From Vesti News – Denis Pushilin, President of the Donetsk People’s Republic announced that Donbass intends to become part of Russia as a federal district. Zelensky is going to call Putin, Kiev officials insist that the Normandy format meeting should take place right now, in September, in the coming days.
Saker Message:
How many other neighboring oblasts in the Ukraine would like to join the Donetsk People’s Republic?
Here we go — another ”illegal annexation” at the expense of our proud, beloved Ukraine /sarc off/
Yesterday, for my daily dose of masochism and despair at humanity, I watched the repulsive Madcow for a few minutes. Once again I was struck by the very firm impression that she represents a real nadir of human malevolence, but, on this occasion I was drawn in, before my daily dose of ‘education’ in more beneficent places (I can thank CG Jung for the best explanation of neuroticism, and its cure, I’ve ever seen)by the prospect of a Gorgon double-header with Samantha Powers.
The two Harpies did not disappoint. The two headed Hydra ‘pissed in each others’ pockets’ as we say, in a display of mutual self-admiration that was way beyond nauseating, while spewing and spitting lies and hypocrisy, of course, that being the meat and milk of the entire Western ‘elite’. The main course was their malignant and hysterical hatred of Russia and Putin which was entirely unhinged. As is now de rigeur among these creations of some misbegotten God, the non-existent Russian ‘interference’ on the 2016 election sham in the USA is now decreed to have swung the election for Trump, a lie so bizarre and demented as to defy belief. In the end I gave the contest to Madcow, by a drop or two of spittle, and thanks to that twitching, mugging, almost fluid face of hers, where you can just about see the demons wrestling beneath the skin, anxious to burst forth and drown the world in bile and black phlegm. These be our Exceptional Masters.
Just like the Ukronazis, that Maddow harpy is a truly stunning beauty! Maddow and Poroshenko would make a fine couple, methinks.
Madcow bats for the other side, thank God.
You paint a vivid picture Mulga. Honestly don’t know how you could sit thru Maddow and Powers…. at the same time! I would’ve had a bucket handy.
But despite us knowing the whole Russiagate garbage was just that; loony tunes garbage, sadly, a lot of gullible idiots out there actually believe what they’ve been repeatedly fed by these presstitutes.
Bolton may be gone, but there’s a whole lot more like him in Washington along with the likes of Bojo in the UK, and Scomo in Aussie.
I detected this neurotic tendency to masochistic curiosity regarding human villainy quite early on-at Sunday School would you believe. Fortunately I think I have reached Peak Madcow-the sight of her and her oddly unpleasant manner and amazing capacity to lie (I suspect she may just be very, very, brainwashed)or reject facts that do not adhere to ‘received truth’, has me hitting the channel switch with alacrity. It’s all moot, however, given megafires in Brazil, Colombia, Bolivia, Congo, Angola, Siberia, Indonesia and Queensland, with megafloods in between. As I have long expected, being a bit of a ‘glass completely empty’ type, the ecological collapse is going to be very rapid indeed. I just wonder when the first boat full of refugees from an increasingly afflicted Indonesia will arrive in the north. The first of very many.
It’s informative and likely shocking to some to observe Maddow’s rants sans audio. One can quickly pick up on just what you so ably describe.. She is communicating (something) on various emotional levels far outside the noise and hate she spews.
Eloquently put, “Mulga”!
Nussiminen
The point is that Crimea was annexed by Ukraine in 1954 and reunited with Russia in 2014. As for the Donbass (and other regions), they were bestowed to Ukraine after the First World War, even though they were historically Russian with Russians residing in them. The West always (on purpose no doubt) overlooks these facts.
B.F.
Yes, these facts about Crimea and Donbass are entirely correct. And regarding propagandized Western so-called ’history’, the most funny thing about it is how it flip-flops according to victories and, especially now, setbacks and defeats. Kosovo, another fabulous success story of recent Western lawlessness, is fine and dandy — from NATO humanitarian intervention to Camp Bondsteel and trafficking (narcotics and human organs). Crimea and the Donbass refused to cave in, and so now we have the sods in charge of the West making a lot of noise about ”international law”. It’s immensely pleasurable hearing them scream in real pain!
Nussiminen
Yes. Well spoken. All true.
Correct me if I am wrong, but hasn’t Putin already refused to do this?
Putin is thinking of making Ukraine a good neighbor, with the nazis and Russophobes gone to an enclave in the western portion of country. He expects that this will happen when the “good” Ukies take back their country from the “bad” Ukies. This good never happen if he subtracts 2.5 – 4 million good Ukies (Donbass).
So, this attachment to Russia will not happen unless Kiev outright legally allows the Donbass to leave Ukraine.
