores will only end up crucifying the messenger and their savior. It’s an age old archetype that keeps repeating itself until we learn what real love and joy are.
Thanks so much for being here. Like She’sus, I love you no matter what you think or feel about me. When asked about suffering, s/he replied “It’s necessary.” That, and “Jesus wept” are said to be the shortest statements in the Christian story. A much earlier version was that Jesus said suffering was not necessary which he demonstrated by laughing on the cross; and that he wept with joy in the Love Bower of his time.
Do we see the point? Do we feel the joy?
Love, love and more love…
@ Dennis
I think we all (I mean the ones who read it) enjoyed the Count Khazar piece – arguably your best composition where your literary flair competed with erudition and subtle turn of phrase to entertain us, and for which I am most grateful. However…
Trying to discover the annual budget of the ICRC is more difficult than breaking into Fort Knox… Maybe they have it on Wikileaks. 85% of funds are from “governments”. The fellow who heads it, one Peter Maurer, has managed to increase its budget by 50% since 2012 when he took command. A facial analysis shows his left eye bulges slightly for whatever significance that may or not have. All in all, he sounds like an “operative” of the NWO–certainly has the C.V. Here is an excerpt from Wikileaks:
In 1987, Maurer entered the Swiss Diplomatic Service (Federal Department of Foreign Affairs), where he held various positions in Berne and Pretoria, before being transferred to New York in 1996 as Deputy Permanent Observer at the Swiss Mission to the United Nations. In 2000, he was appointed Ambassador and head of the division in charge of human security at the headquarters of Switzerland’s Foreign Ministry in Berne.[2]
In 2004, Maurer was appointed Ambassador and Permanent Representative of Switzerland to the United Nations in New York. In this position, he endeavoured to integrate Switzerland, which had only recently joined the United Nations, into multilateral networks. In June 2009, the General Assembly elected Maurer Chairman of the Fifth Committee, in charge of United Nations administrative and budgetary affairs.[3] In addition, he was elected Chairman of the Burundi Configuration of the UN Peacebuilding Commission. In January 2010, Maurer became Switzerland’s State Secretary for Foreign Affairs, a position he held until he was elected President of the ICRC.
Commenter ‘the pair’ posted this link on the ICRC thread, scroll down for funding details:
https://www.icrc.org/eng/assets/files/annual-report/current/icrc-annual-report-financial-overview-2013-eng.pdf
thank you Helen. It’s the usual suspects: Top donors US then the UK, Switzerland at half as much then EU as a poor country cousin 4th and then the amounts taper off dramatically.
I just saw on my Yahoo account that Trump cancelled the new Air Force One planes. Sometime ago I got the message for Trump “not to use airplanes.” Now I understand what that meant. I think the message still is to change planes randomly and frequently. The enemy is desperate and air-borne objects are vulnerable, a deadly combo, Secret Service notwithstanding.
Some time ago I put myself in the shoes of the powers-that-be that want to attack Russia, and looked at what could be done to put things back on track. Having the presidents plane downed over or near Russia in an MH17 type event seemed the best method (if possible) to put the US population and “western world” on a war footing with Russia.
Soon after that I read, I think in the Duran, that Trump was planning on traveling to Moscow soon after inauguration.
So perhaps some merit in your premonition.
I followed the events of Julian Assange in Sweden almost in Real Time. He intrigued me, from when I first became aware of him, which was sometime before he went to Sweden. Not only were The Tweets of the two girls involved – almost immediately available and translated into English ( I don’t do Twitter, nor Speak Swedish ), and almost everything that happened was also reported in Aftonbladet a Swedish National Newspaper
For the Americans to get involved 3 months later, and try and totally change the story was completely ridiculous.
I retain my doubts about who if anyone Julian Assange was/is working for, but he most certainly was not guilty of rape.
Julian Assange, maybe almost exactly as Craig Murray describes him.
I have never met either of them.
I have met loads of Americans, and generally liked them, but just because you are an American, and maybe work for the CIA,NSA,Pentagon, (whatever) you cannot rewrite history 3 months after an exceedingly well documented event (when the testimonies in detail of all concerned have already been published) and accepted by all parties.
Such Americans just make themselves look incredibly arrogant and terminally stupid, whilst causing enormous grief, to those involved for no sensible discernible reason except to terrorize the innocent.
Tony
It seems, that VVP has red lines, which he is not willing to cross. In this situation, even the future S600 will not help. Looks like Vlado made some deal with the Tribe (from Khazaria, of course)…
https://www.rt.com/news/369501-israeli-rockets-strike-damascus-airport/
Any helpful perspective?
“And the current Mars, the four-colored so to say, keeps on with his unexpected storm in the wilderness to secure rooms for human civilisation in the spirit of the scooper mirrored by plants and animals, rivers and mountains of Taurus.
