by Paul Craig Roberts – posted with permission
On August 31, 2018, I wrote:
“So, the questions for Andrei Martyanov, The Saker, and for Putin and the Russian government is: How long does turning your other cheek work? Do you turn your other cheek so long as to allow your opponent to neutralize your advantage in a confrontation? Do you turn your other cheek so long that you lose the support of the patriotic population for your failure to defend the country’s honor? Do you turn your other cheek so long that you are eventually forced into war or submission? Do you turn your other cheek so long that the result is nuclear war?
“I think that Martyanov and The Saker agree that my question is a valid one. Both emphazise in their highly informative writings that the court historians misrepresent wars in the interest of victors. Let’s give this a moment’s thought. Both Napoleon and Hitler stood at their apogee, their success unmitigated by any military defeat. Then they marched into Russia and were utterly destroyed. Why did they do this? They did it because their success had given them massive arogance and belief in their “exceptionalism,” the dangerous word that encapsulates Washington’s belief in its hegemony.
“The zionist neoconsevatives who rule in Washington are capable of the same mistake that Napoleon and Hitler made. They believe in “the end of history,” that the Soviet collapse means history has chosen America as the model for the future. Their hubris actually exceeds that of Napoleon and Hitler.
“When confronted with such deluded and ideological force, does turning the other cheek work or does it encourage more provocation?
“This is the question before the Russian government.” https://www.paulcraigroberts.org/2018/08/31/can-war-be-avoided-and-the-planet-saved/
Andrei Martyanov answered on September 4, 2018: https://www.unz.com/article/russia-as-a-cat/ He argued that Washington is aware that its military power is limited and will not risk nuclear annihilation.
On April 5, 2021, the Saker has reached agreement with my point: “Russia cannot and will not retreat further, she won’t meekly declare that the Donbass or Crimea belong to the Nazi regime in Kiev. Russia is ready, capable and willing to fight US/NATO forces if needed, including by using tactical and even strategic nukes.” https://10.16.86.131/what-will-the-empire-do-to-support-the-ukronazis-open-thread-4/
Like myself the Saker concludes that Washington’s hubris means that “The biggest danger right now is that western politicians are completely misreading not only Putin, but all of Russia.”
Martyanov believes that Washington’s guarantee to Ukraine is a temptest in a teacup as Washington will not really risk confronting Russia militarily. https://smoothiex12.blogspot.com
I wonder if Martyanov is giving Washington too much credit for awareness. If Washington were reading the situation correctly, would the US Secretary of Defense have given Ukraine a guarantee against Russian intervention if Ukraine, now better armed by Washington, renews its assault on Donbass? Washington wants conflict between Russia and Ukraine, and the purpose of giving the guarantee is to produce conflict.
Martyanov might be correct that Ukraine is too wary to trust the guarantee, and that Washington would not stand behind it. But escalation can have momentum of its own. The publicized guarantee could result in extreme elements pushing the Ukrainian president into foolhardy action. Neocons and liberal interventionists could insist Washington’s word and reputation are at stake and demand that Biden go to Ukraine’s aid. I agree with Martyanov that it would be a war based on stupid nonsense, but these things do happen.
I only raise questions. Saker and Martyanov are better informed on these matters than I. Nevertheless, I think the risk is high that the American people are going to be very regretful that they permitted the military/security complex to use the dumbshit Democrats to prevent President Trump from normalizing relations with Russia.
Never under estimate the arrogance, ignorance, or delusion of the American people (thanks to their limited questioning and MSM), and ruling class. It is simple – America is run by gangsters. It has been since the end of WW II. I fear for my four grandchildren. Clearly the forth turning is at our door steps.
PaPa
You are, unfortunately, right. As for the neocons, time is not working for them. As the late political economist Lyndon LaRouche stated, the only thing that can save the US dollar is the breakup of Russia and the plunder of Siberia and the Caspian region. Not only is the dollar printed backed by nothing, the neocons are looking at gigantic foreign and domestic debts which can never be repayed. Russia thus needs to be destabilized. The neocons are eyeing the September elections in Russia, which they wish to subvert. They will provoke a war in the Donbass, hoping Russia will intervene, and thus create preconditions for a liberal takeover of the Russian Parliament, which would create a pro-Western Government that will open up Russia to Western plundering. Nothing but wishful thinking. On the other hand, since time is not working for the neocons, we shall see how far they will go with their imperial foreign policy. They might be desperate enough to go all the way, regardless of consequences.
For Any attack against Donbass to be successful, the attackers will need a force 3 times larger than the defending forces of Donbass. 40.000 men will be insufficient to achieve anything but a skirmish.
So what is the real purpose of a skirmish?
Maybe to keep NATO nations in Lock down, and give Biden, Macron and Merkel 4 more years in office.
The US and NATO military are already deterred.
They are maned by paid soldiers, who constantly evaluate their pay against the risk they are taking.
If the risk gets too high, people ruled by logic will find alternative occupation.
No sane Nation will start conscription to the military, in order to fight for NAZIs in a foreign country.
That leaves only the brainwashed and psychopaths left alone on the battlefield, to be slaughtered.
Russia must know by now, that any negotiations with US, UK, EU, UN, or NATO “leaders” are futile.
Western leaders are puppets of the Global Elite, and under threat by Blackmail.
The real bosses, the Global Elite, don’t care if these provocations end in a nuclear Armageddon. They aim for a Global war with only 500 million human survivors, as they have written on the Georgia Gide stones
Negotiating with such psychopaths is impossible. Besides, their chain of command is ONY WAY only.
So when a order is given it will not be reconsidered and drawn back.
This chain of command secures that the Global Elite are hidden from public view, and free of repercussions.
So only repercussions against the ranks of the Global Elite can make them back down.
As the Global Elite controls a global Fascist network, the problem is not for Russia alone to solve.
Humanity must unite to fight these psychopaths, and opposition must rise from every corner of the Globe.
First the people working for and are protected by the Fascist network must be exposed.
Hack member lists of every secret society in every country and upload them to the internet, comes to mind.