The big obstacle to that is Akmetov, and Mariupol and access to the Azov.
So even if the guns went silent and the snipers left the oblast, it is unlikely secession would happen.
The chokebone in Kiev’s throat is Donbass. Putin is not going to extract it.
It is just as unlikely Putin would modify the Minsk 2 Agreement. It enslaves Ukraine to reverse all its Russophobic actions.
The sanctions on Russia are mostly over Crimea. So, anything going on about Donbass is not relevant to getting rid of the sanctions.
Things will remain as they are.
Passports are available for millions of Donbass residents. Last number I saw was 125,000 or so had applied for the passport. What does that tell you?
My fear is that you might be right.So let me tell you what will happen if you are.Some kind of “amnesty” will be put on the books for the people in Donbass. But like with everything else the Ukronazis promise it will only be good until they take power.Then they will send their agents,and the SBU,regular police,and military forces into Donbass. Close off the Russian border,and do what they have promised for 5 years.Purge anyone with any connection to the pro-Russian side.Just as they have done in the occupied parts of Donbass,and Kharkov and Odessa.Replace all the local officials for Kiev loyalists,purge the schools and start teaching Ukrainian instead of Russian.Those people that can flee to Russia will do so,the rest will be terrorized like the other pro-Russian Oblasts are today.With the conflict solved,they will be free to move closer to NATO occupation.The Russian idea to keep Donbass in Ukraine as a counterweight could/would only work if a neutral or pro-Russian government was in power in Ukraine.One that was seriously interested in solving the problems that caused Donbass to revolt in the first place.That is not the government we see in Ukraine now. Zelensky may be better than Poroshenko,but only marginally.Even the new regime has not condemned the war crimes of the old regime.Hell,they can’t or won’t, even stop the shelling and attacks on Donbass that happen everyday.When they won’t even do that,who in their right mind can think they will keep the people of Donbass safe from the killers.
Look at how Russia and Putin handle other “zones” like Donbass. Transnistria, South Ossetia, Abkhazia, etc. They are in a limbo for years, protectorates, supported by Moscow, but in limbo.
Putin’s plan is to use EAEU to “gather in” the entities nearby that make sense as part of the Russian economy and perimeter defense. Though the Russians no longer refer to buffer zones, the land serves as buffer in any case. Belarus, Ukraine, and the others I mentioned are objects to be gathered into the Russian Federation v.2. It will be hard going because changes have to happen.
Most of these entities are heavily reliant on the Russian energy economy. So it is inevitable that they will be gathered in eventually. It’s about economic strength and development. Russia has centripetal force working as it becomes more powerful geopolitically and as its economy becomes more dynamic.
In the last four-five years, the Russian orbit has drawn Armenia, Turkey, Iran, Moldova, Mongolia, North Korea closer. The lands nearer, smaller, more fragile, still can feel the push and the pull generated by Putin’s Russia.
Even Serbia is talking about joining EAEU.
We see the Donbass and the deaths and tragedies and want a solution now.
Putin views the Donbass and the Ukraine completely differently. He didn’t start the armed resistance. He saved it. But he won’t be changing his plan because the Ukies keep killing. He knows the Donbass is attached at the border and will be there when Kiev changes. And when Kiev changes, the Ukraine will return to a normalized society. That could be another ten years or more. An impoverished, desperately poor Ukraine will return.
Ukraine will not ‘take over’ in this case (Minsk followed). Republics will elect pro-Russian leaders, and security wil be provided by current corps, rebrabded as police and border force, answering to those leaders. In the longer run, it will depend on political processes in Russia and Ukraine. In the very long run, most likely the conflict will become history, not vital present, like WW2.
If agreements are not reached or not satisfactory followed, it is unavoidable to have Abkhazia -style developments, with autonomy or joining Russia, which in practise is more or less the same. And as opposed to Abkhazia nominally remaining in Georgia.
The chokebone in Kiev’s throat is Donbass. Putin is not going to extract it.
So perfectly stated.
No need to waste so much effort on the Ukraine when it will peacefully return, once it has finished its adventure in ‘Westernism’.
That is my sentiment too. Time is on Russia’s side. When the standard of living in Ukraine deteriorates enough, the east and centre will want to come back to Russia. At the moment, they are thoroughly brainwashed – in all of Ukraine. The stupid ideas about the EU and prosperity have to be washed away before they can face reality.
In Kiev, a great many public buildings are sporting the flag of the European Union next to that of Ukraine. It is unbelievable. The people actually still believe that the EU will welcome them one day.