To whom this doesn’t matter
and cannot matter
is the market
which is why the market
has to be dismissed out of political
responsibility like in Russia
and China
while the American State will
retain it’s fatherly respect not before
having smoked the respectfull
pipe of truth in tipies sitting on the earth and
under the sky of the American continent”
so far the bottomline underneth this week’s heaven-Earthly midweek-scoope
http://astromundanediary.blogspot.de/2016/12/12.html
teepees
Glad to help with North American if you’ll help me with German. LOL.
for the astrology aficionados ( OK to use that word?): energy of the mercury retrograde coming up mid Dec.
http://darkstarastrology.com/mercury-retrograde/
Dear MOD, (no need to be published), is there a shift change, that the comment’s approval takes so long?
Thanks and bless you for your selfless contributions to this blog!
Hugs
Thanks for asking. There is a shift change, plus I had connection problems at my end. – fk mod.
I would like to make a comment about b – The guy who runs the website Moon of Alabama (I think he is Brilliant).
“Russia Today Plagiarizes Moon of Alabama – Which Is The “Russian Propaganda Outlet”? ”
http://www.moonofalabama.org/
Well, that is because you are The Best..I read you Every Day – even more often than The Saker..
He probably never realised he is so good..and didn’t realise that Russians?were copying his words almost verbatim…without hardly any acknowledgement…
I think you Russians – especially RT – should send him a few Roubles…
Meanwhile I see this on Zero hedge
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-12-07/purge-we-all-knew-was-coming-shutting-down-extremist-content
It looks rather like an Avatar I copied -and still works on Discus – though I rarely use it – sometimes on Truthdig…
Its a still I took from this video of an American Band…It’s just that I really love the song.
The band are called Tool..I don’t even know the name of the singer – but plagiarism is endemic to art, music etc – Quality. If someone is copying your work – then you know you are Good even if its just your (well his) image.
“Tool – Hush [hq – fullscreen]”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EF_WKwbueG8
From wiki
“Tool is an American rock band from Los Angeles, California. Formed in 1990, the group’s line-up includes drummer Danny Carey, guitarist Adam Jones, and vocalist Maynard James Keenan.”
Tony
I think especially at times like these, you should write as honestly as you can. If you can’t write the Truth then you are nothing – and you don’t have to sign it with your own name and address and details and political affiliations and details of the names of your children,grandchilren, neighbours, your telephone numbers -your contacts your emails, your friends and your favourite pubs..
But you can if you want loads of Americans coming round for an education…??????
Meanwhile I just wrote this (sorry if it’s boring – I try my best) .. you don’t have to publish it. (ask Scott – he’s got a sense of humour)
I don’t know if Julian Assange ever read it, and at the time, I didn’t know (so far as I remember) that Anthony John Hill was in Wandsworth jail at the same time..but I used to drive past Wandsworth Jail every day for years – 10 years before…to my job in Fulham…
I did not know if Julian had any support at all..when he came out of jail..
But I thought – well I’ve got a big house – and a spare bedroom – and he is obviously technically brilliant – and probably a really nice man…and I thought he would get on really well with my son – who still lives at home and runs his own (nearly 10 years after).
I have never mentioned my name – nor the name of my son’s business – but of course I understand that no one is completely anonymous…
But I did make the offer – via a very popular website..
Julian can stay round our house..
Well he could then 6 years ago – and so could have Craig Murray…if he had got the job as MP
but its a bit full now…
Same house, same place, but the kids are all back now – and live here at home..including our Grandson…
So whoever it was put him up in a big Mansion house in Essex..
It reminded me a bit of a Festival we went to – a couple of years before – Eastern Haze
I always thought he was a good man.
But someone has to give Julian Assange Sanctuary
He didn’t do anything wrong.
I reckon he’s a bit of a hero to be honest.
Tony
Count Khazar Returns
Count Khazar and Countess Zioness sat at the dinner table in the seventh underground level bunker, in the Transylvania mountains.
The Countess traced arcane symbols on the linen tablecloth, lost in thought. She raised her eyes, narrowing them at the Count. “Stop biting your fingernails,” she snapped. “I have everything under control.”
“Control you call it? I put you in charge of that hag, Hillary, and you don’t deliver.”
“So we go to plan B.”
“Trump?”
“Who else, since you squelched Bernie? Don’t say I didn’t warn you.”
“I can control Trump.”
“You and what army?”
“I don’t need an army. He volunteered.”
“You made him a deal he couldn’t refuse?”
“He could have turned it down but he didn’t like the consequences.”
“Uncle Abe doesn’t like what’s happening.”
“You can tell your uncle to mind his own business or I’ll tell the tribe to sic him.”
“You better watch your tongue. The walls have ears.”
From the top of Dracula’s Castle, ten miles to the south, the Love Army’s reconnaissance holographic unit was testing a system.
The Count reached for his fork and his wine glass fell over.
Countess Zioness jumped back and shrieked, “And you call me out of control.”
“I didn’t touch the glass,” he said with intensity. “Must be that punk Putin up to his old tricks.”
The Countess frowned and picked up a bell to call for a servant. A butterfly fluttered out from under the bell. “What the hell,” she muttered, “was that?”
“What are you talking about?”