Then address the messengers of the Global Elite: like COVIDduals who are already hated by the public.
When the first is stricken by “bad luck” and people around the world simultaneously raise their flags in joy, the Fascist will get the message.
Members of the Fascist network will reconsider whether the money and status they gain by being a member of the network is worth the risk, and we will see mass “retirements” from their ranks.
Now just exactly how will the breakup of Russia and the plunder of Siberia and the Caspian region “save the US dollar”?? Please explain in detail.
“since the end of WW2”?. Since the day the Republic was installed by the White Supremacists. Since then, destruction, devastation, genocide, aggression, extension, interventions, almost uninterrupted wars.
Agree to an extent. But after WW II – the CIA, Dulles Brother (connected Wall Street Lawyers), Operation Paperclip, Mockingbird, assassinations of Lumumba, Dag Hammarskjoldin, JFK, ….. etc. – the corruption of Bankers, Corporate Power, Mainstream Media, and the Intelligence/Military complex – has their deception and control of their narrative over the American population and an extreme level.
A democracy (constitutional republic) needs a: questioning, critical thinking, and understanding populace to grow and succeed for future generations. When one considers the number of organizations and individuals actively subverting democracy via lies, deceptions, gaslighting, gatekeepers, and the algorithm – where is their moral compass?
The American ignorance and lens is so clouded is it unbelievable. People think I am crazy – I just study and ask questions. When I ask them – “What do you know about World Trade Center – 7?” The blank look in their eyes reveal all.
Thank you “Shaker” and the greater Shaker community. I value the articles and commentary. True freedom fighters fight for individual freedoms and the truth.
“I think the risk is high that the American people are going to be very regretful that they permitted the military/security complex to use the dumbshit Democrats to prevent President Trump from normalizing relations with Russia.”
Yes, but it will be too late. I have tried to expose my community of where this is heading and
they essentially close their ears. They are looking forward to the stimulus checks.
Same here, most Americans are woefully ignorant about geopolitics, the outside world in general and even affairs of a local nature. They are subdued, blinded and intellectually compromised by the two-headed snake of fake media and corrupt governments (local, state & federal) that never serve their interests. Barring a paradigm shift in this state of affairs, there is no hope. Americans may be dim but most are decent people who don’t deserve being manipulated into 3rd world status or worse, total destruction. Where is Frodo and company who can surreptitiously neuter the villainous Mordor, Isengard and their puppet state orcs?
“[reference to govt/msm/brainwashed populace/military]– You are stuck with them, you cannot get rid of them, they are contaminated, they are programmed to think and react to certain stimuli in a certain pattern. You cannot change their mind, even if you expose them to authentic information. Even if you prove that white is white, and black is black. You still cannot change the basic perception and logical behaviour” — “Exposure to true information does not matter anymore. Even if I take [him] by force and show him Soviet concentration camp. [He] will refuse to believe it until he receives a kick in his fat bottom.”
Although Yuri Bezmenov attributed this quote about the Soviets directed to the US, it is equally just as relevant to the Empire of Amerikkka’s attack on their civilian population, globalism, and brainwashing of the entire NATO/UN as well. The US has established that Russia is their mortal enemy and nobody realizes that US policy is the concentration camp. Thus, the next course of action is escalation. Russia kicking the US in their fat bottom is the only way to end this.
I used to get angry that the US can’t be peaceful to Russia, but I just don’t care anymore, the time for peace has ended, and I welcome Russia to fight against the aggresive, fascist, totalitarian united states of amerikkka.
It’s time to humble them.
Agreed.
I want China to violently humble the United Shits as well.
China and Russia must stand together strong against the rogue woke empire.
…..or send them to where Atlantis went?
One has to wonder, though, whether with things as bad and divisive at home, the US would welcome a war with Russia or China?
Actually, the establishment would welcome such clashes – they need all the distraction they could get from the problems at home. If they don’t distract peoples’ minds with even the most idiotic supporter of the current government may start ask the question who’s responsible for the mess at home. And why, instead of solving them, the establishment is pouring billions of dollars into the military-industrial complex.
And, besides, it won’t be the politicos that would do fighting and dying, it would be those naive boys and girls brainwashed to think that they fight for “freedom”.
Maybe we should ask them after they have experienced such a war on US soil? Russia is not planning to fight it on its own soil, that is for sure.
Russia is not planning to fight on US soil, there will be no fighting…………..lots of shit will get blowed up real good, yes, but the only fighting will be Americans fighting for food at the local tip (garbage dump).
Cheers, M
Oh, but they do it all the time! When in trouble at home, start to mess abroad (remember Clinton’s cigar smoking)! But I am afraid, they this time they are trying to eat more than they can chew!
I think the US thinks the nuclear war game can be won. A number of weapons acquisitions suggest this:
Columbia class submarines for entering the Barents Sea
XLUUV undersea vehicles for intercepting Russia’s nuclear torpedos
The LRSO nuclear cruise missile which has already been drilled striking Konigsberg and is designed to bypass S400
The new B21 Raider – Russia is the only nation with an integrated air defense strong enough to justify its creation
First of all, the LRSO does not bypass anything, least of which the S400 nor is it designed to do so. It is part of a conceptualized package along with stealth bomber carriers like the B2 or conceptualized ‘Raider’ which would conceivably do the ‘bypassing’ via their stealth. But the missile itself has no such capability. Secondly, if you read the actual airforce white papers on the LRSO, one of the things they openly state is that the missile is really designed to deal with the S400 in only 2 ways:
1. the fact that it is nuclear would allow the stealth bombers to simply try to “nuke” the s400’s out of existence. This is a laughable solution because this would either start WW3 or is already under the assumption that WW3 is ongoing, at which point all bets are off anyway and Russia would easily win as all their Nuclear forces are vastly superior and in fact Russia is the only country that has a nuclear PENTAD while the U.S. has a measly Nuclear ‘Triad’, as Russia has nuclear Sub forces, ICBM’s, airborn/bombers, nuclear trains and mobile ICBM trucks like the TOPOL-M. Or if you want to combine the trains/ICBM trucks into a ‘ground forces’ as opposed to underground/silo ICBM’s that is 4 nuclear force types while U.S. lacks the above ground (trains/trucks) component.