Agreed. And what makes this a very real possibility is the Maidan Nazis happily destroying ”Ukraine”, making it all but impossible to find work and survive on the wages offered. Hence, ”Ukraine” is depopulating and deindustrialising. This makes Russia’s ’waiting game’ an excellent strategy. In a few years’ time, Russia can settle ”Ukraine” entirely peacefully and then discreetly — yes! — annex it, leaving Galicia and its inbred garbage to ’prosper’ on its own.
”In Kiev, a great many public buildings are sporting the flag of the European Union next to that of Ukraine. It is unbelievable. The people actually still believe that the EU will welcome them one day.”
Haha, a neat and beautiful illustration of the well-known fact that unrequited love dies hard. Sure, it must have been an immensely exciting experience — open flirtation with Soros and the representatives of hardcore Western fascist reaction — but Russophobia doesn’t absolve the Ukronazis from explicit demands about tangible success on their part. Sporting the EU flag (NATO and US flags would seem equally plausible) won’t improve their standing anywhere. Crimea stays ”annexed”, no matter the choice of flags on display in Kiev, sorry.
$5 bn+ goes much further in Ukraine, the people were lied to by the usa & eu, they thought they could experience some of what the poles did, but there was no further money for ukraine joining, especially after the fact that even an eu member like Greece was disregarded financially, so what chance did Ukraine have?
Have your cake, and eat it too? It would seem that the Ukraine has been eyeing the Donbass for some time, to gobble-it-up, no doubt; and by some small miracle, they have escaped this fate. But, how long the status quo?—it is reported that the Russian popular opinion is seething with a frustrated anger over this slow-simmering war/butchery; and also, the Russian government has remained committed to the longer-term goals, rather than any short-term mad-dashery—as some, or many, have counted on, it seems. This issue at hand now, of Donbass joining the Federation, could very well be, a “forcing of hands” so to speak; since this stalemate, of sorts, can not, will not, last: better for the Russians, to end it on their terms, than allow this open sore to fester.
Mike from Jersey
I think you are right. Some years back Putin refused this, as at that time it was not necessary. Donbass was used as a buffer zone, and, as far as I can personally see, will continue to serve in this capacity, in one form or another.
On the other hand, times change. This could indeed be a direct move to have the Donbass reunited with Russia, but then again it could be a bluff to force Ukraine back to the negotiating table. At the moment it is too early to draw any specific conclusions. Time will tell.
The dogs keep barking…the caravan keeps movin’ on.
Very good. I hope it goes well! Maybe it just way to get orcs to the negotiating table?
Sooner or later Donbass will return to the warm womb or Russia.
Maybe just alone or along with a few other oblasts.
Minsk and Putin s policies to respect Kiev existence are just a means not a purpose.
When Nato and european vassal attitudes finally cease to exist, then Donetsk will be a russian province.
Isn’t Bismarck more actual than ever? He was prescient and did everything in his power to prevent a disastrous course of action, the war of ‘Europe’ against Russia.
“The power of Russia can only be undermined by the separation of Ukraine, and the two parts of this one people must be brought up against each other to watch how brothers kill their brothers.”
“For this you should only find and educate the traitors among the national elite and with their help change the self-confidence of a part of the great people so that they will hate everything Russian, its descent, without noticing.” Everything else is only a matter of Time.”
But “It could be argued here if such a war could possibly have the consequence that Russia, as Count Kálnoky puts it, would be “smashed”. Such a result is beyond all probability even after the most brilliant victories. Even the most favorable outcome of the war would never result in the decomposition of Russia’s main power, which rests on the millions of actual Russians of the Greek Confession. These, though separated by treaties, would always reunite as quickly as the parts of a cut-up body of mercury. This indestructible empire of the Russian nation, strong by its climate, its deserts, and its frugality, as well as the advantage of having only a border to be protected, would, after its defeat, remain our native and revolted adversary, just as France today is in the West”.
And he concluded: “The secret of politics? Make a good treaty with Russia”.
Is Europe awakening from its ‘sleep of reason’ that produced the monsters of two centuries of cataclysmic wars?
Great quotes, where are they from?
Freedom and democracy should be the most important criteria.
So freedom of choice should be respected.
Every region in Ukraine should have a referendum to make a choice if they want to stay in Ukraine or to join Russian Federation.
I doubt that that is always true. The electorate contains numerous stupid, ignorant, vicious and manipulable members. Any vote for or against secession or accession bonds future generations, too, forever, or until some new interference from the West or wherever foments some new internecine conflict. As a Bosnian Croat I’m sure you know how the process of setting neighbour against neighbours goes.
They can dream I guess. Pridnestrovia announces this every year for the past 20 years and it’s never come to pass, neither will this.
Sooner or letter entire Moldavia will join to Russia. Union between Russia and Belarus is just beginning.
Russia, Ukraine, Belarus and Moldavia will be parts of Federation. Probably, also Armenia and Kazakhstan.