“Didn’t you see it?”
“What?”
“The butterfly.”
“Get hold of yourself, woman.”
“I think you’re right about Putin.”
“He better shape up or I’ll start ringing the Kremlin bells at full moon again.”
“He’s the man. Jealous?”
“He’s low life street. I made him.”
“Yeh, and he played you good.”
“A cool triple agent. I like that. He’s mine just like Trump.”
“Tweedlede Dee and Tweedlede Dum,” she sighed.
A servant put on a fresh tablecloth and bowed silently.
The Countess rose and threw the napkin on the table as if it were a gauntlet.
The Count stared at her intently. She was a lioness he could push only so far, at least until he had Uncle Abe cornered.
She quipped, “The princess visits tonight. You better keep your clothes on.”
“Something you never learned how to do,” he taunted. He loved her look when he stung her.
“I’ll decide how things will be,” her eyes shot back.
He didn’t blink. “Think what you want,” he said vaguely. “We’ll see.”
He rose and opened the door for her but his mind was on the princess.
——————–
I liked the lost version better but this will have to do.
Fun read.
Much moreso than the Love Army’s dreary marches….
You’re worth reading again Denis (yep, repitition sends most running for the hills, me included. I’ve been scrolling past ‘Leary’ for a while…)
Look forward to next installment.
Dreary Leary you mean? You should have seen the first version. It would have burned the cafe down. The angel moderators saved the day and Saker made my day. Cheers. I’m heading for Dreary Lane on Trump’s airplane.
Quite a few years ago I was part of a group doing artistic stretches. I played a butterfly with a crude costume and did a dance, not quite Madame Butterfly but I did have bells on my ankles. While twirling, I lost my balance, and then something shifted. I felt myself floating gently to the ground in slow motion. When I came to, I was laying on the rug as people rushed in to help.
I gleaned from that experience that a group of people with a common purpose can shift staid appearing reality. Love is a malleable, shifting, vibrating, swirling dance of energy and information, not unlike a butterfly newly born from a cocoon. If we had a common vineyard vision, we could stop war and start who knows what?
Sometime after that butterfly flight, I wrote this poem for the Sacred Sphere week and holy card. I had forgotten it until reading it this morning.
—————
The Butterfly Dance
The butterfly danced
Scattering gifts
Of hearts and words
To all those who were around
Enthralled by the dance
The jangling bells
The colorful costume
With waistband and headband
Wondering what it meant
The butterfly stopped
In the middle of the air
Time slowed down
Space slipped
Every word was heard
Clearly, simply, purely
Its flight resumed
It came to earth
Safely, lightly, surely
The butterfly danced
Its heart out of the circle
—————
Now I remember more. We gave gifts of little red hearts with messages writ on them. And there was an exercise where one would stand forth and the group would address words to him or her, all in unison, negative ones and then positive words. It was all one jumble of voices where the words were indistinguishable; except for a brief moment when time seemed to slow down to a crawl, and certain words jumped out all by themselves and were clearly heard. Strange but true. Again the strength of a group in synch to change vibrational mass. What I play at sometimes does appear later in another form. I sort of became a butterfly by playing one.
Dreary Leary, we Aussies love self-deprecating humour :)
The Butterfly is a powerful metaphor; graceful, fragile and beautiful, the result of transformation from a previous earth-bound form. There is a line from Sting’s “King of Pain” which evokes this image for me: “A butterfly caught in a spider’s web (that’s my soul up there)”. If I could draw, I see the next frame of this picture, the butterfly soaring up out of the trap, the spider shaking one of it’s legs in a bitter fist. Sorry mate, I did let out a small smile at the thought of you gallivanting around in your butterfly wings and anklebells. Your epiphany sounds important, moments of clarity are rare. And thank you for sharing, wisdom is learnt from others.
I was brought up as a Roman Catholic, I gave up Religions and told my older brothers and sisters and my Mum and Dad – that I wasn’t going to Church anymore for deep reasons (I fell in love with a girl in my class at school) and confessed to the priest absolutely everything I hadn’t done ( I was much too shy)..but I definitely want to – and maybe she did..but we were both just 15 and came home on the bus together from our school…
Our Lady’s..
But now, I was 16 and we had both gone our seperate ways…but I now had a motorbike (mty older brother’s BSA 250 (which he said I could have if I found and rebuilt all the bits – which I did – with the help of my Dad)
My wife has broke her leg – she got run over by a car 3 weeks ago on her way to a dance class..
I don’t know how long its going to take,,but its only her leg that got busted in two places,,but I reckon she will definitely make this..
My wife is something else..well just kind of normal..English Northern Rick Chick…she has almost completely given up her zimmerframe now..and doing the bog on crutches..
Now she might look as young as our daughter – but she is nearly as old as me.
http://www.rockandbikefest.co.uk/
(I gave up motorbikes when I was 25 – but she still likes the occasional ride on the back)
We have been together for 35 years – and I love her to bits. I could never betray her.
She is my wife. the love of my life and we will be there next year in Derbyshire
It was the best festival of 2016 and cost £30 each inc camping – for the entire weekend.