2. Secondly, the way their whitepapers envision the LRSO possibly penetrating IADs is simply by vectoring their stealth bombers to come in at various random directions as opposed to ICBM’s which come on a predetermined and easily calculable direction. But this of course still presupposes that the ‘stealth’ bomber is actually stealth/invisible to an S400 and we already know Russian radars are capable of picking up stealth. Or it presupposes–if the missile is launched at standoff ranges by B52’s–that the missile itself is stealthy enough to bypass s400 radars and, newsflash–it’s not and no one even in the U.S. airforce is claiming that it is so that’s a no go.
So in short, the LRSO is nothing that new or exciting and in fact is planned to POTENTIALLY come into the force at the minimum in 2030’s by which point the U.S. will probably be a rotting carcass of its former self anyway so this really is no worry. By 2030 Russia will already have the PAKDA and all sorts of other insane goodies that will put the U.S. to shame and be probably 50 years ahead technologically of Uncle Sam.
America is being turned into a fascist oligarchy unless the people fight and fight hard.
Having private corporations influencing voting laws must be fought as these are banana republic style politics.
Citizens United case before Supreme Court created the situation.
Quite why US Voters are so passive. – and MOST do not bother to vote – suggests the system is fully decadent
The U.S. thinks it can win economically. Russia wins a military conflict in Ukraine, Ukraine is in tatters, but that stops Nord stream 2 and allows us to impose a full economic blockade on Russia (starving what’s left of Ukraine in the process). At least that’s the plan.
I wonder what S. Korea and Taiwan will do after they watch the U.S. smoke Ukraine, will they stay in team USA? Nothing says sacrificial lamb louder than watching another one get chopped up. They could choose to side with China rather than allow themselves to be next on the chopping block.
“Let’s give this a moment’s thought. Both Napoleon and Hitler stood at their apogee, their success unmitigated by any military defeat. Then they marched into Russia and were utterly destroyed. Why did they do this?”
I have a different understanding.
Napoleon may have swept the entire Western and Central Europe of sclerotic monarchical systems and impose the civil code, but changing the mentality of these countries would have taken time, and the “restoration” was all but unavoidable. I think Napoleon surmised correctly that only by dismantling the autocratic czarist regime his vision for a modern Europe could hold and not be threatened by any other major power (besides Britain). Impossible then to consider a cohabitation between Napoleonic ideas and strong monarchies.
Hitler had a different problem, but still one incompatible with cohabitation with USSR. His Third Reich needed the vital space and resources not only to feed his fellow Germans but also to keep alive the main economic engine of his system, which was perpetual war. The Third Reich could have never survived without expansion.
Жељко из Крајине,
The Ribentrop-Molotov agreement provided the unlimited resources of USSR to Germany (through trade and joint development). The dumb move of Germany (proded by the masonic structures in the country and British secret service) pushed the axis powers into oblivion.
The Soviets were helping German weapons developments in the Soviet Union years before the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact of 1939. By helping the Germans avoid Versailles restrictions, the Soviets gained much needed technological experience. The Soviets were not stupid enough to give unlimited resources to an Austrian rent boy who’s stated aim was the elimination of Russia. Sure the Soviets sold oil and other products to the Germans, but the US were even bigger suppliers to the Germans, even while WW2 was ongoing. Germany was still receiving shipments of Venezuelan oil right up till 1945, Venezuela being a US run colony back then.
You’d be better off wondering where and what banks were rearming Germany since the early 30s, and how the rent boy managed to get funded by the very people he hated.
“The Ribentrop-Molotov agreement provided the unlimited resources of USSR to Germany”
In return for industrial equipment, plus samples of Bf-109 & FW-190 to test new MiGs, Yaks, & LaGGs against.
Masons & the Brit secret service did not pen this line:
“When we speak of land in Europe today, we can hav in mind primarily only Russia and her vassal border states.”
That was pure Adolf, from the start.
Now I understand why Napoleon made Bavaria a kingdom! :)
a lot of other kingdoms too, in Italy, Spain.
As a commentator as said in one of the open threads,
US is playing poker, and thinks Russia is bluffing.
Russia is playing chess, and thinking many moves ahead.
I would add Lavrov knows the US thinks this a “game” of high stakes poker, so Lavrov has generously showed a few “tells”, and let a few cards slip.
Ie: his visit to China immediately following the US diplomacy debacle with the Chinese in Alaska.
In the world of diplomacy the visit and the timing should have been enough. But to drive the point home, there was that very public show of affection.
In another time, with a smarter geopolitic opponent, that would have been “enough”.
But here we are.
Maria should tweet: chess players don’t bluff. And the best ones have moves to surprise you.
yes – Crimea was such a move.
Another commentator said :American play poker with loaded dice and when their their cheating is exposed they pull the gun and take all. But the cheated pull their guns too.
Now apparently Kiev is linking peace talks to full NATO membership: is this a move to force/tempt Russia to move first? Certainly the intent is making it harder to stall and wait for Kiev’s first strike.
Recent elections in Bulgaria and Kosovo show how EU policy makers by now don’t even bother anymore but just sign off on anglozionist wishlists.
Turkey is trying to pull off a Turkic Union although ironically I understand without Turkmenistan. Erdogan seems now able to blackmail the West on the Ukraine/Black Sea thaetre as well as with immigration waves AND Lybia AND with millions of ethnic Turks in Germany.
And not that Erdogan wouldn’t totally backstab Russia for a golden custom ticket to Europe (that will never come anyways) , but being accepted in the European Sanatorium would disrupt completely any hope of leading the muslim world for the number of compromises that it would require and, besides, Erdogan knows he has better chances just waiting for EU to go either nuked or bankrupt and get some spoils of war out of it.
But he could as well backstab the West and come in as an unavoidable NATO peacemaker in northern Black Sea and get to be the kingmaker in Kiev – that would also mark the one time Erdogan caught doing something actually good for humankind.