Belarus and Armenia probably, Kazakhstan maybe, but the others unlikely. Ukraine is an ungodly mess that no one can afford to fix. There are parts of the country that have some marginal value but most of it is something of a lost cause. Moldova is another sad mess that no one can really afford to fix. Romania can’t afford them, that country can barely afford itself. Moldova has been pretty will divided by the west into the tiny number of homos who make a lot of noise and are pro western, a third of the population who sort of take seriously the whole Basarabia e Romania nonsense, a third, probably mostly older people and some younger who look to Russia, and the rest who are just trying get on with their lives and be left alone. Transnistria is the problem either way and there’s always Gagauzia. Any move against Transnistria would probably push the Gagauzians into open revolt. Plus the Moldovan’s know they are don’t have the military to take on the Tiraspol police much less the Transnistria army.
‘Divide and Rule’ rules, OK, in the ‘Rules Based International Order’.
I haven’t meant that it would happen very soon. But it will go this way in longer term.
As far as the people in Donbass are concerned Minsk II is as dead as Zacharchenko and in no way do they want to see the bastard brother called Minsk III or any other sweet euphemism which would be used by the Ukies to “buy time why we figure out ways to kill you” . These CIA sponsored folks are not agreement -capable.
News of the Donetsk Republic
Turchinov explained why Kiev cannot declare war on Russia
September 13, 2019
– Ukraine cannot declare war on Russia due to the fact that Moscow has nuclear weapons, said the for-
mer secretary of the Ukrainian National Security and Defense Council, Alexander Turchinov. This was
reported on his website.
– According to him, Kiev has nothing to oppose Moscow in matters of strategic weapons, since the nu-
clear arsenal in the country was liquidated after the collapse of the USSR.
– As Turchinov noted, in this situation the only way out for Ukraine could be to strengthen military capa-
bilities.
“The time will come when Russia will have significantly greater problems than the Soviet Union had at
the end of its existence, and we will liberate not only the Crimea. …” – claims the ex-secretary
of the NSDC.
– He did not specify whom else he was going to “free”.
http://dnr-news.com/dnr/50980-turchinov-obyasnil-pochemu-kiev-ne-mozhet-obyavit-voynu-rossii.html
”He did not specify whom else he was going to ’free’ ”
Like most Ukronazis in official positions of power, Alexander Turchinov understands he is expected to consult his Western handlers on the subject. Crimea is a given, so that’s OK to target for liberation (good luck with that, dolt).
Is it not true that the Ukronazi ultras claim territory as far as Rostov as part of their ‘Eretz Ukrainia’?
I don’t think that Ukraine was ever going to be a viable project, it reminds me of a leggo set, with pieces added on which barely fitted together. In 1922 Lenin added a large chunk in the Russian-speaking east of the country containing heavy industry and various oblasts and cities such as Kharkov, Donetsk, Mariupol, Nikoliaev, Kherson, Zaparohze on the east side of the Dnieper. After 1945 Stalin gifted (if that’s the right word) the western Ukraine to the Ukrainian/Polish areas which were once part of the Austrian Hungarian empire. The principal cities were Lviv, Ternopil and the area itself was Galicia. Apart from that there were/are Hungarian and Romanian minorities in Bessarabia and Transcarpathia. Different languages, different hsitories different cultures. Thus it was hardly surprising that the whole thing came unglued in the first instance partly the result of WW2, but more recently the colour revolution in Kiev. As a unified sovereign state, Ukraine will never exist.
Title should not be ‘President of Donbass’ as Pushilin is only the head of the DPR.
In my opinion, Denis Pushilin announcement by this time was rather wrong as useful. The Russophobes
will now vociferously accuse Putin of wanting to annex Donbass as well.
They knew about this before, it’s not a secret.
Without Mariupol, Slaviansk & Kramatorsk in, basically all of LNR/DNR + a few other cities too close to hae them as neighbours like Berdyansk (east of Mariupol) and Izium north of DNR, this is NOT viable, and that is the very minimal plan, not even talking of Novorossia Rehab 2.0 (with the 2 KNRs, second DNR, ZNR and west of Dniepr river, NNR & ONR + transdniestr).
BUT, this is a last standing man game and as Boubuana stated, ‘Russia has the escalatory dominance in Ukraine’, so if they didn’t use it as Muricans expected them to do, this means that they believe that LDNR will be the last standing man in this game. All they need is up the bets, force Zelinsky to cave in (to Minsk 2) and the nazis to launch the autodestruction sequence of post maidan j##kraine, by declaring independence of Banderasthan-Galicia.
I think they are slobbering quite a bit over Poland, but this might not be compatible with EU ambitions, so they have put it on the back burner.