Tony
@ Tony
That is areal love story, you lucky old cobber! Hope she’ll take her pillion place soon.
Cheers
To put in perspective earlier discussions in this Cafe that verged on civil but somewhat heated arguments, it might be useful to review the literary private duel in 1820s England between Thomas L. Peacock vs Percy B. Shelley.
In this summary https://www.enotes.com/topics/defence-poetry
it is pointed out that Thomas Peacock “in “The Four Ages of Poetry,” published in the first and only issue of the Literary Miscellany in 1820…………had elaborated the familiar figure of the Golden and Silver Ages of classical poetry into four (Iron, Gold, Silver, and Brass), skipped over “the dark ages,” and repeated the succession in English poetry. Peacock’s point was that poetry never amounts to much in civilized society; ………….”
Whereas “Shelley’s defense is that poetry is essential. Their views were antithetical and neither made contact with the other: Peacock’s attack is a boisterous satire, Shelley’s defense is an elevated prose poem.”…………
Some Cafe visitors may consider unwelcome verses as a sort of foul air released by other patrons shifting weight to one buttock or the other. And that the Deadly Poets Society are all gas and no class, as in “silent but deadly” and that open windows and strong fans are needed to air this place out, like Yesterday! This is the Peacock faction.
The Three Tenors are admittedly better artists than three high school rappers, but Pope’s Essay on Criticism is terrific at putting those who critics who dare not even attempt a couplet in a much fairer light than they offer the game but rough attempters of poetry.
And there are far better critics than the sour ones who sit smugly in their left brain prison, that would die rather than break through out of their left brain imbalance and severe non-artistic blockage like Todd Anderson was initially stuck in, in the Robin Williams movie:
https://youtu.be/gQU3EphIpMY
Those better critics know their own creative limitations in art per se, but their purpose in teaching and in constructive, encouraging criticism is the same as Mr Keating’s purpose in that scene. Keating will never be Walt Whitman or Captain, My Captain (Abraham Lincoln) but as a teacher/critic he will draw out of Todd the psychological and developmental character that is seen in the concluding minutes of the film:
https://youtu.be/j64SctPKmqk
And if you can’t see in that change the growing potential for moral political leadership, then maybe watch the whole movie a few times until you get the fact that the red head kid is a NWO slave and Todd is a free man.
I have a lot more to say on the subject, but I do want to get back to the point that ideas and their full grasp does depend on a cultural Renaissance and there may not be anything more potent than playing with poetry to get the brain balanced enough to even start to think really well. Which you need, before you can attempt to do anything of any real importance very well at all!
And even though I put aside my little draft poem “Weary of Leary” for further work later, Dennis, like a broken Timex, is reliably right twice a day: With Poetry and Drama. The Disproportionate Propaganda for Population Explosion Polemics might could use a rest, but the poetry and drama are sometimes close to the best!
Oh, I want to deal with narcissism and ego projecting separately (I disagree that everyone has to do it. What else could they do? Self-reflect, but not stare at their self-reflection. Keep their ego in check, not make it something to project in every exercise of pseudo-intellect! For starters.
Back to Pope, Essay on Man, concluding verse 3 because the answer to What Is To Be Done I have already given my best current shot at expressing. I will link it tomorrow or the next Cafe. It may have escaped notice. However Essay on Man does settle the mind (not just mine, A.H. that inspired what must be done now, over 200 years ago……) down for the kind of thinking required to see what humanity needs for lasting survival and really high, high quality thrival.
Epistle 2, Verse 3 because that does bear directly on all of this. And snakes and passions and sin, and even more esoterica if you read it wide awake:
III. Modes of self-love the passions we may call;
’Tis real good, or seeming, moves them all:
But since not every good we can divide,
And reason bids us for our own provide;
Passions, though selfish, if their means be fair,
List under Reason, and deserve her care;
Those, that imparted, court a nobler aim,
Exalt their kind, and take some virtue’s name.
In lazy apathy let stoics boast
Their virtue fixed; ’tis fixed as in a frost;
Contracted all, retiring to the breast;
But strength of mind is exercise, not rest:
The rising tempest puts in act the soul,
Parts it may ravage, but preserves the whole.
On life’s vast ocean diversely we sail,
Reason the card, but passion is the gale;
Nor God alone in the still calm we find,
He mounts the storm, and walks upon the wind.
Passions, like elements, though born to fight,
Yet, mixed and softened, in his work unite:
These, ’tis enough to temper and employ;
But what composes man, can man destroy?
Suffice that Reason keep to Nature’s road,
Subject, compound them, follow her and God.
Love, hope, and joy, fair pleasure’s smiling train,
Hate, fear, and grief, the family of pain,
These mixed with art, and to due bounds confined,
Make and maintain the balance of the mind;
The lights and shades, whose well-accorded strife
Gives all the strength and colour of our life.
Pleasures are ever in our hands or eyes;
And when in act they cease, in prospect rise:
Present to grasp, and future still to find,
The whole employ of body and of mind.