I guess Russia wouldn’t mind having EU and NATO helplessly watching as Turkey expands all around the Black Sea and to the Caspian, at the affordable cost, for Moscow, of losing a radioactive and bankrupt market plus some influence in anyways already Turkic areas. AND you get NATO’s wet dreams for Georgia heavily surrounded by armed nationalist muslims with othman imperialist approach to neighbours. Good luck with that.
Erdogan is trickier for eurocronies and US than for Russia, so better have Chinese money
infiltrating Ukraine’s lobbies and Istanbul taking over economically and para-militarily in Ukraine?
That could mean Odessa and Romania as well, seeing increasing Turkish influence, higher weapon sales, further ways in for China and the US unable to extricate a strategy once a NATO member calls for peace-making.
Only reason I think this is ever possible is the prolonged silence of Turkey concerning Ukraine. And if Russia does not complain, there might be a silent pact.
Since Italy, to my shame, prompt vassal as ever, expelled for the usual feudal sacrifice and show of loyalty the ubiquitous Kremlin spies, could that mean Turkey has already unofficially said it won’t allow its bases to attack Donbass or Russian troops? Poland and Romania are given, Bulgaria did its homework all good, Italy does not make sense in this scenario, unless Turkeyand Greece are not up for it.
Where could China step in to sedate this looming conflict? And in such short time. Aside from from the only regionally relevant backdoors left, Hungary and Serbia? That sounds too slow.
If I had to bet, within 2 weeks I would place my money on a massive increase of Russian activity in Syria and specifically with indirect support to Assad, since if Damascus takes back Idlib and Northern Syria, Erdogan’s leverage with Russia decreases while at once Turkey will increase pressure on EU through Lybia and Greece to save its face internally.
At that point, with Idlib lost and the Kurds unbeaten, Turkey will have to focus north and eastwards to see some success.
Another option would be the first global economic crusade against Ukraine and US as soon as the first ukroUS bullet hits a civilian. The Global south would love some heavy reverse sanctioning and that would pave the way to some serious dollar dumping and deal the final blow to US socioeconomy.
Itália tem muito Ouro…
Google translation,MOD:
Italy has a lot of Gold
Hi Tec,
Officially. In fact, it seems like half of the reserves is, like German gold, SOMEWHERE in fort knox. Another chunknof Italy’s gold SHOULD be in Switzerland….
If the Americans have got their hands on that gold, it is gone forever! One of the great lessons of history: never hand your gold over to the Americans “for safekeeping”. They’ll keep it all right!
The British have also a lot of gold of other nations which they have refused to give back when requested…Venezuela is one example…
Trump never had any intention of improving relations with Russia that was nothing but a con game, he put, more sanctions on Russia than anyone before him, Trump surrounded himself in his inter cabinet with the worst of the neocons. Trump was a very good liar and bullshit artist, but that was all, and I see very little difference between the two parties or the party of one.
Correct, and yet for some strange reason, people keep believing Trump’s words, but don’t notice his deeds.
But this is nothing unusual for the political class, regardless of party.
Truth. I once showed that list to a guy on a board who was screaming the “Russian agent” crap and his only response was that this list, with actual actions and dates upon which they were carried out, was “Russian propaganda”. Fact is, the US has been overrun with imbeciles and dolts and that’s why we are where we are.
100% correct, trump failed and the parties are two heads of the same snake.
The Mongol Empire existed during the 13th and 14th centuries and was the largest land empire in history.
The Mongols spread panic ahead of them and induced population displacement on an unprecedented scale.
Mongol domination of the Russian-inhabited territories, along with demands of tribute from Russian princes, continued until about 1480.
The Russians, through the control of the Mongols who had adopted many ideas of government and economics from the Chinese/Mongols, became perhaps a more Asiatic nation in terms of government, while the deep Christian roots of the Russians established and helped maintain a link with Europe. It was the Mongol invasion which, perhaps more than any other historical event, helped to determine the course of development that Russian culture, political geography, history, and national identity would take.
The true successors of the Mongols are the Russians.
Napoleon and Hitler united today’s European Union, had all the advantages in population and economic strength. Nevertheless, they lost.
Napoleon and Hitler both lost to the central bankers.
All wars are bankers wars.
China is succeeding, because they have retained government control over their central bank, that issues their domestic currency without incurring compound interest bearing debt, that then funds their rapid infrastructure growth, also without any real need for taxation of the general populace.
And this is why the banker controlled US has surrounded the periphery of China with military bases.
The question is how can Russia rid the Ukraine of the Nazi menace for a peaceful resolution when the regime is backed by US Zionist hell bent on war. Is there any hope for a peaceful resolution when the empire relentlessly stokes the fire. Pouring more and more weapons in only make things more dangerous as time passes so the Russians are being forced to act sooner rather than latter, this is a bad situation. It is also a ploy to stop Nord 2 and move the focus from Syria. The civilians in Ukraine don’t want war nor do the Russians. Europe wants cheap gas. I think regime change in Ukraine would be the best option, do an anti war colour revolution to remove the Nazis and move all of this outskirt territory back to the Russian sphere. The front line needs to be moved back to Poland and it looks like the empire is forcing the issue. So if war can not be avoided Russia must be decisive and strong and those who fan the flames should feel the fire. How can you have peace with a psychopath at your door, the psychopath has to be pushed back to a safe distance and should never be aloud to linger with malicious intent. A small crises enough to cause regime change best bet otherwise serious smack. I hate the hypocrisy the empire occupies and loots and destroys country after country but Russia can’t protect it’s own people from this world destroying truly evil empire.
The Wehrmacht and Napoleon’s army actually had a string of real victories under their belt before they headed east.
What does the US have? They have failed to regime change Assad, failed with Maduro, failed with Lukaschenko, failed with Erdogan, they are facing a quagmire in Iraq, basically lost the war in Afghanistan, unable to respond to retaliation by Iran (following the assasination of their general) …
The biggest US success story in the past decade has been the 2014 Maidan coup, which is probably why they are gravitating back to Ukraine again, maybe hoping for a reversal of fortune.
The Russians have spelt out for everyone what will happen if the Ukranians go ahead with their death wish.
It is the Americans all by themselves- not the Russians- who have created this lose-lose situation. If they climb down from protecting Ukraine they will lose face, if they give Ukraine the war guarantee then it’s a major war which they cannot win.
To imply the Russians somehow brought this upon themselves by “turning the other cheek” is wrong in my opinion.
You are absolutely right.
If Ukros really start massive military attack on LNDR, it will end in massive military disaster for them.
You could probably say they failed with Navalny (and Lukaschenko too) as he wont be running against Putin while sitting in a penal colony.
Based on everything that has happened, it’s safe to say that Navalny was supposed to “unite” Russia with Nazikraine and Azov.
I do not know why anybody from NATO would be willing to accept eastern ultranationalists, fascists, and nazis as their allies other than to try spread cancer throughout Russia to attempt to defeat them once and for all.
Well done PCR, thank you. Dave Welsh, jdavidweldy@yandex.com When and If I stop by your house, I will make sure to drop off a bag of the finest feline food I can find. (I was also a part of the Reagan Administration as a U.S.P.T.O patent examiner.)
“US Secretary of Defense have given Ukraine a guarantee … Washington wants conflict between Russia and Ukraine, and the purpose of giving the guarantee is to produce conflict.”
Like Uncle $cam gave Saddam Hussein a guarantee that they would not retaliate if he invaded Kuwait. Washington wanted conflict between with Saddam, and the purpose of giving the guarantee was to produce conflict.
President V. Putin has the Russian people, many in the West who trust him and millions of dead victims of imperial wars and a genocidal imposed economic system, all asking for justice.
Just one note (with a sigh):
USA and West is not fascist, for God’s sake. The so called neocons are Zionists. They instigate war and terror to maintain their hold on USA and West generally. Yes, these Zionists are corporate loving people as all major corporates are in their hands.
May I tell you what they are? Thank you.
They are Zionists. From the same group of people, who loved ever so much the Bolshevik Revolution.
They love being called fascists as this works fine because all Russians love to bash “fascists”. And this works well also by creating hatred and animosity between all white countries.
They are also Anti-White. That is their major, and almost only, leading principle, bearing in mind, of course, that Anti-White is one major character of Zionists also.
There are no fascists in the West, if you mean so called “Nazis”, which you do when you bring this card on the table. USA is in the hands of neocon Zionists and if there is a political character it is Extreme Left now, but it is all deception anyway, because their agenda is simply to destroy strong White countries and at the same time make sure that Zionists win in all fronts, politically and economically. Look at USA: it is bankrupt and check carefully, which group has got rich, mega rich, mega mega rich, while people are growing poorer by each day.
War by Deception. Fascists are seen where there are none and the real face of the leaders of The West are not seen even when they are glaring you right into your eyes. Standard deception.
Many Zionists are also white, so the battle is not racist in its nature. It is religious. It is a struggle for total domination. It is everything but racist. Racism is just one of their tools, just like “gender studies”, feminism, open borders, etc…
Even though they are Zionists, they are also Neo-Fascists. Many US policies are very similar to those of National-Socialist Germany. They practicaly stole Germany’s economic model, stole their scientists, stole their media “experts”. The level of arrogance is even beyond NS Germany. So I will call them what they are: Neo-Fascist scumbag Empire.
No, they are not White. They are crypto-white. When it suits them, for example, when they calculate persons in the elite universities, yes, they identify as White, but when it suits them not to be White, they identify as Jews.
You can analyze to the nth degree this, but they are absolutely and categorically Anti-White. Even The Foreign Minister of Russia, Mr. Lavrov, recognizes the Anti-White element.
If you do not agree, please show me just one, only one, influential Zionist, taking the side of White People. You will not find any, not even one. They have dual existence: “American” and Zionist. Do I have to tell you, which side dominates? Will they ever even consider anything else but their own group? Never.
It does not mean, of course, that they would preach this openly. But look at what they are doing to our White Countries. They are annihilating us, we are losing our countries, our people. Our countries are robbed, we are all slaves of the debt. We are living in middle of a catastrophe of low IQ people massing into our countries without any plan to do anything else than multiply – at our cost.
If you believe that it would be different for you in Russia, let me laugh. They will do the same as they have done to USA, rob you blind. And leave you rotting in the debt. In fact, this is one of the reasons you are attacked, you are not yet slaves of the debt. You see, the interest grows without rain. (Old hebrew saying).
The enemy that Russia faces is much more heterogeneous. The Jewish Zionists will lead the charge (Blinken/ Nuland etc) just like they did in ex-Yu (Albright/ Holbrook/ Clark) but other forces have gathered with them: the Latin Christian Neo-Nazis from the north and the Neo-ottoman jihadis from the south.
The enemy we all face.
Yes The Zionist starts the riots, but they are only one part of the imperial Fascist network bound together by corruption and Blackmail.
The global Fascist network is built on the hierarchy controlling the ancient West Roman Empire.
This form of dictatorship run by a plutocracy is Fascism. The named is derived from the Etruscan axe called Fasces. The axe is created by tying many wooden rods together to hold a blade.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fascist_symbolism
I disagree but with due respect, of course.
Let’s talk about fascism. Say Mussolini’s Italy for example. Or National Socialist Germany.
Now there we have a movement supported by peoples of those two countries. Nothing crypto about them, these movements were openly what they said they were. No hiding behind media, no dual identities.
Now tell me, where is this famous “Fascism” now in the West? Name some movements, parties, politicians that are collecting vast amounts of people behind them and showing the Flag, You cannot, there are none.
Then you say that there are some, what, thousands of years old conspiracy consisting from a mysterious group of “fascists”? Well, if there is such a group, name some leaders, please. Or what is the problem? Just names, examples, please.
On the other hand, please ask me to name the Zionists and their various crypto-movements, organizations, medias.
I am more than happy to comply.