All spread their charms, but charm not all alike;
On different senses different objects strike;
Hence different passions more or less inflame,
As strong or weak, the organs of the frame;
And hence once master passion in the breast,
Like Aaron’s serpent, swallows up the rest.
As man, perhaps, the moment of his breath
Receives the lurking principle of death;
The young disease that must subdue at length,
Grows with his growth, and strengthens with his strength:
So, cast and mingled with his very frame,
The mind’s disease, its ruling passion came;
Each vital humour which should feed the whole,
Soon flows to this, in body and in soul:
Whatever warms the heart, or fills the head,
As the mind opens, and its functions spread,
Imagination plies her dangerous art,
And pours it all upon the peccant part.
(about a third done with last verse)
Poetry has its place in our culture regardless of yesayers and naysayers. The trouble is that cultural Marxism appears to have adopted it here as a diversion, a Trotsy tool to derail the real struggle of our times namely to thwart the Empire’s project for global domination.
Many of the loyal pro-Russia followers here see the poetic excursions as pesky distractions that will bring disaffection and eventual desertion from the ranks. If they want to have a poetic interlude, they can go somewhere, such as their bookshelves, and get their fill of Pope, Keats or Shelley without disturbing their fellow word-fighters, instead of being constantly assailed by – lets be blunt – modest attempts at poetry and caught as a captive audience.
I doubt the ‘rhymers’ are a Trotsky ‘plot’…but it’s a novel notion to be sure!
I personally see nothing sinister in it.
It’s ‘sinister’ only in the classic Latin sense of right-brain rythmics – the left hand side of the body is affected more strongly by emotion and intuition.
Rhyming is a common stress response – people often discover a capacity for rhyming they didn’t know they had in times of turmoil. Rhyming songs are a staple of the soldier’s life, especially during war. They are also a feature of child/play, and deeply intertwined with dance and music.
Here, the rhyming is confined to only one aspect of the site – The Moveable Feast Cafe. And if rythmics show up in appropriately on the main threads, the mods will relocate them to the cafe, as they sometimes do with OT posts.
My view is the scroll button is always available – so the various irritations that may arise for me are not a problem.
The rhymes don’t bother me at all – and sometimes they produce real gems I enjoy (six so far, two from Ioan.)
Baby in the bath water? Don’t throw it out…
It’s ‘sinister’ only in the classic Latin sense of right-brain rythmics – the left hand side of the body is affected more strongly by emotion and intuition.
Yes, but it happens that almost all of you who are defending this overwhelming tide of poetry have the same discourse, about “brain imbalance” and many other subjects, authors of reference and so on so as to not see that all of you doing this are connected in a certain way by “groupthink” or whatever, who knows but after reading a bit it is obvious.
I think that the Anonymous commenter above is right when saying that most readers/commenters who could be regulars here before, and were not members of the “groupthink”, have left because of boredom and indigestion by excess, and I would say that even having the sensation of going off mind, since the discourse of some is quite unintelligible to say the least, bordering the limits of reason. Most of the times I do not find any sense of their long posts. Dennis have had some posts really beautiful, but his abuse of gross sex references is to be taking in check. Although he is not the only one making sex references and taking sex conclusions from all all day.
I would advice to some always claiming for others to take their egos in check to apply the same advice to themselves, and consider why is that, except for the group of acolites who never find anything wrong in their discourse, nobody else dares to start a conversation to the risk of being grossly insulted or disqualified, not to mention if someone dares to question their authors of headboard. For me it is clear that the goal of these posters is only broadcast, not have any conversation/discussion with anybody, obvious by their attitude.
So, it is obvious, for who wants to see, that a group has cantoned here by extending the ideas/activities/authors of their formation. The proof of this is that when someone has come questioning those ideas, has been expelled with bad manners bequeathing ( or not, being plainly explicit ) the insult, both in plain prose and also in verse.
About the “Trotskyite plot”, I recall you linking a psychology text answering to another commenter here which I found really Trotskyite in “hispersonal interpretation” of Vygotskyi psychologics, and so, it was not surprising that he was so critic of Stalin.
Well, I have not read in its whole because of lack of time, I left in the middle and did not return to finish it, but, even when not agreeing always with classical psychiatry, I must say that I do not agree in that every individual is recoverable to sanity, as has been proved along the history of psychiatry especially with those impermeable to change, those who never regret anything, those who never apologize, those who have an estratospheric ego, those who react to any critic in disproportionate way, those who see others as “things” to play with them, those who only see “Evil” in others not accepting their weird behavior/ideas, those who give them a damn when they cause pain or suffering to others, those who normally have strange sex tastes, have excesses with drugs or alcohol and have scamed everyone who have been at their reach hand, and definitely, those who recreate amongst the dirt as if it was a perfumed foam bath. These are not recoverable, as has been proved by any existent therapy, instead they benefit of their psychiatric label to avoid a more severe punishment most of the times.