“If Washington were reading the situation correctly, would the US Secretary of Defense have given Ukraine a guarantee against Russian intervention if Ukraine”
I am reminded of a similar british “guarantee” to Poland, so “what could go wrong”?
Intergovernmental guarantees are not meant to be suicide pacts. It was UK Prime Minister Neville Chamberlain, on instructions from the privately owned central bankers, who declared war on Germany on 3rd September 1939, that kicked off WW2 thus giving the tacit green light for Hitler to invade the Netherlands, Belgium, France and Norway.
Hitler was printing Germany’s new currency free of debt to put their economy back into gear after the imposition of draconian reparations of the Versailles Treaty in 1919, that had led to mass unemployment and currency inflation that ruined Germany’s economy and the rise of Hitler. This is why the bankers declared war on Germany.
The Russian take over of the Crimea was more or less bloodless, and consolidated by a referendum massively voting in favour of rejoining Russia. That these crucial facts are distorted / ignored / in the West makes it plain that their objectives do not take into account the wishes of the populations of Crimea & the rebel held areas of the Donbas. Being guided solely by geo-political interests does not bode well for the prospects for peace. As for the main war seeking characters in Kiev, the very worst outcome for them personally ( in event of a war between Ukraine & Russia ) is to have to leave a totally chaotic Ukraine & resettle into a comfortable life in either the US or Europe funded by the fruits of their betrayal of decency & humanity.
Remember what Montgomery said : ” First, never, ever, walk on Moscow”.
Since the Poles in 1610, nobody survived in daring that, Swedish, French, Germans and europeans fachists.
However.
However, in Crimea in 1853-56, Anglo-French wan agaisnt Russia. In 1905, Japan wan. In 1914-1917 Germans wan against Russia.
Russia is not invicible, Russia can’t be invaded.
I think that US planner know that.
And they have absolutly no reason ti invide Russia.
They have absolutly no reason to beat Russia military speaking.
In fact they need a Russian clear and terrible victory against Ukraine.
And the they will saber champagne for this wonderfull strategic victory.
I don’t know if US plannerd misread Russian, but I think that PCR in perhaps misreading US agenda.
But there is one chance somewhere about nobody speak: to make a war, you need troops. I’m not sure that Ukies soldiers, even the nazies, will agree to sacrify themselves and their land for allow USA to stop west-trading with Russia.
You can always find some scum to shell civilians, you can find some burnheads and fanatics to attack, but not enough to make a war.
Ukies can accumulate weapons on Frontline I’m not sure at all, that their soldiers are on good moral enough to run an offensive.
In my opinion the “turning the other cheek” and the “Russia must now act kinetically” theories are eye catchers used by writers whose reward necessarily is denominated in attention, call it click baiting if you like. It would implicate that the party who turns the other cheek is aware of its weakness. But Russia is not weak, she knows that she would win a conventional war against NATO in Europe. Let’s not speculate about going nuclear because it just will not happen.
So in reality Russia is always leaving open a door leading out of the increasing confrontation with her crazy opponent.
Turn the other cheek is Judaic Midrash
Jesus was an Orthodox Jew quoting Jewish principles that by turning the other cheek you shamed your opponent
If you notice no Jewish leader did this in the Old Testament
Westerners have debased Christian Theology for convenience
Jesus denounced the old testament and plagiarised fundamentalist branch sect of the older Abiru (eventually Hebrew) their decieptful jealous false god and plagiarised re badged fantasies.. And they like Crucified him yaknow?…they were only referred to as Christkillers for 1800yrs odd in the Christian world, original and sectarian (Greco/Latin) this increasingly common habit of Bundling the ‘synagoge’ and House of Christ old/new Testements is distinctly American and is rather odious I must sa..it seems more than just ‘scohfield syndrom’.. And if it is a mark of the total talmudic perversion of average American understanding of the Gospels… It is alarming and.. Sad.. Jesus was anything but… Orthodox.. You are correct that recent agendas rebadged ‘The Sword of Christ’ in the ‘sectarian realm’ to a ‘hippy pansy’ and gloating zealots love to emasculate the once proud toutonic knights of the realm. But like any deception runs its course. Your whole summary is just…(removed insulting,MOD).. Unless that is the idea?.. Truth is always clear.
didnt polish cavalry stand against panzers in some legendary skirmish? stupid or heroic. depends. theres a few bias versions available to tell the tale.
i live in the pacific region. and its several articles a day about china aggression being run in all media. blah blah. so nice to come here to see the other halfs empire propaganda .
That Polish lancers German tanks meme was Goebbels in a propaganda film I believe.
Let’s not forget when Germany invaded USSR they did so using Renault trucks but actually lots of horses to pull kit. They were not as heavily mechanised as Hollywood illusionists might suggest.
Gee… Take a breath ole son. … Most here share your concerns.. ‘dispair’? Even.. Wider worries and understanding of the gravity..Your insight into actual machinations and behind doors nuances from your past and ability to articulate and share has been invaluable and priceless! As is The Saker and ALL publications on this site Andrei no doubt too, I like him.. Sigh.. None of us.. Don’t know what we don’t know… Our faith and fearless trust in Divine inspiration and ‘living’ intelligence is more crital and important than ever. Faith what is faith?… TRUST TOTAL TRUST WITHOUT PROOF!… The Avatar aprouches within us all..(and things are always closer than they appear in the mirror 😁), many can hear better and deeper than some of us yet.. And act according to God’s will not their own.. Especially in the highest circles right now, And the old adage ‘The devil is just how God appears to the wicked and vile’ could not be more relevant FOR ALL OF US including you…your….. Impatience?.. Is a tad.. Pushy and. Whiny?. And undignified for you Sir. I have followed most of your articles and topics for many years as I have here and elsewhere.. Countless seeds dropped sprouting all over. Ponder that for a mo…. 😊.. Bless you mate you seem sincere.. Thou bit.. Clinical and ‘machine minded’, eg.. The U.S establishment is far from monolithic and singular and more divided than ever in many ways it matter stuff all what Russia does or doesn’t do the U.S is several runaway trains in different directions already.. Your appeal is understandable if not rather repetative.. Hense overegged a tad.. You need to put your focus on your fellow Americans and figure out which train you are on maybe?.. Always mindful that the flesh is a trap and their is much more to our Human.. Being 🙂. I am Australian and share your utter disgust and disdain for the boorish conceited bleeting to our generally fantaztic neighbors.. Even more than you I might add as unlike Americans Proberbly the biggest distinction for us Australians we are not interested in re molding the world in our image (could not think of anything worse generally haha). and our political hostility is totally derivitive of our insecurities without agenda and malice. Or missionary zeal. We are the children of the Godforsaken and example for know one. It is childish and dim-witted of our current crop but I even have faith here. You have correctly identified the Brits steering the American goliath to spiritual squalor it is them you must convince not their arch rival Russia.