I agree that not every individual is ‘recoverable’ (I.e ‘curable) – namely the psychopathic who derive active pleasure from the abuse of advantage.
The author of the link is anti-Stalin, but I never expect anything else from Americans, so had little interest in his claims.
Vygotsky’s ideas were ahead of their time and his dialogue with Piaget was one of the best ‘arguments’ I personally have read in academia. Both were intellectual powerhouses and both hugely influential. Have no knowledge of his specific political allegiances – they were not my area of interest.
I tend to Vygotsky’s position on development, mostly out of personal idealism, but also because I found his arguments pretty compelling.
Nevertheless, I don’t tend to the ‘cult of personality’, in any arena, including political. No one individual knows all the questions that should be asked – much less knows all the answers.
Psychiatry is pretty much dead in the water in the West, sinces it has abandoned its role to identify and contain sociopathy: it is largely a tool of social control, and in the US, of Big Pharma.
Witness the abusive ‘Transgender’ cult, which actively promotes hormonal and genital mutilation in children, actively endorsed at institutional level (some psychiatrists have resigned over it, but most are not even challenging it, with the notable exception of Paul McHugh).
Were all entitled to our opinions, do I guess mine and yours are equally valid – neither can prove objectively there is ‘group think’ in the context you refer to.
I would say it is a common phenomenon, as political ideologies, religions and economic approaches prove: we are social animals after all.
Amén.
Bro 93: not everyone agrees on the left-right brain concept:
MYTH #3: CREATIVITY = A HA!s + LIGHTNING BOLTS
“Another false assumption I think we suffer from culturally is the idea that creativity equals novel insight. When we have those aha! moments, a part of the right hemisphere is in fact stimulated. But to thrive creatively involves so much more than insight and novelty.
Creativity is in part applying imagination. Creativity entails either making novel contributions within a field, re-combining existing ideas in a fresh and useful way, or/and it is solving problems in a novel but useful way.
To do so, a person must have discernment, judgment, a clear knowledge of the material and craft—much left-brained. A writer who aspires to excel as a memoirist and to have her work recognized and appreciated, for instance, actually must learn a great deal about her craft and about how to design engaging and near-magical reading experiences.
Such study is the left-brained behind-the-scenes work of a lot of creative output that many people popularly don’t like to think about. They don’t like to associate creativity with study, discipline, and discernment. They like to associate creativity with romance and spontaneity and brilliant ideas. That’s just not the whole story of what it takes to thrive creatively. All skill, no whim, and what’s created might be flat and derivative. All whim, no skill, and what’s made might be enjoyable only for the creator. ”
Source: https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/tracking-wonder/201203/myths-right-brained-creativity
The author is some new-agy dude & I don’t have mood to research that in detail now.
But there are more sources, e.g.: http://www.livescience.com/39373-left-brain-right-brain-myth.html
As for the rest of the discussion, I’m not joining at this moment…
Peace
Well, just one thought. I would welcome to have some “creative/artistic corner” at The Saker site. Everybody entering would know, that he is crossing a looking-glass of kind. And in that arena, I would like to see some visual, audio, video etc. examples of creativity as well. The “word” is a beautiful & powerful “instrument”, but the whole field is much more vast & deep.
Just my 5c…
I’ve been awake since half-past midnight; now it’s three hours later. I lay in bed for a couple hours, thinking about things past and present, and absorbing all the love I could. Ideas as massive moving tectonic plates threatening the gates of the keepers of the peace.
I came over here like a butterfly to a candle in the dark. I’m glad I did. I first stopped to find out when Orthodox Christmas was. Two calendars, one Catholic and the other Orthodox. Two tectonic plates.
Then I went to Soon After Midnight since that seemed to be happening to me. I like this part:
A gal named Honey
Took my money
She was passing by
It’s soon after midnight
And the moon is in my eye
If you’re not familiar with the melody and mood of the music, half passes you by. On my way from my outdoor bed to this indoor bower, I passed under the stars and the half moon obscured by a large oak. Ah, nature, you angel you.
I paused at the masthead. So much blue, like the blues. The cold inner north. Russia with its absolutely huge landmass hovering over EuroAsia. No wonder it arouses cupidity. The Saker logo has that frozen blue north look too. There’s a valley but little warmth visible other than the orange ribbon and the orange down arrow. A fierce but also downy soft bird falcon that feeds on rats. What’s a saker anyway in the vast scheme of things?
Orthodox sounds so reassuring and solid. Literally, “right doctrine.” Catholic sounds so universal but weaker. The papacy is so old. Russian Orthodoxy arose in mid-stream but claims the ancient privilege. And then there’s this vineyard
I hear raindrops on the roof. Go out and sure enough it’s so. What? That was not predicted. Strange things happening never seen before.
Amazing stuff going on, chronicled here in miniature. Taking the pulse of the world. Where do I fit in? Do I fit anywhere? “They chirp and they chatter; what does it matter?”
Poetry is under suspicion and scrutiny. The war roomers are not pleased. I have my own reservations about it. The real deal is getting bad press; who would have guessed? Of course, it’s par for the course. The Love Army stirs up a “master passion in the breast,” which is soon enough suppressed. A Love Bower even more so.
What’s a body to do? What’s to be done? My heart is with the LOve Army and my soul is in the Love Bower, come hell or high water. How can I suffer fools if I am one? Love is my trump held in reserve just in case.
The Trump out there is a fool, being set up to fool foolish followers. Count Khazar is a bigger fool. So where does the buck stop? If she’s in heat, he’ll stop for the nearest roe. But that doesn’t play well in Peoria. And sadly, not well at all in vineyard cafes.
This one is on its last legs. I look forward to the next jam session. Maybe we can break this logjam. Too much poetry dulls the brain. Not enough does the same. Action speaks louder than words. But predictably, it is missing in action. In fact, it gets a violent reaction; and when mixed with sex, it shuts down the thinking system altogether. Communal sex sets off an even more violent abreaction.
What’s a Love Army to do when Count Khazar invests in vineyards? “Do like Elvis and shoot the damn thing out?” Hey, it’s Advent in the West and Lent in the East. Christmas is coming and I’ll be back in Wisconsin then. I’ll dodge the bullet by getting out of Dodge before the shooting starts.
“I say a shooting star tonight, and I thought of you. Did you ever make it through to a world I never knew?” Carpe diem and the night too. And to think he committed suicide, or was suicided.
Now it’s 5. How time flies. By this time next week, I’ll be on that slow train heading north, and if the dream comes true, I could take that high-speed rail to Timbuktu or to Moscow’s Beautiful Square. Is it a dream or a nightmare? Do I even care?
What is my “master passion in the breast?” A question to be asked but not easily answered. “I’ll take you where you want to go; and if it don’t work out, you’ll be the first to know.” You can be in my dream if I can be in yours.
I know you don’t like the word but it’s the only one I have. What’s your word? Tell me again. I forgot. Just whisper it in my ear. Did you hear it on the grapevine? I tell you what I hear. How come you act so strange? You’re getting out of range, drifting too far from shore.
I gave you my heart but you wanted my soul. You can have that too if it would make you whole. Oh, Baby, come in out of the rain. Give up the pain. It’s insane out there. You’re the master passion in my breast. Come with me and I’ll give you rest. You say you don’t trust me. Then trust yourself. If you can’t do that, then trust love. No, not that love but this love, the one that abides in vineyard bowers. OK, take your time. Make it rhyme. You’ll be fine.
“I just don’t know what I’m going to do. I was all right until I fell in love with you.” Yes, it’s true but I can’t put it into words. It’s in you and you know it too. “It ain’t me, Babe; no, no, no, it’s ain’t me, Babe–I’m not the one you’re looking for, Babe.” Even so, go down to the river, Babe, I will meet you there. Wear silver bracelets on your wrists and flowers in your hair.
It’s not light yet but it’s getting there. I’m just hanging out in this all night cafe, waiting for the day of the new cafe. I’ve got to take buses down to Beach Town today; my little pre-Christmas adventure which is catalyzed by a dentist denture adjustment. On the way, I’ll think of you, and how you fit into the grand workings of those tectonic movements of Catholic Orthodoxy which that fool Khazar thinks he controls.
I really should go. Parting is such sweet sorrow. Have to check the weather report. Should I take an umbrella? You look so good when you’re comin’ after me. I’ll soon be flagging down that double E myself. I’m going all the way but I’ll be back. Does that make any sense, Love?
6 am PST. 2 pm UTC. Vulva Valley, Ojai, California, December 8, feast of Immaculate Conception in Catholic-land and 13 nights from the winter solstice high and low point of the love calendar in nature’s rhyming timing.
In an urban environment, one can always find another Cafe’ or bar, if the clientel and their discussions/debates does not interests you very much.
Usually it’s just around the corner, or on the next street.
So, this is what I’ll do. Goodbye to endless scrolling, and endless rant’s (however interesting they might be in another setting).
Take Care
Kent
I’ll miss your short and sober posts- and some really great music I’ve found through you. I’m okay with scrolling. It’s a bit like, what we call in America, a rummage sale. You have to pick and sort through a lot of stuff to find the treasures- the rare one-of – a kind- things.
k
Hi there
Thank you for your kind words. I will still be posting on other parts of the forum.
The answer to life, the universe and everything isn’t necessarily 42.
Could be more like this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=unLKgu1-v_8
Take Care
Kent
One for you then. This was introduced to me by Fintan Dunne at http://www.breakfornews.com/ some years back (he used it on his audio analysis).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZZnflacbwQE
Enjoy
Kent
Drop off a post card now and then telling where you are?
Ok then.
“Drop off a post card now and then telling where you are?”
I can do better than that.