Trump did normalize relations with Russia. Like his Republican forebear, Dubya, led by the nose by Cheney, he broke a major nuclear treaty, in Trump’s case, the INF treaty.
Normality for the West is breaking treaties.
He also blamed Russia publicly for poisonings that Russia never did. Trump supporters have remarkable blind spot, rather similar in nature to the ‘peace party’ Democrats. Blaming Russia is normal for both parties. Always has been.
Both parties are blind and both very dangerous. The fact that these people can lie, cheat and steal, whether of the Pompeo version or the Blinken version says a lot.
Recall that WWI was also stumbled into by vain and arrogant elites who had no skin in the game.
Stalin was warned (well, given a lot of conflicting signals) about imminent Nazi invasion but avoided actions that could be considered provocative. This time, the West won’t be nearly as ‘lucky’ as Germany was. It may well fire the first shot but the war will be over a lot sooner than WWII, and Washington will be a black hole where a city used to be.
I would not mistake Russian patience for weakness.
Andrei Martyanov’s response to Dr Roberts’ questions. Very interesting.
A very short summary, but recommended to read it in full.
He considers that Russia will finish this outstanding issue with the Ukraine now (and in Russia’s favor is the underlying message imv).
He also states that Washington does not have the military resources to do anything to Russia in Ukraine.
He states: “… this could turn ugly very fast and this will create a danger of an escalation towards nuclear threshold because the United States cannot win conventionally. ”
He says: “Russia DOES possess escalation dominance …”
He also disagrees that Trump really wanted to improve relations with Russia. (This was my perspective as well.)
There is more scary stuff .. Read it here: http://smoothiex12.blogspot.com/2021/04/paul-craig-roberts-asks-question-of.html
We will most probably see a response from The Saker as well, at least I hope so.
Re nuclear escalation, the only thing that reassures me at this stage is that the US has a track-record of ditching allies (Kurds, Georgians etc). If they walk away from the Ukrainians, NATO would still be intact.
While I agree with most of what Martyanov wrote, I disagree about Trump. Trump was no “reverse” Nixon, nor was he a messianic zealot, precisely the reason he was neutralised and run out of town so quickly.
There won’t be a war at least until Putin’s speech on 21st of April. It is expected that President Putin announce a new era of international relations.
The Neo-Fascist Empire is waiting and amassing troops at the border with Russia. It takes time, and Russia just threw them the glove in their faces. Compared to the Neo-Fascists, Russia knows the meaning of hounorable combat.
Some while ago I posted here that I supported a Biden win in the election as it would promote the inevitable decline of the empire more rapidly and with less fallout than a Trump win. This I believe is now happening both internally and externally. At this point the big external question is ‘will the US be convinced that Russia is to be believed without the use of a nuclear strike?’
Many here are arguing that various sections of the US will believe and others will not as well as all those with financial problems that do not care. In this case what should be the consideration of Russia? Paul Craig Roberts is correct in postulating that ‘time’ is crucial and were Trump in power that might not be so. Yet he is not and the situation needs confronting while Biden is weak. I believe a controlled nuclear ‘demonstration’ with the promoted support of both China and Russia needs immediate consideration in that it may prevent a larger one later. Whatever happens the empire will dissolve it just depends on the sum of the collateral damage.
Two-part comment — the first part to a Saker open thread a couple of days ago. Then to PCR’s.
“What will the Empire do to support the Ukronazis?”
Because Russia takes no concrete action against it, it is near certain that Washington and its drone-nations will continue, literally forever, to build up military resources in Ukraine (and in its other drone-nations) using printed-out-of-thin-air USD to pay for everything. After all, what’s the down side?
As long as the USD is the de facto world reserve currency, and nations outside of the US continue to accept them as payment for their REAL stuff, the Fed will continue to “borrow” them from unborn future taxpayers knowing full well that that those future US taxpayers will NEVER be able to pay back the debt to whoever holds it. (Anyone else see a problem with this arrangement?)
Second, IMO, there’s a very good possibility that DC will order its drone-nation “Ukraine” to conduct more and more serious “probing” actions in small, specific areas along the contact line, solely in order to provoke Russia into responding militarily, NOT to acquire control over new area. Then, after Russia’s response, there could be an instantaneous pull-back by US (“Ukrainian”) forces to the status quo ante. (This is Russia’s Judgment Day against Terminator Nation.)
As soon as Russia responds, the western MSM and drone-nation US-slave-leaders will all shout with one unified voice “Russian aggression”, etc. And then there will be calls for shutting down NS2, literally blockading Russia and banning anything Russian, and probably finally getting rid of RT and Sputnik in “the west”, etc.
The West will erect a new Berlin Wall or Iron Curtain around Russia and, if it is wise, Russia will take this opportunity to develop a truly go-it-alone economy, as all nations should. This is the point at which capitalism in Russia might reveal itself to be economically/politically unsustainable, although some arrangement between Russian and Chinese oligarchs may keep Russia’s on life-support. (Japanese capitalism has been on life-support for the past 30+ years. Only with ouside help — the post-Emergency Economic Stabilization Act “circle-jerk” between western central banks — has it survived.)
Now to PCR’s article.