Part of my collection of Russian posters. (sorry about the background, usually I do make suitable ones)
Anyway some astonishing pieces of art here. (PC or tablets please, no smartphones).
http://fotovision.no/RussianPosters/Afisha/index.html
Enjoy
Kent
It would be a loss for me, I like your humor. A Cafe without it ? can you imagine that ? a place where people go to have some “fresh air” (even I’m a smoker) and some exchange of opinions…of course, some repetitions are boring and if that repetition is even long and long and long, well, then everybody will asleep. We shall have to establish some rules in poetry, long repetitive posts and copies of entire documents. Links are welcome. I do appreciate your graphics, I love also to draw and paint.
the open truth about Deir ez Zor from analysis by Gareth Porter of the Centcom report :
http://russia-insider.com/en/its-own-report-data-indicates-pentagons-slaughter-syrian-troops-which-buried-kerry-lavrov-ceasefire
Poetry here a Trotskyist plot? Have you ever actually read the content of some of the poetry? what a meme! sounds like the flip side of “the Russians are running Trump “. Oh please let us substitute repetitive, deary jargon-laidened leftist rants and all will be right with the world. Or if a Cafe were only the exact replica of my own living room, well, I’d never have to go out!
This is a rhyme free post.
I wish our non-rhymer friends would not leave the cafe. I come here to feast and learn. I love the broad perspective I sure don’t find in my hometown. I skip the really long posts with too many details about personal habits and bar room language. The non the non-rhymers are important teachers and mentor for me.
I too love a flock that finds its group dynamics moment by moment. I love that we are trying to define this at the cafe. I am not hearing dissenters as much I hear a request for those who post so long and often to curb it just a bit. Is this a case for compromise? Maybe skip some of the stuff you yourself is not admit interesting to anyone but you.
I personally pledge to write no more than one poem per cafe if non-rhymers will stay.(whoops)
k
PS Eimar and Earthrise I have especially appreciated your many stellar posts in this whole cafe. And Isabella and Helen- I’m a fan. I follow you all around the vineyard- so many others too.
I will restrain writing you all a poem of gratitude;)
And I appreciate very much your thoughts !
long posts with too many details about personal habits and bar room language
Well, that´s the issue too, I do not think anybody is interested in whether the cafe users evacuate their bowels and bladders or not, this, in my country at least, pertain to the intimate field of eschatology ( and I am not referring to that matter on which Imran Hossein is so knowledgeable ) and is considered of the worst taste to come to the table telling about those exploits.
To be blunt, when anyone joint you in a cafe table and start telling about this, is a clear sign that that person is abusing your confidence, this in case of being a friend, thye more in a forum like this where confidence is discarded.
One thing is not to be political correct all the time and other to go to the other extreme thinking that people is willing to accept anything.
Thanks for the balance Kinterra. I’ll challenge myself to keep my posts to three paragraphs. Brevity is the soul of wit they say, a shorter post does sharpen the message. I don’t think there is anything wrong with the poetry, even if you scroll past it is mood lighting for a broader conversation. The poetry and personal anecdotes tends to fill the silences, and I find they act like group therapy. Those of us awake and aware, the world gives you mild PTSD (Queens/Kings of Pain), speaking personally it helps me to see you all struggling with the same issues. Being able to share these Interesting Times helps to lessen the cognative dissonance effect and hopefully help us all get a little closer to the Truth.
Thanks for the comp Kinterra.
Am currently confined to home due to sickness in a loved one, so have been posting rather a lot lately.
Like you, I really enjoy the variety of views/dialogue – I don’t percieve ‘group think’ at all, apart from the central reason for this blog: anti-war.
Pleased to hear I haven’t totally bored everyone to tears :-)
No pun intended. But seriously, think about it.
“Gasoline”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=55ZSyAneg_g
Take Care
Kent
Geo-Politics and music.
We, are all on a crossroad, right now.
Unfortunately Eric sold out a long time ago.
Notice the MSM whore Christiane Amanpour at 2.03 and don’t forget the sick bag.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oHO-CKfxvH0
I will never forget the shredding of Christiane Amanpour by Anissa Naouai at RT. Brilliant!!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g1SUQ1qtdb0
Poetry? Hardly, but anyways. Enjoy.
Take Care
Kent
Why not marry a house carpenter indeed?
(long before MTV “flockpugged” were “invented”).
Enjoy: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-4jXfMEu1YY
And why am I posting this? Educational purposes? Or because Music Journalism/Photography has been one of my many occupations for many years. To display my Ego and superior intelligence etc? Because I want to share and care about people?
You decide.
Take Care
Kent
You see. He didn’t mean to, really. Shit just happens right?
http://fotovision.no/GLP1/EuroTrash.jpg
Take Care
Kent
From scratch (wherever you are). Determination is key (including very small or big daily challenges).
This is determination: http://fotovision.no/GLP1/Cheetah_0003_DarkHighl..jpg
Be that!! as much as you can.
And this: http://fotovision.no/GLP1/Lionness1940.jpg
Apathy, resignation serves what these entities want’s.
http://fotovision.no/GLP1/Gates_of_Hell_Faces_of_Evil.jpg
http://fotovision.no/GLP1/Gates_of_Hell_Netanyahu_Joe_Biden_Faces_of_Evil.jpg
Take Care
Kent