“Washington Is Misreading Russia at the World’s Peril”
We are about to find out if “Washington” and its drone-nations are, or, more importantly, have been since even before their successful coup in Ukraine, “misreading Russia”.
Russia had the opportunity to much more actively intervene in the events both before and after the coup. I believe using very little military and intelligence forces, the coup could have been quashed and a more pro-Russian government installed. There would have been some internal Ukrainian “resistance”, but it could have been controlled. Mr. Putin and Mr. Lavrov chose not to do that for what they thought were good reasons, but which present circumstances may soon prove to be fatally flawed.
But that was then and this is now, so how might Russia most effectively respond to the beginnings of the scenario I described in my first comment above?
When the US (“Ukrainian”) military does its probing and, after Russia initially responds, pulls back to the status quo ante, Russian forces and resources must do what they should have done before, during and after the Maidan coup — destroy any remaining US (“Ukrainian”) military and para-military and private-military and downright gangster-military forces in “Ukraine”. After that, install a new, pro-Russian government in Kiev.
At least this way when “the West” builds the wall or raises the new Iron Curtain, all of Ukraine will again be part of Russia and not be used as a drone-nation against Russia as it is now, and will certainly be, if it is not part of Russia.
Unfortunately, after re-absorbing Ukraine, ruthlessness in dealing with western assets in both Russia and Ukraine will be necessary to maintain Russian sovereignty in both — the same way “the West” uses ruthlessness in dealing with dissenters in their own empire.
Excellent analysis IMO. That least sentence is especially on target. The US really wants to see Putin to bare his fangs for the propaganda value supporting all the predictions you made earlier about ring fencing Russia and making it a global pariah state – essentially Cold War II on steroids. The US is playing a passive aggressive game here by proxy, since it doesn’t have the strength to directly threaten Russia militarily and is likely not yet ready to play the nuclear card. US and EU taxpayers have not yet been milked completely dry, so the game will continue for a little while longer yet. Putin can’t retain power and/or live forever – something they perhaps vainly hope this event will hasten – so the long game dictates that they wait for that event at least before going completely all in.
we live in interesting times ,what with ‘woke’ cola trend being foisted on the guile residents of the now certified gulag, formerly masquerading as the ‘land of the free and the home of the brave’, while the trump hordes hoping evil putin will slap down their deep state.
a bust up is inevitable as time line demands it, either embrace the changes or go into the night seems to be the universal demand.
imagine the past time line ,when the rifle replaced the sword which led to britain an isolated island, becoming the empire at that particular time, now it is much more factors intertwined.,…fosil Energy,Currency,Weapon system where russia leads now…we can game it to see how it all ends up, but humanity has never found a system that gives total peace and security for all, just a pause in an unending blood letting…so let the dice roll and munch on more pop corns……
Talk about a WTF?!?! moment:”
https://www.rt.com/russia/520365-eastern-military-bloc-nato-compete/
Fanning the flames of war between Russia and Ukraine is not the same as getting involved themselves. The US Democrats are not stupid; for them, any outcome of this war is good as it would weaken Russia one way or the other.
The Biden ‘Pretendency’ is very weak. It may not be able to get the generals to start a war with Russia. After all, that would seriously interfere with their golf schedules, and the firms whose boards they wish to join might not exist tomorrow!
Much better from the point of view of dissident generals (and the rest of the world) would be a tragic accident which terminated Zombie Joe, and left Harris and Pelosi fatally injured. (See how dangerous covid really is, keep wearing your masks.)
The public would be reassured that their alert defenders are watching over them, and they surely won’t allow anything bad to happen, whilst the remaining political pygmies continue their silly squabbles.
“Washington wants conflict between Russia and Ukraine, and the purpose of giving the guarantee is to produce conflict.”
This is the key. With Hillary in charge this would have already happened four years ago. The Americans want Russia weakened and will do anything to create regional havoc to divert resources and effort. I do not think they want total war but they do need another enemy for the narrative. China benefits too as a proxy.
“I think the risk is high that the American people are going to be very regretful that they permitted the military/security complex to use the dumbshit Democrats to prevent President Trump from normalizing relations with Russia”.
My anecdotal observation is that the American people were forced. The Russia hatred is in the ruling class here, backed up by phony “polls”. Voters here keep trying to vote for peace, but the promises are always broken. See Trump’s performance in the South Carolina primary 5 years ago, where he ripped the useless wars and scored a resounding victory where about 1/3 of the electorate were military veterans. The establishment thought he dug his own grave, but they miscalculated.
On a side note, I think Mr. Robert’s criticisms of Russian reactions to western aggression are to harsh and basically “blaming the victim”. However, his analysis that the Russians need to stand their ground here to preserve their country, sovereignty and way of life is basically correct. This would obviously not just benefit Russians, but westerners living under the oppressive oligarchy as well.
Listen y’all. This is a fight for “I told you so”. “Russia bad”. The minute Rus makes one unprovoked move it will be blanket media coverage. They will put pressure on Muti to explain “how” NS II can proceed.
If I’m VVP I watch every move because they’ve deliberately painted a bull’s eye on his back.
Even Jesus agreed that a human has only TWO cheeks
I love Paul Craig Roberts.
“Nevertheless, I think the risk is high that the American people are going to be very regretful that they permitted the military/security complex to use the dumbshit Democrats to prevent President Trump from normalizing relations with Russia?”
INDEED. The American people are not known for their self awareness or brilliance. What they put into power is really a reflection of them.
This does not bode well for Americans and their future. It is honestly difficult for me not to want to slap them silly when they RUSSIA! RUSSIA! RUSSIA! everything. These are Democrat voting dolts.
I think the only thing that will wake this country up is a good Russian slap in the face and we may well see such a thing come to fruition! I have a friend who just moved to Russia and she LOVES it there.
I may have to seek asylum myself!
Frankly speaking, as an American, I do not appreciate Paul Craig Robert’s view that Putin and Russian’s in high command appear weak, politically and diplomatically.
PCR is an economist, not an historian, nor a geo-political expert on this matter.
He’s way out of line.